Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 1968?

[knibbeje]

Hi, We were hoping to leave Monday on vacation but now we don't know what to do!

We have Mercury inline 6 1000, serial # 2413225, we believe this is a 1968 or 1969 (can someone tell us for sure which year it is?)

We were finishing up putting a new battery on at dusk and someone put the battery in the battery box reversed and somehow polarity was reversed when we first hooked it back up. Motor ran great right before we switched battery.

The next day we got to lake and no spark on any cylinder. We did some basic troubleshooting using guides on line. We think the problem is in the Switch Box. (local marina sells for over $600!!) Then if we replace that we don't know if the ignition coil or parts in the distibutor could be bad.

can someone walk us through things to test before we buy and throw electrical parts at it? Is it likely that with this type of reversed polarity mishap that more than 1 part is fried?

Can someone give me the part number for the oem switch box?

We found that CDI seems to make an aftermarket switch box CDI 114-2986, but the CDI page doesn't list our serial number as a cross reference that fits but yet it says our year range and type of motor fits. We aren't sure it is compatible.

Thanks a ton for your help!
JDK

 

[Coloradolakeboy]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

Does your motor have a rectifier? If so, there is a test for it and it is a cheap part! They will blow if polarity is crossed and leave you with no spark.

 

[knibbeje]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

Hi,
Thanks to those who replied. We replaced the switch box and we have spark and it runs fine. However we have no charging now. I think we blew the rectifier. Can someone help with the proper part number? I see oldmercs dot com lists what appears to be an aftermarket rectifier but looks very different from what we have. Ebay has some listings for OEM ones but not sure which part number I need. Maybe someone can confirm part number? Our serial is 2413225

Thanks
JDK

 

[knibbeje]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

Hi,
Can someone help. Replaced the switch box and rectifier. Engine starts great but only 12.7 or 12.8V at the battery when running. Prior to our mishap (switch polarity at battery) we had about 14.+ when running. is there another component that is involved in charging the battery besides the rectifier? Stator? But then we wouldn't have spark right? Thanks

 

[Gomer50]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

The recitifier has nothing to do with spark.The recitifier is for your charging system only.When at idle you should only see approx. 12.6/8 when rpms go up so should your charging voltage.At around 2000 rpm you should see 13+ volts.14+ voltage is a bit high but I have heard that some have had 16+ volts.

 

[CharlieB]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

Reversed battery cables toasted the rectifier quicker than a heatbeat.

Check the CDIElectronics website to find the replacement part.

Test to confirm, disconnect all wires, you should have Ohm readings one direction only one each yellow to the red, reverse meter leads and you should have no continuity.

 

[mr 88]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

Motor is 1968.

 

[knibbeje]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

Thanks to all who have contributed. I think some were confused. Initially the polarity was reversed and indeed the switch box was fried. We replaced that and had spark back again and motor runs fine. Now no charging though. We assumed rectifier was blown and put a new one on, now still no charging (nothing higher than 12.6 or 12.7V either with idle, revs, or with motor off) So I'm assuming next step is to test or replace rectifier? I bought one that was 'guaranteed working' If I put another 'working' or new rectifier and still don't have charging then what could be the next problem? Thanks

 

[knibbeje]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

ON this test with the ohm meter, are you saying that it is NORMAL (part is working normally) if you have ohm readings in one direction and not the other? Or that means it is bad? How does the bad part read with the meter? I have one 'bad' one that I took off that I can test and the new one I replaced was used and I'm suspecting it is bad as well. I need a way to test it. Thanks

 

[Gomer50]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

If you want to save yourself a few bucks on recitifiers get one of these from radioshack ,they work well and are dirt cheap.

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062584

 

[merc850]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196


Here's a chart for rectifier testing and you can use an ohmmeter.

 

[knibbeje]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

Mr. 88,
Here is an interesting twist. I found this marine lookup site (www.maurermarine.com) that has detailed parts lists and pictures or OEM Mercury parts. They list the motors by year, hp and then by serial number. It shows two motors that could include my serial number (2413225), both the 1968 Mercury 1000 and the 1968 mercury 1000SS (they also had a 1000bp model) When I looked up the picture of the rectifier (oem style) on the 1000 model and in my serial number range it showed one that clearly is not in my motor. It only has 2 terminals on the top with no color coding and it looks like it mounts differently.

Here is a picture of the one that the parts lookup says goes to the plain merc 1000 model:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Merc...sories_Gear&hash=item4399f99a01#ht_759wt_1165

But when I switch models to the 1000SS and my serial number then it shows this type of rectifier and it matches exactly what my factory OEM one looks like (color coded terminals on the side) as in this ebay link:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2910...sories_Gear&hash=item19c4cbe2dd#ht_1208wt_939

Anyone know why different rectifier in the 1000 vs 1000ss or what other differences there might be in the two models? Any other way to tell them apart by cowling markings etc?

Looking into this has made me reluctant to buy the plain CDI brand non-oem replacement as it has 3 studs on it and I'm not sure which wire goes where!

thanks for your advice
JDK

 

[merc850]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

The first one was the early diode type that replaced the plate type (see last attachment) used in the'50's and it mounts with a bolt, if you want to put the second link one in it is the 2nd generation type that will fit your mounting style. The 1000 was the first 100 hp outboard and it used breaker points, the 1000SS has Thunderbolt electronic ignition (no points) I guess that SS stands for "solid state" ie. transistors. As for wiring the non-Mercury one should be labeled ALT, ALT, +, the yellow wires from under the flywheel would go to the ALT terminals and the + goes to the positive terminal wire and make sure that you unplug the wiring harness plug before you mount the rectifier, then attach the leads.

 

[knibbeje]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

Merc850. That added information is wonderful! I understand now the SS part and yes, I do have Thunderbolt ignition now that you say it. Can you explain to a non-mechanic why there are two yellow wires that go to the ALT posts. IS the flywheel creating two separate supplies of AC current?

What did you mean by the last sentence, what happens if you hook up the new rectifier to the harness before bolting to the frame? short or arcing? Does the battery have to be disconnected for the repair process? or does it matter?

Also, for those who have used the radio shack rectifier, you mentioned that the wiring has to be altered or is it the same setup as the last post suggests with both yellows on the 'alternator' and the red on the positive DC output.

I'm going to try to test my 2 rectifiers using the helpful diagram above. Thanks

 

[Gomer50]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

There is no difference on how the radioshack recitifier is hooked up except the radioshack has one extra terminal that needs to grounded out to the cowling or block depending on where you mount it.I also needs to mounted so so the back is on a flat metal surface to dissapate heat.2 terminals for AC from the Stator, 1 terminal for 12 volt and 1 terminal for ground.These do work pretty darn good,and only for a couple bucks.Also take a look at your Stator wires up under the flywheel the insulation tends to get brittle there and could cause shorting.

 

[merc850]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

Just make sure that the battery is disconnected before working on the engine. The alternator puts out AC current that is rectified into DC to charge the battery.

 

[knibbeje]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

Merc850:
I took the test diagram tonight and performed the test on the rectifier as it is mounted in the motor. I assume it grounds through the back plate but I did have the battery disconnected. I did the 4 tests listed in the diagram above. The explanation indicates that if test 1 and 3 fail then the diodes are open circuited and if 2 and 4 fail then they are short circuited. Well, I had something odd, I had tests 1 show no continuity (should have had it), test 2 had no continuity as well. Test 3 and 4 did as they were supposed to. Do I figure I still better buy a new one?

I took the old rectifier (fried when battery had switched polarity) and tested it on the bench (not grounded?) I had no continuity on any test of the 4. Does this confirm the problem in the rectifier (new one that I replaced?)

I checked wires and there is a fair amount of cracking of insulation but I repaired this, I didn't take the flywheel/stator part out to inspect that yet. I figured if stator was bad I wouldn't have spark or could there be spark, normal running and yet have a charging problem from the stator portion?

THanks for all your help

 

[Gomer50]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

You will have spark as long as the battery has a charge of more than 9+ volts,after that if the stator/recitifier is bad and not charging the battery you are dead in the water.

 

[merc850]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

If you are going to "take the flywheel off" buy a puller they have them on ebay, but , if you are going to take it apart (not recommended) put a mark on the hub and flexplate so you put it together correctly.

 

[knibbeje]

Re: Would really appreciate help with Spark on Mercury 1000 Thunderbolt ignition, 196

I took the test diagram tonight and performed the test on the rectifier as it is mounted in the motor. I assume it grounds through the back plate but I did have the battery disconnected. I did the 4 tests listed in the diagram above. The explanation indicates that if test 1 and 3 fail then the diodes are open circuited and if 2 and 4 fail then they are short circuited. Well, I had something odd, I had tests 1 show no continuity (should have had it), test 2 had no continuity as well (normal per test procedure chart). Test 3 and 4 did as they were supposed to. Do I figure I still better buy a new one?