Who has installed Helicoils ?

[flyingscott]

Are my post so complicated to read, what is it that your brain doesn't fully understand. There's no more machine shop. I'm going for a Time Sert install, not an Helicoil install. Two different scenarios. one easier than the other so don't play being funny on line. BTW, have you joined FB's fan club to ridicule me in Stereo ?

Happy Boating​

I hate to break it to you but my 10 steps can also be applied to time Serts. You are so unhappy did your mom not hug you enough? Maybe your dad did not say you were his special little guy enough? Tell you what if you ever get over by Lake Winnebago in Wi call me. I will run and give you that hug you so sorely need. 1 more piece of advice, Time Serts work no better than Heli Coils. Ask anybody that owned a pre 2005 Northstar caddy how they hold up.

 

[Faztbullet]

I only use Helicoils if I cant use a Keensert. If their good enough for mercury should be good enough for everybody.

 

[racerone]

Is the item beside that ring a heli-coil ?

 

[Faztbullet]

Tis a Keensert, drill,tap, thread in,drive lock pins down to secure it.

 

[racerone]

That is what I thought.----Also very simple.

 

[KJM]

So how did it work out? I installed one this summer on a stripped oil drain plug on my Quad this summer. Stupidly, I used a cordless impact gun on the bolt after the helicoil and stripped the helicoil! Be careful not to overtighten when working with aluminum! I don't blame you for asking questions, its better to be sure before you start because you won't get a second chance.

 

[Sea Rider]

Hey FS, if something I have way more than enough it's called Creativity so won't teach me a thing...

Finally ended installing a headless M8 x 1.25 Time Sert threaded in a non deep blind bolt orifice, now sits flat even in the crankcase's side wall. The issue is that no one tells you that Helicoils stretches and protrudes out way more once installed, need to be ordered way less in size than the hole's depth calls for or repent having a bad day resizing them to sit bit under the orifice.

Happy Boating

 

[Texasmark]

Well the coil has to remain in the tapped hole so it is deliberately designed as an interference fit. With that said, if its a certain length relaxed, and stretches for an interference fit, then obviously they will be longer installed than sitting on the work bench. They come in different lengths.

 

[Sea Rider]

Have seen many easy peachy YouTube Helicoil videos installs and none stated that need to install a shorter one due to its natural stretching capability once coiled than what the already threaded orifice depth calls for specially in blind non deep orifice installs. Luckily didn't went that way installing a 15 mm length Helicoil in a 15 mm threaded depth orifice to be screwed soon after install.

Happy Boating

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[Sea Rider]

Stripped another orifice thread which was heated up with a propane torch to remove an extremely salted bolt that broke its head off on removal. Going for that invasive method will definitely cause to weaken any internal orifice's threads which will be pulled off when a new bolt is screwed in and torqued high to factory specs. Scenario :​

It's an open orifice which has been perfectly drilled and tapped 16 mm deep, plan to screw fully in a headless 16 mm Time-Sert. Question : As don't want it to go any further in and pass the edge's border would like to add a light coat of Permatex red thread locker with a small brush along the entire length of the block's internal thread and the external TS threads. Was wondering if it would be effective to add a light coat at both sides (*) to achieve a tight TS fit to the block ?​

Happy Boating

 

[ahicks]

Sea Rider, working with stuff run in the salt, I get in to this situation on occasion (too often actually). Early on, I USED to try and fix them. Have been the Helicoil route on a head bolt a few times, with mixed results (tried using the head for a drill guide trick too). I got tired of rolling the dice on the finished product AND all the tedius prep work/coil install. I can swap out an entire block nearly as quickly. That would be my advice, especially when working on a smaller motor. Go out on the used parts market, find a block at a reasonable price, and just swap it out. Many times you can find "fresh water only" part that's are all cleaned up and ready to go with a very reasonable price. -Al

 

[Sea Rider]

Thanks Al, going that route will end collecting several powerheads if the plan is to swap them instead to fix broken head bolts or stripped internal block's threads. Won't find down here motors run in fresh water and a bad idea to buy second hand ones, nobody flushed them after use, imagine the huge salt contents building up inside the powehead's cooling water passages.

Don't have any issues installing Time-Serts or Hellicoils, count with the proper tools some of which were expressively made at a machine shop that didn't come with the kits which eased the installation of both systems. It's a fun DIY work which has passed through a learning curve like everything...

Happy Boating
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[Faztbullet]

I would take a sharp punch and peen it in place once inserted...

 

[Sea Rider]

I would take a sharp punch and peen it in place once inserted...

Standard Time Serts or headless ones should be previously bonded with red Loctite, 24 hours after application to bond nicely time to place a new head gasket, screw in 10 new M8 bolts torqued in proper sequence to specs with a torque wrench to avoid uneven torquing pressures on the entire head's gasket which will lead to achieve future oxidation, corrotion, pitting issues on the block's front and head mating surfaces, much worse if the motor runs in salty water.

If the TS is not bonded with Loctite these scenarios will happen : If the lower portion of the bolt hasn't fully expanded the reduced diam the lower portion of the TS has which locks against the lower tapped hole the entire TS will be pulled out when the head is removed again. When installing the head back over non blind holes, as the lower bolt's end drives the TS fully down could end being driven too deep and miss the TS flat border alignment against the block's edge you were aiming for, bad music!!

Have written the Loctite Company regarding what asked here, lets see what's their tech response ?

Happy Boating​

 

[racerone]

Company where I worked we installed Helicoils in aircraft navigation components.----That was 50 years ago.-----Should be simple to install in outboard motors today.----Just my 2 pennies worth.

 

[Sea Rider]

Company where I worked we installed Helicoils in aircraft navigation components.----That was 50 years ago.-----Should be simple to install in outboard motors today.----Just my 2 pennies worth.

Don't have issues installing Time Serts on perfectly drilled and tapped non blind open holes, just wanted to know if need to apply Loctite at both extremes or just at the inner block's thread or over the TS outer thread ? Once it's known the installation is darn easy peasy...

Happy Boating
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[Faztbullet]

Wont make any difference if you use a lil or a lot or where its applied. As it is inserted it will coat nearly 360° of the threads as its turned. Then when salt water weeps by the dissimilar metals will corrode themselves in place.

 

[Sea Rider]

As didn't received a proper answer from the Loctite Company asked someone who has installed many, suggested to coat the whole tapped hole extension insert the headless TS and coat with Loctite the final 1/3 TS extension. That way the TS won't remove the beginning of the coated hole while making its way fully in. The final 1/3 TS extension will be sealed nicely in place. As wanted the TS not to go any deeper inside the open hole and miss the correct edge's alignment while screwing it in, it occurred to me this simple, effective and peanuts cost alignment tool...​

For installation, oil the inner TS and upper 1/3 bolt extension, screw in the TS till stops flushed even with the flat washer, screw the TS fully in hard till stops screwing in, once the bolt is pulled out with will see a well aligned TS against the block's border....

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Happy Boating​

 

[Faztbullet]

How did you make lower portion expand and lock in place?

 

[Sea Rider]

How did you make lower portion expand and lock in place?

As of now the lower TS portion remains as an immaculate virgin. The lower TS portion will be side locked as soon a new lower bolt passes thru the neck/reduction by 2 mm. Hope that no other thread is pulled while the cylinder head is being firmly torqued to 28 NM. If happens, have the correct tools and inserts to take proper care of any blind or non blind hole.

Happy Boating​