Winter Safe antifreeze - froze and cracked my block :( Help.....

[crackedblock]

Has this happened to anyone before? I live in Canada and I noticed half way through winter that my anti-freeze froze on me (I had an extra bottle). It froze so much that I even took a video of the stuff during the winter.


My engine was having trouble this spring and after some investigation, I noticed that my oil was all milky, and my block is most likely cracked.


Here's a video and pictures of the anti-freeze frozen solid. As you'll notice, it looked like it even expanded, as the bottle doesn't even stand straight any more! I spent extra money getting 'The good stuff' only to lose my engine

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1oTW3bdk_noRpQBl-0KkLhlDFvibP-aKz
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1c4xRsMmA8WqIT7rGcTWEtam4YYEyDb6l


Has this happened to anyone else?

Thank you,
Carl

 

[GA_Boater]

Welcome aboard.

What is the protection temp on the jug? What was the outside temp when the jug froze?

Antifreeze does cause busted blocks when it doesn't done properly and many don't. Air doesn't freeze.

 

[ahicks]

I'm not sure RV anti freeze was a good choice for winterizing your engine. It's designed for use in RV water lines, and I know for a fact it doesn't take a lot for that stuff to turn slushy. If it got REALLY cold for an extended period of time, I could see where it might break an engine block, especially if mixed/diluted with some water.

 

[alldodge]

The RV stuff does freeze but "supposedly" it does expand when it does freeze.

If all of the water came out during winterization, then even putting in RF-AF should have no issue so long as the stuff did not exceed their specs. What I'm saying is the -45 degree stuff was used, and did it get below that (I doubt it)?

How did you winterize?

 

[crackedblock]

Welcome aboard.

What is the protection temp on the jug? What was the outside temp when the jug froze?

Antifreeze does cause busted blocks when it doesn't done properly and many don't. Air doesn't freeze.

We got about -35 Celsius this winter and the antifreeze is good for -46...

I did this with my dad who has done boats for several years without any issues. He, however, used a different brand of antifreeze.

Could I go against the company? It shouldn't expand like this (it's rock hard!), and we did this the same way my dad had done for years.

Thanks again,
Carl

 

[mr 88]

As noted the RV stuff has a freezing point,just put it in your freezer to see the results,may be labeled as well. Yes it has happened to people that use it, then read the fine print, after the sad fact that there block is shot. Either use undiluted car anti freeze or drain everything,again as noted air don't freeze.

 

[alldodge]

We got about -35 Celsius this winter and the antifreeze is good for -46...

If there was any water in the block when the AF was added, then it was diluted

 

[mr 88]

We got about -35 Celsius this winter and the antifreeze is good for -46...

I did this with my dad who has done boats for several years without any issues. He, however, used a different brand of antifreeze.

Could I go against the company? It shouldn't expand like this (it's rock hard!), and we did this the same way my dad had done for years.

Thanks again,
Carl

Good luck trying to sue a company that has deep pockets and you trying to prove that there was no water in the block when you put the anti freeze in. With what your going to pay a lawyer and the time involved with the odds stacked against you I would just start looking for a donor boat on Kiwi or whatever the site is in Canada. Or start shopping the boneyards for a block. What was the engine that the RV junk took out ?

 

[crackedblock]

The RV stuff does freeze but "supposedly" it does expand when it does freeze.

If all of the water came out during winterization, then even putting in RF-AF should have no issue so long as the stuff did not exceed their specs. What I'm saying is the -45 degree stuff was used, and did it get below that (I doubt it)?

How did you winterize?

I winterized by doing the usual, oil change, gear oil change, fuel filter change etc. The process of doing the antifreeze is about this:

1. Empty all the water using the drain plugs (6 of them in my 4.3l mercruiser)
2. Remove the 4 hoses in the front of the boat around the thermostat
3. Pour antifreeze in all 4 hoses until it starts coming out of the drain plugs
4. Close up the drain plugs
5. Pour more antifreeze into the hoses until it starts coming out from the back of the boat (let it come out quite a bit)
6. I used 6 1 gallon jugs for the whole job so more than enough IMO.


This is good enough right?

 

[crackedblock]

Good luck trying to sue a company that has deep pockets and you trying to prove that there was no water in the block when you put the anti freeze in. With what your going to pay a lawyer and the time involved with the odds stacked against you I would just start looking for a donor boat on Kiwi or whatever the site is in Canada. Or start shopping the boneyards for a block. What was the engine that the RV junk took out ?

It was a mercruiser 4.3L.

 

[mr 88]

Heck of a lot easier removing the drain plugs on the block and exhaust manifolds plugs. Anyway 4.3s should be a dime a dozen in the bone yards,start searching... Just watched your video to see that it "claims" to be good up to -50F,still think your SOL with a lawsuit.

 

[crackedblock]

Good luck trying to sue a company that has deep pockets and you trying to prove that there was no water in the block when you put the anti freeze in. With what your going to pay a lawyer and the time involved with the odds stacked against you I would just start looking for a donor boat on Kiwi or whatever the site is in Canada. Or start shopping the boneyards for a block. What was the engine that the RV junk took out ?

I still have an unused gallon... putting it in the freezer I can see that it expanded (look at my video above), and my freezer is set at -18 degrees Celsius, not even close to the limit.

 

[dwco5051]

From the company website;

Star brite® Wintersafe -50°F (-46°C) Non-Toxic Antifreeze will provide burst protection to -50°F (-46°C) and freeze protection within a range of +14°F to +18°F (-10°C to -8°C). When testing with a refractometer or with a hydrometer designed for use with PG, freeze point readings on the PG scale will range from +14°F to +18°F. When winterizing water systems with plastic pipes in regions where temperatures can fall below -10°F (-23°C), we recommend using Star brite® -100°F (-73°C) Non-Toxic Antifreeze.

 

[alldodge]

You winterized correctly, the only issue is the AF used. Sorry but looks like the AF did you in. They do make -100 stuff which is for motors, but I don't recommend that either. Others do use it without issue, but I always recommend air

 

[crackedblock]

From the company website;

Star brite® Wintersafe -50°F (-46°C) Non-Toxic Antifreeze will provide burst protection to -50°F (-46°C) and freeze protection within a range of +14°F to +18°F (-10°C to -8°C). When testing with a refractometer or with a hydrometer designed for use with PG, freeze point readings on the PG scale will range from +14°F to +18°F. When winterizing water systems with plastic pipes in regions where temperatures can fall below -10°F (-23°C), we recommend using Star brite® -100°F (-73°C) Non-Toxic Antifreeze.

Wow! That's nice to hear.... My local marina advised me against getting the regular stuff at my hardware store, and to buy this "real" antifreeze because it's much better. I paid a premium for it too..... I just can't believe this happened. Same process as usual, just a really horrible product. Even my insurance doesn't cover ice damage... what a disappointment

 

[crackedblock]

You winterized correctly, the only issue is the AF used. Sorry but looks like the AF did you in. They do make -100 stuff which is for motors, but I don't recommend that either. Others do use it without issue, but I always recommend air

The antifreeze is supposed to prevent corrosion and such, which is why my father always kept the antifreeze in the system, but I've learned my lesson now.... I just wish there was something I can do.. The local dealer sold me a bad product in my opinion, maybe they will be able to help me...

 

[kbh121956]

Sorry to hear about the cracked block. I learned that RV antifreeze is junk! It isn't any good for Trailers, campers, etc. I blow out all my lines and have done so for years. I use automotive in my Marine blocks.

 

[JimS123]

The antifreeze is supposed to prevent corrosion and such, which is why my father always kept the antifreeze in the system, but I've learned my lesson now.... I just wish there was something I can do.. The local dealer sold me a bad product in my opinion, maybe they will be able to help me...

You did all the right things. Keeping anti-freeze for corrosion protection is the right thing to do. You used the correct product. My guess is that you got a bad batch. The manufacturer should be liable, not the selling dealer.

Hiring a lawyer will cost money, and the company won't even care. You need data.

Find a test lab that could determine the freeze point on the product. That won't cost much. If it doesn't meet specs, you're good to go. Send the CEO of the company documentation for the purchase of the product, lot numbers and test data showing it was out-of-specs. Also send a quote for the repairs - a new block with labor, not a crappy used piece of junk. Document everything and send them your attorney's name plus the local newspaper's consumer activist reporter's name.. Tell them a lawsuit is coming if they don't respond within 48 hours. You have to have some b$lls if you want satisfaction.

You can be sure they already know there was a problem, because you're probably not the first person to complain.

Good luck. BTDT and have always come out ahead....

 

[tpenfield]

The -50F stuff becomes solid at around -20 F as stated.

The -50F (-46C) rating is a pipe burst rating, not a freeze rating. With -35C ( -31F) temperatures you were well into the freeze zone of the -50F AF (aka the pink stuff). You should have drained the AF or used the -100F (Green) stuff.

 

[JimS123]

I'm not sure RV anti freeze was a good choice for winterizing your engine. It's designed for use in RV water lines, and I know for a fact it doesn't take a lot for that stuff to turn slushy. If it got REALLY cold for an extended period of time, I could see where it might break an engine block, especially if mixed/diluted with some water.

I may not have read far enough, but I don't see where RV A-F was mentioned. Moot point anyway. The temp is what is important. If it was within the limits, the product is no good. The difference between RV and marine is the corrosion protection, not the temp.