Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

[frednick1]

Hi,

I bought a 10' Zodiac and an 8HP outboard a few weeks ago. I got the 8HP motor going great and then on my second time out in the Zodiac, it began to leak really badly. The entire seam on the right side blew out at the transom and at 20MPH it took on an amazing amount of water in a very short time. When I got it home, I took out the floor and looked closely at the damaged seam, I discovered that not only was the seam open for about 12" but the transom cuff was completely detached from the wooden transom on BOTH SIDES and some other seams and original layered patches were open all the way across the back of the transom and along the sides for about 1.5 feet on both sides. The top of one of the cuffs and the entire other cuff were about to come off the tubes and, indeed they did with very little pulling on my part.

Basically the transom was just sitting there being held in by the pressure of the tubes. I am impressed with the cuff design since there was NOTHING holding that 8HP motor on there but the air in the tubes. I am not, however, impressed with the glue they use to put these little inflatables together with since I was lucky I didn't loose the transom, motor, gas tank, a foot and my life due to the failure of the glue. What were they thinking???

I have cleaned off all the old glue (which is like chewing gum) that I can get off and I have started putting it back together, one section at a time. Wish me luck. I will need it. I will probably sell this boat as soon as I get it back together.

I am not going to use the glue they recommend. I am going to use a commercial product named GOOP. It sets very slowly and is not easy to use but I have had very good luck using it on other inflatables (Achilles) and it is rated for PVC. What I don't like about the 2 part epoxy(s) is that they are so humidity and temperature sensitive. This GOOP stuff is not touchy about those problems. It just has to be held in place for 24 hours to let it completely set.

You will have to take my word on this one. My images are too big to upload to this site. Sorry.

Anyone have any suggestions?

Frednick1

 

[deejaycee_2000]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

PVC weld, glue, actually "melts" the 2 together and works the best ......

 

[frednick1]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Hi DeeJayCee,

Do you mean to use that PVC pipe glue that I use to do plumbing? That melts the pipes together, too. It's really cheap and is quite messy to use but locks those pipes up really tight and waterproof. It also has only a short working time since the pipes lock up in just 30 seconds or less.

Do you mean I should use that stuff?

I have succeeded in getting the cuffs back on the tubes. I will put the transom in the cuffs tomorrow afternoon. Then I will glue down the bottom, sides and "tapes" on Thursday and Friday. It should be ready to put in the water next week.

It would go faster if I could use that PVC pipe glue. But I don't trust it to hold the cuff to the transom.

I went to West Marine today and the sales person tried to sell me the 2 part epoxy glue. It was over 50.00. No thanks. I'll take my chances with this GOOP stuff unless PVC pipe glue will work just as well and faster.

Frednick1

 

[deejaycee_2000]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Yes it is the same as the PVC pipe glue, and works best ...... here is a link to the stuff I use, so read up on it and see if it is the same as yours ...... http://www.bostik.co.za/hardware/pvc.htm

 

[frednick1]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Hi DeeJayCee,

That looks promising. I may get some and try it on a small area to see how well it works. I think I can get that stuff around here.

If not, can I use the PVC pipe glue that you find in any hardware store? Actually, I have a can of it in my workshop.

I wonder if the PVC WELD will hold the wooden transom into the hollow pockets of the rubber cuffs?

Norm

 

[deejaycee_2000]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

It should yes, it is pretty strong stuff .....

 

[frednick1]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Well, It's taken over 2 weeks but I am almost done. I have taken pictures of the repair as it progressed. I'll put the pics online and put the link to them here on this thread. Actually, I am pretty proud of how it turned out. Norm

 

[frednick1]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Hi,

Today, I finally got done with the repairs. I have taken pictures of the project along the way just for fun. I have uploaded them to a website so you can see what I did. Take a look.

http://www.fredfamily.org/~nrfred/photos/zodiac_repair_small/

I plan to sell this boat on eBay before I fall in love with it now that it's in perfect condition. I never had a boat that was in perfect condition before. I hope to get 500.00 for it. That will give me enough to claim that I got the 8HP Mariner motor for free. The glue I used cost me 35.00. That's 6 - 3.7oz tubes.

I know. There's no such thing as a free (lunch) outboard motor.

I'll let the last glue dry for 3 days and then I will take it out and run the hell out of it to be sure it's going to hold together. Then it goes up on eBay.

I really like this GOOP stuff. It is really easy to use. It's strong and flexible. AND I didn't have to worry about the weather. During the 2 weeks it took me to complete the work, it rained, was cold and was warm and humid. No way would I have been able to do it with that 2 part epoxy stuff.

Keeping the glue still while it set was a problem but I was able to make clamps and forms to hold it until it set enough to hold itself in place for the total set.

I did discover that you can't paint it until it completely sets. The solvents in the glue don't let the oil based paint dry. So that is a problem I didn't consider.

Frednick1

 

[deejaycee_2000]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

it looks good ..... great job ..... The motor looks great ........

 

[frednick1]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Thanks DJC, I will get some photos of it in the water in a few days and put them in that same gallery just for completeness. Frednick1

 

[gbilly]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Have you had a chance to test your boat?

Found your repair through google. Thanks for posting the photo diary of you work. I am about to begin a similar repair.

G

 

[deejaycee_2000]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Welcome to iBoats .... good luck with your project .....

frednick1 .... will be awesome to see the finished product on the water .....

 

[frednick1]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Hi Guys,

I took it out last Wednesday night and the transom held up very well in some pretty rough (and fun) water in Bowers Harbor of the West Arm of Grand Traverse Bay (NW side of Lake Michigan). It was a little windy and some water skiers making wakes to play on.

Another small spot on the right hand side bottom seam opened up in a place I didn't glue and it leaked just a little bit. It is 4 inches long and goes all the way to the inner seam. The water ran back along the space between the two layers and came in the inside right transom corner. Maybe a 1/2 gallon. It drained out ok. I could see it burbling in slowly.

I will try to pull that seam apart more and get some GOOP in there. I was very happy with the way the transom held on the the PVC in the rough water. It was really tugging on the material and deforming the cuffs when we were jumping wakes and surfing the rollers. We had it up to 18MPH which isn't much in a SKI-DOO or Boston Whaler but it felt like 100MPH in that little orange donut. My son had a big smile on his face. He clocked our speed with a GPS. I tried to keep the flat side down.

I could see the transom cuffs deform and pull on the material hard and I checked for any separation when I got home and after the boat had dried out and there is none visible. That gives me hope that it will be stay intact.

I took the camera but I wanted it show a dry ride and so, since it did leak, I didn't get any pics.

Be patient. I will get the final set up soon.

G, welcome to iBoats. These guys are awesome. I have really learned a lot from them and they have given me the confidence to try stuff I might have farmed out to someone who really wasn't much better than I am.

As for your repair, if I were you, I would wait to see if my boat works ok before I used that GOOP product. I would hate it if you used it and it failed down the road on account of me. Get some good advice from guys like DJC and others on here. They have more experience than I do. I just used GOOP because I knew how it works, had used it before on rafts (Hypalon not PVC) and I was comfortable with it. But that PVC WELD by BOSTIK seems like a good product for gluing PVC to PVC since it melts them together. But I question whether it will stick transom wood to PVC. That's why I was reluctant to use it.

However, some sites say not to use the PVC Weld:

http://www.westportmarina.com/zodiac/repairs/glue.html

Take some pictures of the damage and repairs so we can see them. If you don't have a web photo host, try OFOTO.com or one of the several other free photo hosts.

Be sure to remove all the old glue that you can from all the different surfaces, especially the transom. I used a razor blade to scrape off a lot of the old dirty, gummy crap off the transom and then I used MEK which works good for getting the last residues off. I think you can get it at any hardware store. I know ACE Hardwares around here have it.

I did the whole job with the boat inflated except, of course, for when I did the patch on the tube. There had been a very small, 1" square patch on there before and the tubes didn't hold air well. It was just a little pin hole. After my first trip out, when the transom came apart, I noticed that the patch was coming off, too. So, I just pulled it off, cleaned it up and replaced it first. I used a larger piece of material and I rounded the corners. By having it inflated when you glue the bigger sections, you will have something to push against when you are gluing it up.

Check my photos to see how I made the curved clamps to squeeze the cuffs in place with the glue. I don't see how you can put that contact cement on the inside of those cuffs, let it dry and then try to the slide the transom into those cuffs without it sticking before it is completely seated. I just think you have to use some kind of glue that will allow the transom to slide in there and express the excess glue.

I used the edges of the transom as a pattern for the curved wooden "clamps". I found the wood in a dumpster at a house remodel. No need to use a new piece from Lowes.

I suspended the transom from a bike hook on the ceiling with a line so I could push down on the cuff to get it all the way down in that upper corner of the cuff and to keep it from falling over when I was working on it. That worked good. The weight of the boat put pressure on that spot and the glue oozed out for a few minutes before it stopped. I used a strap to put the pressure on the tubes to pull them toward each other. You can see how it oozed out. I think that's called FLASH.

I originally removed the flash but later decided that the flash was a benefit and left it from then on. I smeared it out in some places which I think helps protect the seam from wear. It looks a little messy but I think I would smear the flash on all the seams if I did the job again. I think it helps to divert the water and abrasive wear from the seams.

One more thing. I have been nominated for DUMMY OF THE YEAR:

Before going to the lake, I put the motor on the transom. Then I noticed that the wooden floor wasn't installed, so I went in the garage and got the floor 5 sections. I knew I had to let the air out of the tubes to install it. So, I let the air out of the tubes.

What happened?

Well, the transom collapsed from the weight of the motor. The motor, transom and boat fell over backwards, came right off the trailer and landed, BANG!, on the driveway in a big pile.

What a dummy!

If that didn't rip that transom off, a little bumping around in the lake sure won't.

Take care, be safe.

Frednick

http://www.fredfamily.org/~nrfred/photos/zodiac_repair_small/

 

[frednick1]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

http://www.fredfamily.org/~nrfred/photos/zodiac_repair_small/

I took it out to the lake last night but it was just too windy to launch by myself so I'll wait until a better day. I did get some ramp pictures of it on the trailer.

PS. Final chapter:

I sold the boat on eBay today for the same amount I paid for the boat and 8HP motor. So, I got the motor for the price of the repairs. About 50.00. The ZODIAC was completely solid and all the seams were tight and transom was really solid. When the buyer arrived, I jumped on the tubes and tried to push the transom apart as hard as I could push and it was really strong. I have no doubt that the new owner will have lots of fun with it for a long time before anything needs to be repaired again. It's 22 years old, so I know sooner or later, it will need something else repaired. I was sort of sad to sell it since I had so much time invested in it but I had 10 boats and now I only have 9. 10 is too many but 9 is too many, too. I need to sell another one but which one. That's the dilemma.

Thanks for all your assistance and encouragements on this project. You guys rule.

Tight lines,

Frednick1

 

[doggonegoose]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Hi Frednick Just to let you all know about the glue called goop. It is not made to repair boats. I was the buyer of said boat and on 2nd. outing the bottom came apart again. While looking for a site to see about repairs, i came across this forum on inflatables. Wish i had seen it first, would not had such a long drive. Have taken the boat to the repair shop and the cost is $350.-400. aprox. Was told if you had spent another $50.00 with all the work you had put in, it would have been right and held up good. The transom is starting to come apart to. The glue goop will not melt and bond the pvc together. Also your patch started to leak. You can not repair a leak with pressure in tube. As for your $50.00 motor, hope you have more luck then myself. If i got a check in the mail for half the repairs, it would make me a lot happier. Thank You.

 

[whywhyzed]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Interesting reading - that's eBay.... oh well... at least the boat was repairable and is now useable.
Why do the manufacturers glue to the wood?
My Avon is constructed like that where the material is bonded to the transom - I don't like it.
Oddly, my old Sevylor had the best design I've seen. The floor actually came right up to the top of the transom and was bonded to the tubes right to the top. The transom was 2 peices of wood and they sandwiched the floor right up. To replace the transom, you just unbolt the 2 pieces of wood (the top fasteners were through heavy molded plastic handles) , use the old transom as a template, and cut new wood (or plastic if you want)- then sandwich again reusing the special fasteners.

 

[frednick1]

Re: Zodiac Transom Failure - Repair

Bruce,

I feel very bad that all my work was for nothing and that you are having to have it re-done. I sure didn't try to cheat you. I didn't do all that work and spend all that time to have it fail. I was so worried about doing the work and having the glue fail because of humidity and temperature that I chose the wrong adhesives for PVC and it failed anyway. On the labels, it says plainly that it's made for PVC but I guess it isn't. I hope others will learn from this.

I had used Goop previously for Hypalon rafts and had good luck with it.

Send me your address.

Even though we've left each other's feedbacks and I don't have to, I will share the cost of the repairs. The 200.00 isn't going to make me poor or you rich but sometimes it's just best to do the right thing.

Use the Ebay email system. That's a little more private than this forum.

Frednick1