Blue Sea Add a Battery

[poconojoe]

And you missed the point entirely. The point is if you have a fault and you have a short circuit in the wiring feeding the lamp within that cord plugged into the outlet, even if it has a 16awg wire feeding it, it will still blow the 20A or 15A circuit breaker without the rest of the wiring melting.

Completely true. A short would trip the breaker.

Funny thing though, I've seen on more than one occasion a short bypassing a local breaker in an electrical closet on an upper floor and blowing a main fuse all the way down in the building's basement. Electricity can be a funny unpredictable thing.

 

[Bob Sander]

It doesn't matter where you plug the lamp in as long as you use the lamp properly. The lamp was manufactured according to the wattage limit of the fixture, including its cord. There is no fuse in the lamp.

That is an interesting point on the lamp cord and I once asked an electrical inspector about that. Interestingly enough he was in the process of giving us a pile of mouth for running a flat screen tv cord inside a wall after hanging the tv

Lamp cord can handle 15 amps, but it can get quite warm before the breaker pops. The inspector said that it's okay so long as the lamp cord (tv cord or extension cord as the case may be), is kept exposed and open to the atmosphere. It can not be run under carpets, stapled to walls... or other such normal things that average homeowners tend to do with them.... and as I found out of course... you can't run them in walls either!

 

[bruceb58]

My background is a retired I.B.E.W. union electrician. New York City, Local union #3. And you?

Over 30 years as an EE including electric vehicles and automotive electronics...used to work for GM

let me say, I had a feeling you were an electrician...doesn't surprise me one bit what you are saying. Had to fix more than one electrician's goof ups.

And yes, the thread was hijacked back on page 1. Bottom line, he doesn't need the fuses if the wires going to and from the ACR are not near a ground.

 

[poconojoe]

That is an interesting point on the lamp cord and I once asked an electrical inspector about that. Interestingly enough he was in the process of giving us a pile of mouth for running a flat screen tv cord inside a wall after hanging the tv

Lamp cord can handle 15 amps, but it can get quite warm before the breaker pops. The inspector said that it's okay so long as the lamp cord (tv cord or extension cord as the case may be), is kept exposed and open to the atmosphere. It can not be run under carpets, stapled to walls... or other such normal things that average homeowners tend to do with them.... and as I found out of course... you can't run them in walls either!

Yes, never run an extension cord, lamp cord, tv cord or similar under a carpet or through walls. They need to be in free air to prevent heat buildup, but they also don't have the proper insulation to withstand physical damage.

Have you ever noticed your home's outlets are no further apart than 12 feet? That's code.
That's because they don't want you to use an extension cord longer than 6 feet or plug two extension cords together to reach further. Those small household extension cords that resemble a lamp cord come no longer thsn 6 feet.

Insulation type is a whole other subject too.
The ampacity of a wire with THHN insulation can handle more amperage than a wire covered with plain old TW insulation. Wiring inside light fixtures have to have the proper insulation too, THWN. They have to be able to withstand the heat in a confined fixture housing.
So, it's not just the wire size, but the insulation type is also very important.

 

[poconojoe]

Over 30 years as an EE including electric vehicles and automotive electronics...used to work for GM

let me say, I had a feeling you were an electrician...doesn't surprise me one bit what you are saying. Had to fix more than one electrician's goof ups.

And yes, the thread was hijacked back on page 1. Bottom line, he doesn't need the fuses if the wires going to and from the ACR are not near a ground.

Fixing electrician's goof ups? That statement is uncalled for. I was trying to be informative and nice.

Back on subject:
Look at the Blue Sea diagram. It shows the fuses. In case you didn't know...It's those little squiggly lines in the circuit with the two dots mister EE.

IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH BEING NEAR ANY GROUND. Why would you even think that? That's embarrassing.

Don't cheap out. Install the fuses.

 

[bruceb58]

Stick to your own profession, whatever that may be.

Fixing electrician's goof ups? That statement is uncalled for. I was trying to be informative and nice.

Just following your lead.

 

[bruceb58]

IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH BEING NEAR ANY GROUND. Why would you even think that? That's embarrassing.

Don't cheap out. Install the fuses.

Yeah...that's why Cobalt didn't install fuses.

Have you ever even used an ACR? There are many ACRs out there that say nothing about putting in fuses.

Out of curiosity, what do you think you are actually protecting with the fuses? Do you have fuses on your battery to starter cable?

Adding fuses may be necessary but if you do what Cobalt did and install it right next to the battery switch...absolutely no fuses necessary.

 

[bradb]

Yeah...that's why Cobalt didn't install fuses.

Have you ever even used an ACR? There are many ACRs out there that say nothing about putting in fuses.

Out of curiosity, what do you think you are actually protecting with the fuses? Do you have fuses on your battery to starter cable?

Adding fuses may be necessary but if you do what Cobalt did and install it right next to the battery switch...absolutely no fuses necessary.

Couldn't agree more.

BTW...also an EE

 

[poconojoe]

Yeah...that's why Cobalt didn't install fuses.

Have you ever even used an ACR? There are many ACRs out there that say nothing about putting in fuses.

Out of curiosity, what do you think you are actually protecting with the fuses? Do you have fuses on your battery to starter cable?

Adding fuses may be necessary but if you do what Cobalt did and install it right next to the battery switch...absolutely no fuses necessary.

I dont know why your boat's ACR wasn't installed with fuses. I'm guessing it was installed by the dealer, not the boat manufacturer.

I installed mine with the fuses, according to Blue Sea. Why cheap out?

 

[bradb]

If you go strictly by ABYC standard, you put a fuse within 7" of the source of the power. With an ACR wired right next to the switch itself, you are only protecting the short piece of wire between the switch and the ACR since the battery cables themselves aren't fused.

I also use a Blue Sea Add a battery kit, the wire lengths are so short, it's pretty pointless to put fuses on it. If I was running it 3 feet from each battery, I might do it but that would be kinda silly when you can just wire to the switch itself.

 

[bruceb58]

I dont know why your boat's ACR wasn't installed with fuses. I'm guessing it was installed by the dealer, not the boat manufacturer.

I installed mine with the fuses, according to Blue Sea. Why cheap out?

It was the factory option listed on the "window sticker".

 

[bradb]

I dont know why your boat's ACR wasn't installed with fuses. I'm guessing it was installed by the dealer, not the boat manufacturer.

I installed mine with the fuses, according to Blue Sea. Why cheap out?

So how long are the cables between your ACR and the battery or switch?

Mine are around a foot each? You really think I should put a fuse half way across that wire?

Does your alternator have a fuse at it's output? My guess is not!

 

[poconojoe]

So how long are the cables between your ACR and the battery or switch?

Mine are around a foot each? You really think I should put a fuse half way across that wire?

Does your alternator have a fuse at it's output? My guess is not!

The cables from my batteries to the ACR are around 18 inches long.

The cables from my ACR to the battery switch are somewhere between 30-36 inches long.

The instructions from Blue Sea recommend installing fuses. They even have a chart for sizing the fuses. I linked the website below.

If you opt to use fuses, you can buy the fuse holders that mount directly on the battery terminals. Makes for a clean and easy installation and you won't have to worry about mounting the fuse holders elsewhere.

This is from Blue Sea's website: https://www.bluesea.com/resources/170/Battery_Management_Wiring_Schematics_for_Typical_Applications

 

[bradb]

If you opt to use fuses, you can buy the fuse holders that mount directly on the battery terminals. Makes for a clean and easy installation and you won't have to worry about mounting the fuse holders elsewhere.

I wire directly to the switch to the ACR like apparently Bruce's is. You can't mount those types of fuses directly on the switch if you have it mounted onto a wall like I do. It would be pretty much worthless to have a fuse there.

So...you didn't answer my question...you have a fuse from the output of your alternator?

Why do you have cables go from both the switch to the ACR and ACR to the batteries...you do one or the other.

Also, have you looked other diagrams for battery combiners like BluSea has? I have yet to see one that recommends fuses.

 

[sam am I]

 

[poconojoe]

I wire directly to the switch to the ACR like apparently Bruce's is. You can't mount those types of fuses directly on the switch if you have it mounted onto a wall like I do. It would be pretty much worthless to have a fuse there.

So...you didn't answer my question...you have a fuse from the output of your alternator?

Why do you have cables go from both the switch to the ACR and ACR to the batteries...you do one or the other.

I emailed Blue Sea for an explanation to settle this discussion. When someone gets back to me, I will let you know, regardless if I'm right or wrong about the need for fuses.

 

[bradb]

I emailed Blue Sea for an explanation to settle this discussion. When someone gets back to me, I will let you know, regardless if I'm right or wrong about the need for fuses.

I can already tell you what they are going to say.

I will email the other 5 battery combiner manufacturers and see what they say..deal?

 

[poconojoe]

Why do you have cables go from both the switch to the ACR and ACR to the batteries...you do one or the other.

The ACR is basically wired in parallel with the wires that go from each battery to the battery switch.

I used terminal blocks so I wouldn't have a bunch of wires directly connected to the battery terminals.

 

[GA_Boater]

Closed this argument.