Been a while since we've had an oil thread

[Lou C]

I’m not talking the difference between hot and cold idle. I’m talking when it’s already hot and I’m running 4200-4800 for extended periods. The oil pressure would normally be hot 60-65, after extended runs was dropping into the mid 40 s. This was after I put in a new base engine. The WS conventional 25-40 would drop , same with the rotella T4 , though not quite as much. The syn merc /qs didn’t have this issue nor did the Mobil 1 15w50. So I stayed with the M1 , oil pressure at Wot or near wot stays best with M1 or the merc racing 20w 50 (verado oil), above 60 all the time.
I tend to drive mine pretty hard between a nice blast if it’s calm and I’m out alone or when we Are out as a family or group we are pulling boards and skiiers for 1-2 hrs With 5-6 people in the boat.
never Was able to figure out if this was shear or foaming. Just found the synth 50 wt worked best for me In terms of keeping the oil pressure up during long hot runs. if I felt the QS/merc was doing anything better would have no issue shelling out the $65 a gallon once a year. I think a 5 qt of M1 is just under $40. Also run it (m1 just not 50 wt) in my cars all of which are 170 k -272 k miles

Ok that I hadn’t seen. The on plane 3500 rpm oil pressure was always like 55-60 psi, it was lower only at idle when hot. Maybe I just dont push it that hard but I actually weighed my boat and when I subtract the trailer weight it’s 4,100 lbs! The whole works boat & trailer is 4960 on a certified scale. And only the little 4.3 4bbl pushing it…

 

[Lou C]

I put Valvoline 'Racing' VR1 20/50 in my Ford 302 engine. If it had a roller cam setup instead of the hydraulic flat tappet setup I'd probably put 5/30 synthetic in it.

How’d it do with that oil? Does it hold pressure well when hot? I was thinking of trying that oil myself when my stock of Merc/QS oil runs out….

 

[Scott06]

Maybe I just dont push it that hard

must be right arm weakness... Seriously who knows MM wasn't concerned when I emailed them. This was years back when I repowered. been running the M1 or verado oil since 2017 or 18 . They were one of the few places that would honor the warranty for non professional install, only wanted to see rotella used for first 10-20 hrs (dont recall exact break in), no syn until 100 hrs. So once I got past the 1 yr warranty and 100 hrs didn't really matter.

Bottom line so glad I bought a new vs reman and it was been flawless for 11 seasons, M1 works for me. Whole project turned out great and we have a decade of enjoyment out of it. Both daughters are into it and drive it, epsc the youngest, have doubled the annual hours since they got their license and take it out as well.

Re VR1- this oil gets pretty high praise on the gto forum I'm on. Same chit in the oil threads Split between more modern oils and T4. Couple of the older guys who have had their GTOs for decade have put well over 100k on their GTOs using T4 w flat tappets.

 

[Lpgc]

How’d it do with that oil? Does it hold pressure well when hot? I was thinking of trying that oil myself when my stock of Merc/QS oil runs out….

Seems to hold pressure when hot better than any other oil I've used in it.

I've only had the boat a few years but I rebuilt the engine when I first got it so I changed the oil regularly at first. I've used straight 30 weight oil and other brands of 20/50 but the Valvoline VR1 20/50 seems to maintain steady oil pressure better than any of the others. This year I didn't change the oil mid season, just ran it with the VR1 I put in when winterising it at the end of last season.

 

[Lou C]

must be right arm weakness... Seriously who knows MM wasn't concerned when I emailed them. This was years back when I repowered. been running the M1 or verado oil since 2017 or 18 . They were one of the few places that would honor the warranty for non professional install, only wanted to see rotella used for first 10-20 hrs (dont recall exact break in), no syn until 100 hrs. So once I got past the 1 yr warranty and 100 hrs didn't really matter.

Bottom line so glad I bought a new vs reman and it was been flawless for 11 seasons, M1 works for me. Whole project turned out great and we have a decade of enjoyment out of it. Both daughters are into it and drive it, epsc the youngest, have doubled the annual hours since they got their license and take it out as well.

Re VR1- this oil gets pretty high praise on the gto forum I'm on. Same chit in the oil threads Split between more modern oils and T4. Couple of the older guys who have had their GTOs for decade have put well over 100k on their GTOs using T4 w flat tappets.

So that was a really good investment. Don’t know if my old boat is worth repowering but a 5.7 certainly would wake it up! Now though the price will be pretty high adding in all the things I can’t reuse from the old 4.3.

 

[Pmt133]

The 25w40 merc hasn't lost pressure hot in my application while the diesel oil did. I also don't have the balls to run the thing flat out for more than a 2 minute stretch... you realize how short the river actually is when you do that and it just sounds like abuse on the engine in my hull. 3800, 38 mph is my fast cruise on the 4.3. The 15w40 would hot idle around 15-20 psi after a run like that and wot would barely make 40 when hot... which is low for a fresh 4.3. The merc is 35 hot hot after running and 55-60 wide open. Which is what you would expect a fresh 4.3 to do.

 

[Scott06]

So that was a really good investment. Don’t know if my old boat is worth repowering but a 5.7 certainly would wake it up! Now though the price will be pretty high adding in all the things I can’t reuse from the old 4.3.

At some point you gotta cut the cord. My old boat was a 3.0 17/18 ft BR that while in good shape was 25 yrs old two soft spots in the floor. Was a good time to get out as the kids were getting bigger and the boat was still very presentable.

Current is a 2004 21 ft BR that had a known cracked 4.3 that i swapped for a 5.0. total project boat , engine , tires brakes for trailer, prop etc was just under $11k, sold the old one for $3200. While prices for engines are more now so are boats. My friend this year had to replace his 2000 glastron as transom was rotten and cracked, got a year old undsold/new 4WINNS H1 with the 200 hp alpha one set up, was a tick over $50k I assume plus tax. Same boat same year also new unsold was like $8-9k more at another dealer. Both said no one is buy BRs only jetskis and pontoons...

Bottom line (and regardless of what oil you use...) no reason to repower yours given the maintenance you keep up with. Only you can tell if its worth it. Even if you bought a new merc engine/outdrive and duid the work yourself its still less than half new cost. At the boat show last march most 21 ft boats were $65-85 k. If repower gets you 10-12 more years not a bad move.

 

[Lou C]

Yep the prices of new boats is insane still. I go to the Nassau County Boat Show every year and the only boats I see under 50k new are 18’ Center Consoles with a 115 Yamaha 4 stroke.
Re power? If I do a reman 4.3 from MM it will be about $4500 plus local install I’m not doing that part at almost 71 years old lol. But OK if all in for let’s say $6500 not bad at all.
New V8 will add about $3000 to that or maybe a bit more. Boat has an agreed value insurance police on it for $10,500 due to the stringer & deck resto Ana paint job (Imron) we had done over the years. I’ve owned it 24 years! Even if I had to get the transom done it might still be worth it. Used boats are expensive too and some are just junk. Everybody here on Long Island wants a fish style boat, I/O bow riders and small cruisers are dead. At the last boat show I saw 1 I/O just one! All the rest were outboards or straight inboards/vee drives

 

[eggs712]

I'm really happy so far with my repower from Michigan Motors. Old motor was 1985 5.7 GM (Volvo 260a); replacement motor is a 5.7 315hp new GM long block. With the old, rusty, flat-tappet block needing almost all new components, a re-power made more sense to me. The torque band is much improved, so no regrets here.

Michigan Motors wanted me running T4 15W-40, which does drop a little oil pressure after sustained ~3800 rpm use. The oil temp sensor I added shows 230F for those runs in a short time. 260F for thirty second WOT prop testing. Oil pressure does recover after cool-down periods, so my thoughts are that the pressure is dropping from heating of the oil more than shearing.

After 100 hours, I think I'll try the synthetic VR1 20W-50. It claims to have good anti-foaming protection, but I'm having trouble finding real testing of it.

Curious, has anyone here tried out the Pennzoil or Bass Pro 25W-40 oils?

 

[Scott Danforth]

Used boats are expensive too and some are just junk

came across another 1988 Rogue the other day for sale in Boston and they want $26k for it. It does have a mercruiser 350 mag EFI transplant. I did a complete restoration including a big block and custom graphics, and I dont think its worth anywhere north of $20k, realistically, $15k maybe with all the spare parts I have.

 

[Mc Tool]

Was in the 165 F range that it always runs at .

where are you located ? On Amazon the 15 /50 is $32

New Zealand , 5l of 15/50 is $109 .
165°f aint even near to hot .......borderline not hot enough .

 

[Mc Tool]

oil threads……yep.


until proven otherwise, I’ll stick with Merc/quicksilver. recommended oil for my purchased new 2021 Merc.

Yep , thats a good way to be sure your using good stuff . Mercury aint going to stick their label of something that wont do the job for your motor .

 

[Scott Danforth]

Mercury aint going to stick their label of something that wont do the job for your motor .

yet they keep pushing the single point drain system and the 3-point drain system. both of which have been proven to fail.

 

[Lou C]

There is another oil thread over at The Hull Truth, which is mostly outboard folks, but one guy brought up an interesting point, in markets outside the USA, Yamaha doesn't mention FW-C in specs required for oil grades, only typical automotive grades. Don't know how accurate that is, but if it is well....
HMMMM.....

 

[Mc Tool]

Ok that I hadn’t seen. The on plane 3500 rpm oil pressure was always like 55-60 psi, it was lower only at idle when hot. Maybe I just dont push it that hard but I actually weighed my boat and when I subtract the trailer weight it’s 4,100 lbs! The whole works boat & trailer is 4960 on a certified scale. And only the little 4.3 4bbl pushing it…

I would think lower oil pressure when hot at idle is perfectly normal. If it was to maintain full pressure at a hot idle the relief valve would be dumping huge amounts of oil at normal operating revs ....and thats an unnecessary strain on the oil pump drive .

 

[Lou C]

https://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/708387-fc-w-oil-required-14.html

post # 266

 

[Mc Tool]

yet they keep pushing the single point drain system and the 3-point drain system. both of which have been proven to fail.

You lost me there Scott , I'll have a google

 

[Pmt133]

There is another oil thread over at The Hull Truth, which is mostly outboard folks, but one guy brought up an interesting point, in markets outside the USA, Yamaha doesn't mention FW-C in specs required for oil grades, only typical automotive grades. Don't know how accurate that is, but if it is well....
HMMMM.....

The same yamaha that has outboards that "make" oil?

 

[Pmt133]

yet they keep pushing the single point drain system and the 3-point drain system. both of which have been proven to fail.

I just picture some engineer in a furry suit in a room being told he's a good boy for that one.

 

[alldodge]

The single point works great for dealers. They drain, back boat into a tank filled with -200AF and run until warmed up, never a problem. Back yard guy doesn't have same setup