Any pilots that actually KNOW?

bruceb58

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

It's a theory...just not a very likely one.
 

JustJason

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

What I don't understand is 2 very simple things.

1. Why is it airplanes do not have "hijack" buttons. And by that I mean a hidden (or even in plain sight) button that can not be hit by accident. But once hit it sends out an emergency SOS over all frequencies. AM/FM/Shortwave/SAT ect ect. It would trump the transponder, and always consistently broadcasts it's position once its hit. And it can not be turned off once hit. If you wanted to get real fancy, it could even turn on cockpit microphones in live time. Seems like it would be such a small thing. And I know the whole cost/benefit thing. But how much, 5k to 10K a plane in parts? Plus another 10K in installation costs? Seems trivial. Banks have emergency alarm buttons when they are getting robbed, how come an airplane does not have the same thing?

2. Epirbs..... Do commercial craft not have Epirbs? Or 2 or 3 or 4 of them on board in the hopes that 1 of them activates in an emergency crash.... Again seems silly that they don't have them. I mean, I have one, and I am just 1 guy boating in the gulf.....

This plane could have been found last week if it had the above technology.
 
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rbh

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

What I don't understand is 2 very simple things.

1. Why is it airplanes do not have "hijack" buttons. And by that I mean a hidden (or even in plain sight) button that can not be hit by accident. But once hit it sends out an emergency SOS over all frequencies. AM/FM/Shortwave/SAT ect ect. It would trump the transponder, and always consistently broadcasts it's position once its hit. And it can not be turned off once hit. If you wanted to get real fancy, it could even turn on cockpit microphones in live time. Seems like it would be such a small thing. And I know the whole cost/benefit thing. But how much, 5k to 10K a plane in parts? Plus another 10K in installation costs? Seems trivial. Banks have emergency alarm buttons when they are getting robbed, how come an airplane does not have the same thing?

2. Epirbs..... Do commercial craft not have Epirbs? Or 2 or 3 or 4 of them on board in the hopes that 1 of them activates in an emergency crash.... Again seems silly that they don't have them. I mean, I have one, and I am just 1 guy boating in the gulf.....

This plane could have been found last week if it had the above technology.

From what I heard yesterday there is a 4 digit code+- they can punch in for just that issue.
 

MTboatguy

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

It's a theory...just not a very likely one.

It has happened before Bruce, I don't think it is so unlikely and with no evidence of a crash, it is becoming more and more likely.
 

bruceb58

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

I love when these news reporters do these theories. The is a freaking jumbo jet, not a Cessna 172.
 

bruceb58

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

It has happened before Bruce, I don't think it is so unlikely and with no evidence of a crash, it is becoming more and more likely.
Would love to know what that incident was.
 

bruceb58

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

Quoting the article

Aviation experts say it's possible, if highly unlikely, that someone could have hijacked and landed the giant Boeing 777 undetected.

If its on land somewhere, it crash landed.
 

southkogs

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

I love when these news reporters do these theories. The is a freaking jumbo jet, not a Cessna 172.
Point well taken ... while the theory is becoming more likely, that's really only bringing into the "rather possible" realm. There are at least 260-some-odd "problems" that need to be accounted for in a hijacking type of theory. It's hard to make that many people do what you want, even if there are several of you on board.

If it turns out not to be a crash, it will have been an incredibly ambitious project.
 

JustJason

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

rbh said:
From what I heard yesterday there is a 4 digit code+- they can punch in for just that issue.

Your probably correct, and that might be the case. But if guns are going off, if somebody gets in the cockpit quickly, if it's just the copilot half asleep watching the autopilot while the captains in the john... what is the point of a "4 digit code"? It would take to long to punch it, and that's if you can remember in time. What I'm saying is 1 button. Hit the 1 button and that's it. The plane goes into emergency mode. From what I understand as well, the existing transponders can be turned off. On an active flight I don't see why a transponder would ever need to be, or would have the function to, be turned off. But even if that's the case, the "button" would over ride that, and could not be turned off, no matter what.

I know there is not that many hijackings every year, and statistically it is an anomaly, but it seems like it is something that could be done, and it would not be all that hard to do. That and I find it funny that we can put men on the moon, remote control SUV's on Mars, satellites landing on Titan, and more satellites that are basically outside of our known solar system... But we can't find 1 missing plane... especially when we have the technology to? It just baffles me.
 
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rbh

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

Speculations running rampant, now it could be the batteries.

(CNNs all over this, but I doubt they could even find where's Waldo.)
 

WIMUSKY

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

Quoting the article



If its on land somewhere, it crash landed.

Would have to agree. Otherwise, with all the electronic devices people have nowadays, word would be out they landed(somewhere).............
 

Bigprairie1

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

(I can almost hear the beginning of the James Bond theme playing while this search goes on)

Its certainly, possible that it was redirected...and emerging communication and tracking info seems to be showing that it drastically changed course for some reason.
Here is one that disappeared and apparently wasn't found, not all that long ago:
2003 Boeing 727-223 disappearance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


BP
 
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MTboatguy

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

Definitely makes you want to say...............Hmmmmmmmm
 

Bullrider

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

The crash of TWA800 (747) in 1996 was shot down. I personally know people who saw it happen before the media sterilized the reports.
I was part of the crew crawling through every 747 fuel tank in the factory checking for proper grounding to prove it was not the cause.
The media to this day tells the world what did NOT happen until everyone believes them.

I think that is what is going on now with the 777 crash. Even when the "truth" comes out on the 777 issue I believe we wont know the "REAL truth" for a long time...
 

MTboatguy

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

I have been retired since 2006, but I can tell you, our spy equipment has far more capabilities that any of us will ever know!

Some of the stuff I was privy to when I worked in the Pentagon was absolutely amazing!
 

KD4UPL

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

What I don't understand is 2 very simple things.

1. Why is it airplanes do not have "hijack" buttons. And by that I mean a hidden (or even in plain sight) button that can not be hit by accident. But once hit it sends out an emergency SOS over all frequencies. AM/FM/Shortwave/SAT ect ect. It would trump the transponder, and always consistently broadcasts it's position once its hit. And it can not be turned off once hit. If you wanted to get real fancy, it could even turn on cockpit microphones in live time. Seems like it would be such a small thing. And I know the whole cost/benefit thing. But how much, 5k to 10K a plane in parts? Plus another 10K in installation costs? Seems trivial. Banks have emergency alarm buttons when they are getting robbed, how come an airplane does not have the same thing?

2. Epirbs..... Do commercial craft not have Epirbs? Or 2 or 3 or 4 of them on board in the hopes that 1 of them activates in an emergency crash.... Again seems silly that they don't have them. I mean, I have one, and I am just 1 guy boating in the gulf.....

This plane could have been found last week if it had the above technology.

No matter what system you install it can always be turned off. No matter how sophisticated it is it's no match for wire cutters. Anyone who wants to disable whatever hijack alarm can do so if they know what they're doing. Simply pulling the right fuse or cutting the right wire is quick and easy.
I'm not suggesting the pilots did anything on purpose. I have no idea. But, I read that the pilot had a complete 777 simulator in his house with computer monitors and wires everywhere. He was an "avionics geek" who knew the plane very well. I'm pretty sure if it had a hijack alarm he would know which circuit breaker turned it off.
 

four winns 214

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

The crash of TWA800 (747) in 1996 was shot down. I personally know people who saw it happen before the media sterilized the reports.

Who are these people? Where were they and exactly how did they witness this shoot down? Please be specific.
 

four winns 214

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Re: Any pilots that actually KNOW?

I am qualified on a large aircraft (not the 777) and fly overwater routes in both the Atlantic and Pacific regions (mostly the Atlantic by choice). The 777 is a big airplane, but it's a mere speck compared to an ocean.

I'll try to answer a few of the questions posed in this thread.

1) Radar. It's good out to about 160 miles or so for an aircraft at 35,000'. Its distance capability decreases with altitude. At 500', it's good for about 20 miles, depending on antenna site and other factors. Those figures are for an aircraft equipped with an operating transponder. For "skin painting", those figures would probably be somewhat less. I just really don't know because I have no experience with such and hope to never gain it!

2) Transponder. It really doesn't have an "off" position. It is placed in "standby" which has much the same effect. There is a circuit breaker for it on my aircraft. Wire cutters would be useless to disable it. There are no wires accessible.

3) ACARS. Aircraft Communication Addressing and Reporting System. The best analogy I can draw for a layman about what ACARS does and how it operates is "text messaging". It communicates with the ground via VHF or HF radios or via Sat Comm. In my operation, we communicate with flight ops, get weather reports, receive ATC route clearances on the ground and oceanic clearances airborne prior to making an Atlantic crossing. ACARS on my aircraft also makes use of a utility called a Digital Flight Data Aquisition Unit (DFDAU). It's a system intalled on the aircraft that collects myriad performance parameters and sends them to our company automatically on a periodic, but not continuous, basis via ACARS. I'm certain the 777 had ACARS and DFDAU. I don't know the specifics of its operation.

This incident certainly is a mystery.
 
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