1990 Evinrude 60 Rough Idle and Bogging

[Jkelley429]

Just picked up a 93 Tracker Pro 17 with a 1990 Evinrude 60 (VE60TLESM) on the back. Power Pack and carbs look brand new, VRO abandoned. Previous owner stated that the engine would idle fine but would die when put into gear. When I got it home I adjusted the link and sync, replaced plugs (Champion QL77JC4), replaced LU oil, and replaced the hose/valve portion of the primer solenoid (due to a broken hose fitting).

First time on the water it was idling too low but went into gear and ran fine with some low RPM hesitation. I have since raised the idle (1,000 on muffs/800 in water) and replaced the fuel pump with a non-VRO pump and replaced the fuel filter.

The last few times I have had it out it runs great at mid-full throttle but has issues below that. It will barely run below half throttle in gear (shakes bad, bogs, and hesitates) unless I briefly hit the primer on the key switch which allows it to run good for about 10 seconds and then it starts bogging again or stalls out completely. It idles and revs a little rough on the muffs/in a tank but nothing like in the water.

The following process happens when I try to get on plane:
1. Gun the throttle to 3/4+.
2. Engine bogs and drops RPM
3. Tap the primer switch 1-2 times.
4. Motor revs up and takes off like a scalded dog.
5. Runs at high RPM flawlessly (I've run it continuously at high RPM for 10-15 minutes straight with no issue.)
6. Back off the throttle to below 1/2 and it either bogs or stalls out completely.

I'm at a loss at this point as to what it could be. Compression is 100 across the board, idle mixture set at 2 turns out, plugs gapped to .03, link and sync set according to manual, fresh gas with good 2 stroke oil.

Any ideas what could be causing this? I haven't torn into the carbs as they appear to have been cleaned/replaced recently but I guess that should be my next step.

Thanks in advance.

 

[juno pierrat]

take the first step, with carb kits, the one core plug i'd remove is on top, poke a wire thru all holes, i use a welders torch tip cleaner, don't mix carbs , do one at a time, top-middle-bottom

 

[jakedaawg]

Is get a different compression guage. Thats low.

Clean the carbs.

 

[racerone]

In the grand scheme of things head gaskets are cheap.------Pull it off and have a look in there.

 

[Jkelley429]

According to the seller (who had pictures to "prove it") the compression tested at 120 on all 3 cylinders a few days before I bought it. I was thinking 100 was low, I will try another compression tester. I will say though, it looks like there is a good amount of carbon on top of the pistons so maybe a decarb is in order as well.

Could the issue I described be due to low compression or does it most likely sound like a carb issue? I've narrowed down everything else I can think of. The main thing that confuses me is why it would run perfectly at high RPM (easily runs 35mph at 5500 RPM, gets on plane within seconds even with 3 people on board) but fall on its face at idle-low RPM. Maybe low speed jets are clogged?

 

[racerone]

Does the hose for the water pump indicator come off the side of the block or the top ?-----Did you install the latest water pump kit with cooling system modification instructions ?----In post #1 you say it idles fine in neutral but dies when you put it in gear.----To me that may mean there is something wrong with idle !!

 

[Jkelley429]

The hose comes of the side of the block, so that will eventually need to be relocated per the TSB.

That was the issue as the seller described it, I have not experienced that. It will idle in neutral just fine, once in gear at idle it shakes and stumbles but still runs. Idle speed is not an issue.

The problem I am experiencing is when adding throttle to gain speed it will not rev up unless "assisted" by tapping the primer switch briefly. Between idle and mid-throttle it requires tapping the primer every 10 seconds or so to keep from stalling out, above half throttle it only requires tapping the primer once to get it going and it runs fine from then on.

 

[racerone]

The service bulletin came out in 1994 to move the hose !-----More trouble shooting needs to be done to find out what is wrong.----Might as well clean the carburetors again.----Sometimes it takes 3 times to get them working right.

 

[Jkelley429]

I am aware of the TSB being released in 1994. I just acquired the boat/motor a month ago and was surprised myself to see that the relocation had not been done.

Do you have any other troubleshooting methods you suggest? I have exhausted all of my known options except for tearing into the carbs. Could it be potentially related to another system or can it be reasonably assumed that only a carb issue would cause this? Obviously the symptoms seem to indicate a lean condition since adding additional fuel resolves the problem, but it seems more involved than that.

 

[jakedaawg]

I would clean the carbs. I would beg borrow or steal a compression guage not made in China. Good old north American. I would compression test first.

 

[ct1762@gmail.com]

i will say those motors seem to like 2.5-3.5 turns out, but thats just my observation. the motor is clearly running lean... i wouldn't run it like that at all until the carbs have been gone through. the primer is the same as squirting extra fuel into the carbs with a spray bottle. if it picks up, its running lean. did you test the cylinder head temp with a gun?

 

[appleo]

Are you losing prime of the fuel bulb? Does a few squeezes of the primer bulb remedy the issue? Maybe a air leak in fuel feed

 

[Jkelley429]

I would clean the carbs. I would beg borrow or steal a compression gauge not made in China. Good old north American. I would compression test first.

I have another compression gauge I can use so I'll start there.

i will say those motors seem to like 2.5-3.5 turns out, but thats just my observation. the motor is clearly running lean... i wouldn't run it like that at all until the carbs have been gone through. the primer is the same as squirting extra fuel into the carbs with a spray bottle. if it picks up, its running lean. did you test the cylinder head temp with a gun?

I've tried messing with the low speed jet setting a little and it hasn't seemed to help, not sure I've gone as far as 3.5 turns out though so I'll give it a shot. I haven't checked the cylinder head temp specifically but I will say that after running it at WOT for 15 minutes the water jacket cover and head are only slightly warm, I can hold my hand on it indefinitely and not burn myself.

Are you losing prime of the fuel bulb? Does a few squeezes of the primer bulb remedy the issue? Maybe a air leak in fuel feed

After replacing the fuel pump a few weeks ago it was losing prime, but that was determined to be a loose hose clamp on the pulse line and has been resolved. I've never been able to get it solid like I would expect, maybe 80% of the way no matter how much you prime (with both the old fuel pump and new). No fuel is running out of the carbs with extended priming though and it looks like no additional fuel is being drawn into the filter (before the primer bulb). I have checked all the usual suspects (loose clamps, tank vent, etc.).

 

[jakedaawg]

I have another compression gauge I can use so I'll


After replacing the fuel pump a few weeks ago it was losing prime, but that was determined to be a loose hose clamp on the pulse line and has been resolved. I've never been able to get it solid like I would expect, maybe 80% of the way no matter how much you prime (with both the old fuel pump and new). No fuel is running out of the carbs with extended priming though and it looks like no additional fuel is being drawn into the filter (before the primer bulb). I have checked all the usual suspects (loose clamps, tank vent, etc.).

Misread, sorry

 

[Jkelley429]

Finally got around to working on this motor again. Checked the compression with a new guage and it is reading 115-120 on all cylinders. Also checked the low speed jets and loosened an additional 1/2 turn to 2 3/4.

Took the boat out for duck season opener this past weekend and it ran better at low throttle non-planing speeds but still required frequently activating the primer to get it going and keep it from bogging. Voltage guage was reading about 16 volts at WOT so thats something I'll have to sort out as well. Also noticed while loading up that a few teaspoons worth of fuel was pooled in the area below the intake silencer.

This evening I pulled the carbs off and tore them apart and as I expected they were clean as a whistle, no clogged passageways. Reeds looked to be in good shape as well. Decided to take a look at the thermostat while I was in there and apparently the previous owner has removed the actual thermostat piece from the housing.

Could the missing thermostat cause the issue I'm having? Surely it is a contributing factor but I just don't see how that could be the only thing. I've got a new one ordered and will be going out again this weekend so time will tell.

At this point I've eliminated every possible cause I can think of. If the thermostat doesn't fix it the only option I can think of is to maybe up the main jets to see if that allows some more fuel in.

Any other ideas before i just start blindly throwing new parts at it? Any help is appreciated.

 

[juno pierrat]

how did high speed jets look, also how did you set float levels?

 

[Faztbullet]

Put NEW OEM kits in carbs...

 

[Jkelley429]

how did high speed jets look, also how did you set float levels?

High speed jets were all clear and were marked 46D which is the correct size for this motor. According to the previous owner, the carbs were rebuilt right before I bought the boat a few months ago. My experience confirmed this. The float levels appeared correct so I didn't mess with them. Just barely higher than level as J Reeves suggests.

Put NEW OEM kits in carbs...

Is there enough difference between OEM and aftermarket kits to cause this issue? I'm not opposed to your idea I'm just not sure it would make a difference since they were rebuilt <20 hours ago.

 

[juno pierrat]

i had bogging recently, and had at least one clogged high speed jet, cleaned and clear, now good throttle, three other adjustments i made was float level gauge to set correctly( $20 tool), float drop set with in range(1 1/18 to 1 5/8), and tweaked the spring clip that holds the float needle to the float arm, no gap, tight against float arm, this is on a 84" 70 hp

 

[flyingscott]

What happens when you pump the ball on the fuel line? Is the VRO bypassed or removed completely? Did you try going more on the low speed screws? My 70 likes 4.25 turns out.