Wrong New Prop Or What?

[Rick Stephens]

I will give this one last shot. If you are interested in learning how a motor works, ask questions. However, blurting out conclusions that are not based on reality, like how carburetors work, makes everyone believe you just want to hear yourself talk.

. So, as far as bad gas, I'm not sure about that. And, if the carb was plugged, would it even start?

The level of ignorance right there is just right to never ever get the problem solved until you throw in the towel and spend a thou or two on the mechanic replacing stuff until he finds your problem, by mistake, in the most roundabout and costly thoughtless process.

I don't know near enough to be independent of these forums. Anytime I'm in need of a little humility, I can jump to a conclusion and state a 'fact' not based on experience. Good way to learn, but one does need to accept that they are wrong, on occasion.

 

[JimS123]

I apologize for jumping in here late in the game. I was just thinking about a thread last year and it got me wondering how you made out. So, I googled your screen name and came up with this new thread.

As I recall, when you moved to the high mountains you could not find a mechanic that would re-jet your carb. You were advised by all the pundits here that your boat wouldn't run well without it.

You also put the boat away with 3 year old gas, saying that it was impossible for you to remove the old stale stuff.

As I also recall, you were having performance issues at the time and that's why you posted here.

Seems to me that your current problems have absolutely nothing to do with your new prop, but have everything to do with bad gas and an improper carb.

My suggestion is to go back to the 2020 thread and implement all the recommendations that were made back then. Maybe you could send your boat back to Florida where you have a trusted mechanic., if no one locally will work on an old boat. I'm pretty sure you KNOW your gas and carb are bad, you just don't want to address it and continue to simply hope for the best.

Personally, I'm your age as well (I'm an old fart, but don't call me an old codger...LOL) and I do 99% of my own boat work. Why? Because I don't trust all those youngins that work in some of the boat yards. The only thing I DON"T do is the computer stuff. Only because I don't have the proprietary software to link into the newer engines. I was programming puters and writing code 50 years ago, so its not like I'm not competent. Doing a little manual work these days is what keeps my arthritis in check.

 

[LuvBoating]

I apologize for jumping in here late in the game. I was just thinking about a thread last year and it got me wondering how you made out. So, I googled your screen name and came up with this new thread.

As I recall, when you moved to the high mountains you could not find a mechanic that would re-jet your carb. You were advised by all the pundits here that your boat wouldn't run well without it.

You also put the boat away with 3 year old gas, saying that it was impossible for you to remove the old stale stuff.

As I also recall, you were having performance issues at the time and that's why you posted here.

Seems to me that your current problems have absolutely nothing to do with your new prop, but have everything to do with bad gas and an improper carb.

My suggestion is to go back to the 2020 thread and implement all the recommendations that were made back then. Maybe you could send your boat back to Florida where you have a trusted mechanic., if no one locally will work on an old boat. I'm pretty sure you KNOW your gas and carb are bad, you just don't want to address it and continue to simply hope for the best.

Personally, I'm your age as well (I'm an old fart, but don't call me an old codger...LOL) and I do 99% of my own boat work. Why? Because I don't trust all those youngins that work in some of the boat yards. The only thing I DON"T do is the computer stuff. Only because I don't have the proprietary software to link into the newer engines. I was programming puters and writing code 50 years ago, so its not like I'm not competent. Doing a little manual work these days is what keeps my arthritis in check.

First, we didn't move to the "high mountains", but it is almost 5,000 ft..

We have a marine dealer/repair that works on our boat, right here. It's the only place, locally, that will work on older boats. We've had it "winterized" and "summerized" by them, as well as a few other things done. We trust them, but then again, we have to.
They told us that they don't re-jet carbs, so "that ends that". Nobody, and I have called around, will drain the fuel in our tank. So, being that, we have to use up the 1/2 tank of old gas that's in it. That old gas was mixed in with 1/2 tank of new that we added in Oct 2020.
When we had our old Florida prop on (19"), the engine ran fine, but just couldn't get the rpms up to where they should be. At almost FOT, it was at 2,200 rpm and should be, with right prop or whatever, at 4,600. When I say "almost FOT", I mean I was trying to get it to FOT, but engine would almost die (chocking up). So, this last "summerization", we had a new "high altitude" prop put on, but couldn't even get the boat up to 2,200 rpm! I would start chocking up.
So, since it appears there is no way we can drain the gas tank, but, in the Spring, I will check around again. When we have the boat "summerized" in May, we will have the carb and engine checked out, as well as a different size "high altitude" prop put on.
Nothing else we can do! And, no, we won't send the boat back to Florida to be worked on! LOL

 

[JimS123]

So, the gas just keeps getting older and older. If you're using E10 and eventually get phase separation, or if you're using E0 and finally get enough condensation from lack of use, then the boat won't run at all and then for sure you'll find a way to drain the gas.

BTW, 5000 feet is considered high altitude mountains, and the recommended prop is -3P.

 

[nola mike]

First, we didn't move to the "high mountains", but it is almost 5,000 ft..

We have a marine dealer/repair that works on our boat, right here. It's the only place, locally, that will work on older boats. We've had it "winterized" and "summerized" by them, as well as a few other things done. We trust them, but then again, we have to.
They told us that they don't re-jet carbs, so "that ends that". Nobody, and I have called around, will drain the fuel in our tank. So, being that, we have to use up the 1/2 tank of old gas that's in it. That old gas was mixed in with 1/2 tank of new that we added in Oct 2020.
When we had our old Florida prop on (19"), the engine ran fine, but just couldn't get the rpms up to where they should be. At almost FOT, it was at 2,200 rpm and should be, with right prop or whatever, at 4,600. When I say "almost FOT", I mean I was trying to get it to FOT, but engine would almost die (chocking up). So, this last "summerization", we had a new "high altitude" prop put on, but couldn't even get the boat up to 2,200 rpm! I would start chocking up.
So, since it appears there is no way we can drain the gas tank, but, in the Spring, I will check around again. When we have the boat "summerized" in May, we will have the carb and engine checked out, as well as a different size "high altitude" prop put on.
Nothing else we can do! And, no, we won't send the boat back to Florida to be worked on! LOL

You now have another full tank of old gas, and your carb still needs to be cleaned. A prop still won't solve your problem. Rinse and repeat on this thread.

 

[LuvBoating]

So, the gas just keeps getting older and older. If you're using E10 and eventually get phase separation, or if you're using E0 and finally get enough condensation from lack of use, then the boat won't run at all and then for sure you'll find a way to drain the gas.

BTW, 5000 feet is considered high altitude mountains, and the recommended prop is -3P.

I'm sure the marine mechanic that "summerizes" it, will know what to do if he can't get the engine started. I will, of which I already have, ask them again, about draining the tank. If they can't, and we can't find anywhere to have it done, it simply can't be done. The marine service we had the tank drained at in Jacksonville, FL., had a Holding Tank for draining old gas.
Here in Colorado, 5,000 ft. is considered the "low area", since the highest elevation goes up to 12,000 ft.. They call above 5,000, the "high country". I-70 runs thru it going West.
What prop size would -3P be?

 

[LuvBoating]

You now have another full tank of old gas, and your carb still needs to be cleaned. A prop still won't solve your problem. Rinse and repeat on this thread.

"Full tank of old gas" is not what we have! 1/2 of the tank of new gas was put in in Oct 2020. Yes, that gas has mixed with old gas, but, nothing we could do about that. And, not all boaters can use up a tank of gas in a summer. We sure wouldn't and haven't.
Guess we'll see if a new prop will help, along with the mechanic checking the carb and engine plugs.

 

[nola mike]

"Full tank of old gas" is not what we have! 1/2 of the tank of new gas was put in in Oct 2020. Yes, that gas has mixed with old gas, but, nothing we could do about that. And, not all boaters can use up a tank of gas in a summer. We sure wouldn't and haven't.
Guess we'll see if a new prop will help, along with the mechanic checking the carb and engine plugs.

It isn't new anymore. It's now ½ tank of old gas, ½ tank of older gas

 

[LuvBoating]

It isn't new anymore. It's now ½ tank of old gas, ½ tank of older gas

Ok. Or as old Bernie said in Weekend At Bernie's movie, "whatever". LOL

 

[JimS123]

I'm sure the marine mechanic that "summerizes" it, will know what to do if he can't get the engine started.

No value here. If it runs on the muffs at the mechanic's shop (and it probably will) it may not run in the water after you leave the dock. Your carb needs cleaning and rebuilding. If he won't fix the jets, maybe he doesn't know how to rebuild a carb either. (I know very few that do know how to do it where I live as well).

If they can't, and we can't find anywhere to have it done, it simply can't be done.

We went over this last year in detail. No problemo. You just don't want to, so no reason to tell you again.

What prop size would -3P be?

-3P vs. what made the boat run well in the first place, i.e, WOT at or near the max specification for the particular engine, i.e with a tuned engine, clean carb and fresh gas.

 

[racerone]

Just my opinion.----Many folks today are not well versed on the operation of machinery.----Blunt statement here.----If you are only getting 2200 RPM out of an engine it is more than a " wrong prop issue ".----Perhaps even the tachometer is giving a false reading.

 

[JimS123]

It isn't new anymore. It's now ½ tank of old gas, ½ tank of older gas

1/2 tank of good new gas + 1/2 tank of bad old gas = full tank of bad gas.

Its like beer. If someone pies in you beer, it doesn't matter if it was a little pie or a half a bottle of pie, you don't want to drink it ever....

 

[nola mike]

No value here. If it runs on the muffs at the mechanic's shop (and it probably will) it may not run in the water after you leave the dock. Your carb needs cleaning and rebuilding. If he won't fix the jets, maybe he doesn't know how to rebuild a carb either. (I know very few that do know how to do it where I live as well).


We went over this last year in detail. No problemo. You just don't want to, so no reason to tell you again.


-3P vs. what made the boat run well in the first place, i.e, WOT at or near the max specification for the particular engine, i.e with a tuned engine, clean carb and fresh gas.

1/2 tank of good new gas + 1/2 tank of bad old gas = full tank of bad gas.

Its like beer. If someone pies in you beer, it doesn't matter if it was a little pie or a half a bottle of pie, you don't want to drink it ever....

This guy is either willfully ignorant or a very determined troll. Either way, I'd give 10:1 odds that he never gets this thing working correctly again.

 

[LuvBoating]

No value here. If it runs on the muffs at the mechanic's shop (and it probably will) it may not run in the water after you leave the dock. Your carb needs cleaning and rebuilding. If he won't fix the jets, maybe he doesn't know how to rebuild a carb either. (I know very few that do know how to do it where I live as well).


We went over this last year in detail. No problemo. You just don't want to, so no reason to tell you again.


-3P vs. what made the boat run well in the first place, i.e, WOT at or near the max specification for the particular engine, i.e with a tuned engine, clean carb and fresh gas.

Where do you get the idea we "don't want to"? I simply can't do and wouldn't even try. And, if this marine mechanic tells us there isn't a problem with the carb, I have to believe him. He is the marine mechanic, I definitely am not. And, on top that, people have to believe their vehicle mechanic. Again, he is the professional. If the carb needs rebuilding, he will let us know.
I know the difference between running the engine on muffs and running WOT on the water.
I just don't know WHY, there are those that will put-down marine mechanics. If folks can do their own repairs, that's fine, but to put-down the trade seems unnecessary to me. Members on this forum wouldn't like being put-down for whatever.

 

[JimS123]

Since the advent of ethanol gas, and with phase separation problems everywhere, there is no place in the USA that doesn't have the facilities to drain gas, whether it be a car or a boat.

I realize some people might be scared to do it themself, and I respect that. I'm a computer guy myself, not a mechanic, plus I'm old and don't have the strength I once did. But when we had our famous October storm and we lost power for 3 days, and no gas station within 100 miles was operating, I learned how to suck gas in a hurry. It only took $1.57 in parts and when the power came back on both my cars and 2 boats had their tanks sucked almost dry.....LOL. Thank goodness we had a gas generator - it saved my frozen food and water pipes.

I have 2 trusted mechanics - one for my old stuff with carbs and points, and another for my new computer controlled engines. But getting them wasn't easy. I went thru a bunch of shade tree mechanics that really didn't know what they were doing, and only told me what I wanted to hear. If you have a problem and have to go back to the same mechanic twice, you need another mechanic.

 

[LuvBoating]

We bought a hose assembly, when we first arrived back here in Colorado, for getting the gas out of the boat tank, but the hose wouldn't go all the way into the tank (filler) from the back of the boat. I pushed the hose until it stopped, pulled it out and not a drop of gas was on it. Then we thought, "what are we going to put the gas in that is siphoned out?". Fifty some gallons. Didn't have a thing. I did unbolt the rear bench seat, unscrew the plate covering the access point to the tank, but after that, I thought the same thing again "what will we put 50+ gallons in?" and didn't continue. I screwed the plate back on and rebolted the rear bench seat back.

We have two very trustworthy places we take our Durango to. One place doesn't do any kind of electrical or engine work (tires, brakes, alignment only) and the other places does the rest.

The marine service we go to, does plenty of new, old and older boats. It can be very surprising how many boats are in northern Colorado. We actually have three watersports/powerboating lakes. The other marine service won't touch an older boat, like ours. "Absolutely not" they told us.

 

[topgun3690]

" And, if this marine mechanic tells us there isn't a problem with the carb, I have to believe him. He is the marine mechanic, I definitely am not. And, on top that, people have to believe their vehicle mechanic. Again, he is the professional. If the carb needs rebuilding, he will let us know." And that pretty much sums it up right there......like was said before, this forum is for folks who are trying to fix their motors themselves. Advice has been given for your issues, but you respond with " I simply can't do and wouldn't even try." or " I do very little in the form of repair/maintenance to our boat, so my DIY is basically nothing." Seems like your only choice is to take it back to this marine service and hope for the best. Do you know the meaning of the acronym B.O.H.I.C.A ?

 

[JimS123]

Do you know the meaning of the acronym B.O.H.I.C.A ?

Only happened to me once. I admit it. He seemed like a good mechanic, but looking back I always seemed to have to spend a few extra dollars for yada,yada. Then, it was an expensive estimate. I crawled under the car and it looked OK to me. So, I went to a Chevy dealer for a simple oil change and told him to look at so-and-so. He said not to worry, all was well. Don't go to that mechanic again.

"Google is your friend" (oh I hate that phrase but, sometimes....)
* 27 million hits on how to drain and recycle gasoline
* multiple pages of gasoline recycling centers in Denver

How about this:
* Craigslist ad: "FREE semi good gasoline - yousuckitout. Will deliver boat to your location" (Oh, never mind, can't do that)

 

[LuvBoating]

Ok, here is the "bottom line", for now: Once, next May, when we get the boat "summerized" and whatever is checked, will let the thread/forum know what happens. That's it!

 

[achris]

We are trying to help you. But it appears you don't want the help, you're here to troll. You trust the mechanic, great, let him deal with it, and stop asking here for advice you have no intention of taking.

Thread closed!