19 Foot MFG Boat Restoration

[oldboat1]

Thank you OB1. Tons of info there, I will do my best to do all of those things. A few questions. What is 5200 and where can i get it? Is it nessisary, or will PB or Titebond work also? How do you put the screws in, and how many? Do you fill those holes with epoxy? When you say seal the whole piece, what exatly do you mean (what is the method for sealing?)? Also, what do you mean by fasteners? Do you mean after PBing it onto the hull skin, and then putting bolts in?

Don't want to give you conflicting info. in describing what I do. 5200 is one of the marine adhesive sealants produced by 3M. 4200 is a faster cure. I'm sure PB or Titebond would do fine. 1 1/4 inch drywall screws work fine. Stainless screws are expensive (stainless anything), and really not necessary imo. You are going to seal them in anyway. There is an exterior version that builders use, I think (green?)

The transom pieces are big. I lay it on a cement floor -- use your adhesive on one half, then fit the other on top and stand on it while attaching screws -- no set number, but be liberal. Just countersink them a bit without going through the other layer. By sealing the piece, I mean throroughly coating the whole core with the sealant of your choice. The edges need special attention, as that's where water can wick in -- special care at the top and bottom. You can completely encase the core with resin and cloth, but I don't do that. I do butter the edges with thickened epoxy (again, my method), and you may want to butter the edges and cover with the polyester cloth. (Honestly, it's probably overkill.)

Dry fit the new core, then hit it generously with adhesive -- appears you will have only the outer skin in place, so glue and clamp or screw to the outer skin. The through bolting I was describing applies to fitting the core into an envelope (inner and outer skins in place). I'm pretty sure in your case you will be doing the inner skin last, so a little different. You have access to the edges when it's in place, though, and I would put more of the adhesive sealant all around the edges. You want something that adheres and seals, but remains flexible

When you do refit the hardware, use some adhesive sealant in the holes (including the hole for the brass drain which you will replace).

 

[Chrismas Sko]

I see OB1. Thanks for the detailed description. So, Interestingly, while the original version of my boat (fishinn Caprice) had an inner skin, somwhere on its trip to me it was taken out. So I dont have the inner fiber glass. When I got the boat the splashwell was atached to the transom, and it was also connected to the glass cap the went around the top of the boat. When taking it apart, it was so stuck on that I had to basically destroy the sides of the splashwell disconecting it from the cap. the edge of the splash well that ran over the top of the transom where the screws go was also wrecked. So my plan has been to fit the splash well in (or build a new one and glass it 100%) and then glass over the top of the transom and over the top of the splashwell to sort of connect it and act as the originall screw holding piece did. Long story short, I guess I just dont have an inner shell to put over the transom, so aside from the portion that the splashwell covers, it will be exposed (the sides). I am not sure if this changes anything...

I am also still just a tad unclear. I am a bit strapped for cash so I am trying to make due with the resin I have. Do I coat the core in resin and glass it all before I Install it. Or do you coat in resin and seal the sides, glue it in, and then glass it to the outside shell?

 

[Chrismas Sko]

I know that might throw a wrench into this a little. I am torn between building a new splashwell or just fitting the old one (fixing a big crack in it). I had a plan to craft and secure in wooden seats-containers in each corner (on iether side of the splashwell) which would act as storage but will not protect the outside of the transom.

Its possible I could fix the splashwell and reconect it to the side bits which atached to the cap, but it got really messed up. I think that is very unlikely. Is it posssible I could create an outer skin?
Thanks OB1

 

[sphelps]

I would not use 5200 to laminate the 2 pieces of ply together or use it to glue it to the skin .. But thats just me .... 5200 is a marine sealant used for sealing penetrations ..Although it is pretty sticky .. I would use your pb poly resin mix applying with a 1/4" notched trowel .. You can use the titebond III to glue the 2 pieces together if you want .. Screwing it together is ok also . But I would remove the screws after it cures .. I also like the old school way of drilling holes every so often through your transom piece before you glue it in place ... When you clamp the piece in place your pb will ooze through the holes while letting any trapped air escape ... This forms kinda like a fiberglass nail going the ply tying the inside and outside skins together of sorts .. I think Woody has that mentioned as an option on his link on fabricating transom /stringers/decks ..
Also if it were me I would glass a layer of csm on both sides of your transom ply before installation ..Pre coating the dry wood with resin before the csm ..
Yes the mekp is the hardener ... You can adjust the amount of hardener according to the temps your working in ... I would not go less than 1% ...The hotter it is the faster it kicks .... You can mix a very small batch if you want to get the feel on how much working time you have ...

 

[Woodonglass]

Repair the old splashwell and put it back in. Clean the outside of the transom skin where the old holes were grind them smooth and leave them. Where are the cracks you made when removing the transom. Here's what you have to understand. When you Use the PB to install the transom, NOT 5200, you can duct tape over the holes on the outside and the pb will OOZE into and and all holes in the transom and fill them flush.

 

[oldboat1]

I am also still just a tad unclear. I am a bit strapped for cash so I am trying to make due with the resin I have. Do I coat the core in resin and glass it all before I Install it. Or do you coat in resin and seal the sides, glue it in, and then glass it to the outside shell?

Use of the old splash well is preferable, as stated above. On the transom core, though, you can seal it and paint the interior facing surface if you choose to. You certainly don't need to glass in the core before installing, particularly if you want to hold down costs -- don't really even HAVE to seal it, although it's wise to do so. Here's a thread with Woodenglass's formula for sealing: http://forums.iboats.com/forum/boat...uilding-and-hull-repair/9993151-interior-wood (don't think he minds.) Choices are open.

The transom exterior (back or outside of the hull) is going to need some work. I've had good success painting repaired transoms, and it's almost surely the most cost effective way to go -- and doesn't require painting the full hull. Topside marine paint is a good choice, but you don't need marine paint either. A good oil based enamel will give nice results (or tractor paint) -- local hardware store might have a color matching service as well. I recommend foam brushes and thin coats. As in all refinishing, the trick is in the prep work (can't sand too much).

 

[Woodonglass]

CS, read and study this...Fabricating Decks, Stringers, and Transoms
Everything you need to know about fabricating, glassing and installing the transom, and stringers is in here.

This guy followed the method I recommend to a "T". Start here and read a few pages...You'll learn a lot.

http://forums.iboats.com/forum/boat...s-total-gut-and-rebuild?p=8508673#post8508673

 

[tallcanadian]

I used PL Premium to glue the two pieces of plywood together for the transom. Drove a few screws in to keep it together. Once it cured after 24 or so hours, I removed the screws then started the installation progress. The PB will fill in the screw holes. You shouldn't have to pre coat the plywood prior to installation. I believe the wood will soak in enough from the PB and the when you glass in the transom, that will be enough to coat the wood. But that is me. The guys here have more experience and should be listened too.

 

[Chrismas Sko]

Thank you guys so much for clarifying all that. Its a huge help! I will head out today and sand the transom and start building the clamps. Greatly apreciate all the input. Ill try to get it as clean as I can today and Ill post how it came out!

 

[tallcanadian]

The great thing about Fiberglass is you can hide a lot of mistakes. I'm sure you will do great. I was nervous too when I did mine but guys here for me through it. Without them I would still have an empty shell.

 

[Chrismas Sko]

Thank you TC! honestly I would not have even taken on this project without the help of you guys. Un-real. Honestly like you guys on this site better than normal people haha.
I am a little woried about it but I figure too much pb is better than too little. If it squishes out in exess I will smooth it out and wipe off what needs to be removed.
Ill be sure to post here at every step to check in.

This is what I was able to acomplish today. Got all the old wood off and down to clean glass. I smoothed out the edges and all.





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^The yellow stuff. Not sure if its paint or what.

A few questions going forward.
1: WOG, were you talking about fixing the holes in the transom skin when you said tape over them and the PB will fill in? I asume after it dries Ill sand it smooth?
2: The metal piping inside the drainage holes is rusted and nasty. Would replacing it with PVC be ok?
3: I hope to paint the inside of the hull sides white. I will create a wood barier between the main area of the boat and the hull sides, but I just dont want them to have that nasty yellow pealing stuff on them. Do I have to sand it all off? Will it come off with acitone? Can I paint over it ok?
4: Lastly, also regarding the yellow stuff. I am going to try to sand it off the sides of the boat, at least where the tabing will be, but if I cant get it all off, will glass still stick to the side of the hull if over the yellow stuff.

Thanks!

 

[Woodonglass]

Yes, the PB will fill all the holes in the transom if You tape over them on the back side. PVC is A-OK. Not sure what the yellow stuff is. Try grinding a bit more and see if you can get to the Pink Stuff. Also use some Xylene to try and remove it. It's a LOT more Powerful than Acetone.

 

[gm280]

Chrismas Sko, for what it is worth, I think you are doing very with your project. You did a great job grinding in my opinion. The usual way most do their transom, before even getting to PBing it into the hull, is to glue the two pieces of exterior plywood together with either PB or Tite Bond III water proof glue. And then polyester the both sides of the transom and the end grains as well and use CSM to seal it over. Once all that is finished, then you are ready to PB it in place. You can drill the squeeze through holes as well after it is all polyestered and CSM applied if you like. However, make at least four or more wooden clamps so you can squeeze the transom very tight to get it to squeeze the poly everywhere. Those clamps work very well. I did mine all by my self. But I highly recommend you get at least one or more helpers to do it. It would just make it a lot easier to accomplish everything that needs to be held and tighten all at the same time. And don't worry, I think yours will work out fine as well. JMHO :thumb:

 

[Shakedownscott]

Looking real good, you are making great progress.

Could the yellow stuff be spray in foam of some sort? The boat Im working on had 1/4" of yellow foam sprayed over the sides of the hull. It looks the same but thicker.

 

[Chrismas Sko]

Thank you WOG for the clarifications, I will be sure to get PVC to do the holes. I tried the sovent and it did not work so unfortunatly Ill have to do another day of grinding. gm280, Thank so much for the support, I think I am 100% clear on the process now and am confident II can get it done. Did your transome holes all fill in or did you have to add PB after? SDC, allways good to know ilts coming along well. Thank you for the compliments. I think the yellow was really old paint. I got to grinding today.

Todays progress was sanding on side of the hull to eliminate paint.



I am not sure if its me just over thinking it, but when I was done grinding the paint off, when I grabed the side of the boat I sanded, it fealt a little more flimsy than the other side. I was hoping to maybe put a layer of 1708 over the left and right sides after sanding to try to regain some of the rigidity. Is that somthing that would be ok?

Also got supllies for the clamps!

Will assemble them when the time comes. Now all that is left to do is sand the other side of the boat and wait for my glassing materials to come in so I can do the transom!
Best

 

[mickyryan]

I'm guessing it was some type of release? try mek if its glue it will take it off

 

[Chrismas Sko]

I think it was Paint mickyryan. But still not sure haha!

Made huge moves today. Got the whole thing sanded and done. Sides and all. You guys think Ive sanded enough in the past pictures?

So this is where Im at. I have the whole thing sanded and a transom on the way. I have a few possible dilemas that I see in the future, and I would love the input of you guys. First thing. There are some real big cracks in the gel coat on the bottom of the boat.

eg. (this is the worst case. Looks like an impact, although no visible damage on the inside)


After doing the transom and the deck, I plan on atacking the hull. What is the procedure for fixing this stuff? I know I have to sand the old bottom paint off, but im clueless when it comes to gell coat cracks. Is it possible to flip the boat upside down for painting?

My second worry regards the deck. I will be tabbing it directly to the outside shell (because I have no inside one) about 3-4" above the hull chine. Will there be too many hull movements that it will eventually seperate from the tabbing? Also, the cap that runs around the top of the hull will need suport. I plan on running wood suports from the deck, up the sides of the hull to the cap every three feet or so to provide strength to the cap but allso to allow me to secure wood to create a barrier between the outside skin-side of the hull (essentially running ribs up the sides). will this create hard spots on the sides of the hull? Will the movement of the hull eventually seperate these suports.

Lastely, there are some 2" cuts I made through the hull with a saw when I was cutting out the stringers. What is the protocall for fixing these?

Thanks for all the help!

 

[mickyryan]

ouch!

 

[tallcanadian]

As far as the gel coat goes you will need to get more info from other members. I wouldn't be able to give you advice on doing a nice clean repair. I would however put a couple of layers of cloth over the stricken area from the inside. To strengthen up that spot.

As far as the hull goes, I think you are over thinking the process. Yes you will be tabbing above the deck but that's how it's been done forever. There is only on skin of Fiberglass on the hull. Personally I wouldn't be making the sides any stronger. Things are suppose to flex and move, otherwise something will break. My boat has some strapping along the top of the hull to fasten the upper half back together. I replaced these with new wood. Also remember, and I'm assuming, you will be putting flotation foam on under the deck. This alone will strengthen the hull and deck.

As far as you cutting holes with your grinder I would suggest from the inside of the hull, PB spread over the area with a couple layers of cloth. You will have to sand underneath.

 

[Chrismas Sko]

Thank you TC. So an extra layer of glass is not a good idea. Do you think ribs would work?
And I will do my best to strengthen that spot from the inside and then ffigure out how to do the outside. Whenn your glassing the stringers, transom, over holes in the hull etc... do you need to sand each layer before hand like i have read that you have too, or can you just keep laying glass.Thanks!