What the heck is this?

[POINTER94]

Too many jobs. I must have been misreading all the posts here stating that we have an unemployment problem. Perhaps if BIG employer would just move the jobs to locations that are convenient to those who complain this wouldn't be an issue?

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/070825/western_workers.html?.v=4

 

[Vlad D Impeller]

Re: What the heck is this?

I guess that's what they mean when they say that there are some jobs that Americans won't do.

 

[thurps]

Re: What the heck is this?

I'm convinced. I'm moving to Montana, buying a house and raising a family on my $10/$12 hr. burger flipping job.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: What the heck is this?

Seems to be alot of arrogance as to what it means to take care of ones self. If I had to do this to eat, and live-damn straight I would (and have). That is what the American dream is about. WORKING.... BUILDING ON THAT WORK... GROWING... I guess you missed the oil field jobs that are taking all the labor, but hey, that part of the story seems to have been missed by some. But as long as the government is willing to hand out charity to those not willing to do a days work for a days pay, I guess we can continue to expect these type of responses.

Of course you could always take the intellectually superior route and wait for a CEO position to open up. I mean there are litterly millions of Americans qualified for those positions. Those, that is, that have no clue what it takes to do the job. At least it can be used as a justification for doing nothing....

The condescending approach towards work in this country is becoming somewhat disturbing.

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: What the heck is this?

What Pointer said. ^^^^^ Blunt n' to the point. (Wish I could do that, [prolly has more then one functional cell]). JR

 

[rolmops]

Re: What the heck is this?

Seems to be alot of arrogance as to what it means to take care of ones self. If I had to do this to eat, and live-damn straight I would (and have). That is what the American dream is about. WORKING.... BUILDING ON THAT WORK... GROWING... I guess you missed the oil field jobs that are taking all the labor, but hey, that part of the story seems to have been missed by some. But as long as the government is willing to hand out charity to those not willing to do a days work for a days pay, I guess we can continue to expect these type of responses.

Of course you could always take the intellectually superior route and wait for a CEO position to open up. I mean there are litterly millions of Americans qualified for those positions. Those, that is, that have no clue what it takes to do the job. At least it can be used as a justification for doing nothing....

The condescending approach towards work in this country is becoming somewhat disturbing.

I was taught that those who do not work, shall not eat. But those who cannot work must be helped.So I to have been known to shovel $h1d.
The fact that there is almost no unemployment points to the fact that most people seem to live that way.
In a capitalist society the shortage of labor increases its value.If a living wage is offered for labor offered,the problem will solve itself.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: What the heck is this?

I was taught that those who do not work, shall not eat. But those who cannot work must be helped.So I to have been known to shovel $h1d.
The fact that there is almost no unemployment points to the fact that most people seem to live that way.
In a capitalist society the shortage of labor increases its value.If a living wage is offered for labor offered,the problem will solve itself.

You are 100% right. I couldn't agree more. You float two grey areas that some have jumped all over as an excuse to do nothing:

1) "But those who cannot work must be helped."
Our victim society has everyone with an excuse not to work. My dog ran away as a kid and I have PTSD. Everyone seems to have an excuse.

2) "In a capitalist society....."
The introduction of a nanny government who will actually pay people to sit on their arses and claim victimhood may negate this entire line of thought. Our rush to equal eliminates the fair. I highly doubt our existing system would qualify as true capitalism, but it is highly capitalistic...

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: What the heck is this?

I was taught that those who do not work, shall not eat. But those who cannot work must be helped.So I to have been known to shovel $h1d.
The fact that there is almost no unemployment points to the fact that most people seem to live that way.
In a capitalist society the shortage of labor increases its value.If a living wage is offered for labor offered,the problem will solve itself.

OK the troll hooked a dim wit with only one brain cell: Rolmops. The bone I will always pick with those in favor of Socialism is the one highlighted. Define: "LIVING WAGE" fer a guy with only one brain cell. BETCHA can't!!!

Now lets jus' say some real powerful Nanny Gubmint type, (affectionately known as ol' Uncle Joe), with the power to set this LIVIN' wage sets it at say $5.00 per hour. Fine. Since this same feller, (ol' Uncle Joe) also prints the money we use he can print enough $, (ya know Mrs Jones too many $ chasin' too few ham sandwitches), to make the price of a ham sandwitch $5.00.

OH NO the dim wits holler!! Poor people are only able ta buy a ham sandwitch fer an hours werk we need to force ol' Murky ta pay $100.00 per hour. Guess what: once Uncle Joe forces Murky ta pay $100.00 per hour the ol' ham sandwitch SOON costs $100.00! N' yes: Mrs Jones you guessed it: the dim wits holler at Uncle Joe ta do it ta Murky again.

I vote fer $1000.00 per hour minimum, n' anybody not willin ta pay goes directly ta "Club Hautmo" Gulag without getin' their $200.00? Whatcha say ta that: Willis?

JR

 

[ricksrster]

Re: What the heck is this?

What the heck this is;
BIG oil is hiring people for high wages because they have work to be done in the oil fields of Montana. Big oils is suckiung up the labor force because of BIG pay rates.
Micky D can't compete with BIG oil's wages to get people to say "Would you like an apple pie today?"
SO Micky D is offering higher pay to attract people to flip burgers so the BIG oil people can order a BIG MAC for lunch.
BIG oil's high pay rate and competition in the labor force has "tricked down" to the lower paying jobs at Micky D's making them raise pays to be competitive in the labor market.
Now that Micky D is offering more money to attract employees the other houses of fine burger cuisine have to raise their pay scales to compete with Micky.
This is called the American Way. It is how he country was set up to operate in the year of our Lord 1776.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: What the heck is this?

Rickster,

Where is Big government in all this? Other than big taxes?

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: What the heck is this?

I'm convinced. I'm moving to Montana, buying a house and raising a family on my $10/$12 hr. burger flipping job.

Some guys would just prefer to live in the GayBay and buy Levi's while collecting their welfare. Most of us call them degenerate bums.

 

[Vlad D Impeller]

Re: What the heck is this?

Folks who are smart enough to work in the oil fields, do not flip burgers for a living, unless for reasons unknown that is the only job available to them, eventually they would move to where the jobs that they're qualified for are.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: What the heck is this?

Folks who are smart enough to work in the oil fields, do not flip burgers for a living, unless for reasons unknown that is the only job available to them, eventually they would move to where the jobs that they're qualified for are.

Exactly. But if it is the only job, you take it, and do it well, watch for other opportunities... Or sit on your butt, let the government take care of you, and whine when your "benefits" run out.

I love Vlad's response. Great post

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: What the heck is this?

This really doesn't have much relevance to this thread, but I've now worked at the same place long enough to say I felt the difference from 2002 to 2007, as far as labor, or quality thereof, is concerned.

When I first started, there were 10 people waiting in line to get a job, if you didn't want to do your job for what you were paid, someone behind you would. That was when I made 6 bucks an hour. Now, with a labor shortage and horrible employees, my employer has just given me a raise to over 11 an hour to do the same job as in 2002. If I stay, I know another raise will be in the works soon. I also have more pull than almost anyone there, if I speak, the boss listens, as he doesn't want to lose me. Friday morning he begged me to stay "as long as possible" with him. Hmm.....kinda nice when the shoe is on the other foot.

So I can say for a fact that when labor gets scarce it increases in value.

 

[rolmops]

Re: What the heck is this?

OK the troll hooked a dim wit with only one brain cell: Rolmops. The bone I will always pick with those in favor of Socialism is the one highlighted. Define: "LIVING WAGE" fer a guy with only one brain cell. BETCHA can't!!!

Now lets jus' say some real powerful Nanny Gubmint type, (affectionately known as ol' Uncle Joe), with the power to set this LIVIN' wage sets it at say $5.00 per hour. Fine. Since this same feller, (ol' Uncle Joe) also prints the money we use he can print enough $, (ya know Mrs Jones too many $ chasin' too few ham sandwitches), to make the price of a ham sandwitch $5.00.

OH NO the dim wits holler!! Poor people are only able ta buy a ham sandwitch fer an hours werk we need to force ol' Murky ta pay $100.00 per hour. Guess what: once Uncle Joe forces Murky ta pay $100.00 per hour the ol' ham sandwitch SOON costs $100.00! N' yes: Mrs Jones you guessed it: the dim wits holler at Uncle Joe ta do it ta Murky again.

I vote fer $1000.00 per hour minimum, n' anybody not willin ta pay goes directly ta "Club Hautmo" Gulag without getin' their $200.00? Whatcha say ta that: Willis?

JR

Thanks for calling me a dim wit. But then again,what can you expect from someone with only one (possibly damaged) braincell?
More to the point.What do I consider a living wage.
In my opinion,a living wage,is the minimal amount needed in order to provide food, shelter,basic health care and a means of transport to and from work.
These needs should be provided in return for an up to ten hours day of labor tendered.
Of course you can haul in the inflation demons,but those demons are brought to life by too much money chasing too few goods.
Too much money in the hands of too few people would have the exact same potential of inflation,or worse,deflation where too many goods chase too little money,causing businesses to go under
Besides,a booming economy should, in capitalist economic terms, create a drip down effect.You know,the term made famous by your favorite president Reagan.
I can hardly imagine why anyone would try to prevent this drip down business from reaching low level employees...

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: What the heck is this?

Thanks for calling me a dim wit. But then again,what can you expect from someone with only one (possibly damaged) braincell?

Where did I call you a dim wit? (I was refering to the guy with only one brain cell, (hopefully not damaged) that you hooked with yer troll; yes Mrs Jones: ol' Murky. I know you are not a dim wit, misguided n' maybe ya partake in some very powerfull wacky tabaceeee but no dim wit.

More to the point.What do I consider a living wage.
In my opinion,a living wage,is the minimal amount needed in order to provide food, shelter,basic health care and a means of transport to and from work.
These needs should be provided in return for an up to ten hours day of labor tendered.

Hmmmmmmm, Since this huge Country has a great deal of variance on the cost of every single factor ya mentioned jus' how ya plan to use Uncle Joe's power to force yer irrational FEELINS' on what I should pay fer labor with me own money down me throat. Ever thought 'bout that: Willis? How 'bout kids, ya wanna make sure they never UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANSES get starter summer jobs: Willis? Real nice that Libs know how ta run me own bidness. When Murky's bidness fails do ya have a plan fer Murky's morphin' into VICTIMHOOD: Willis? Hmmmmmmm. I say, purdy irrational, if ya have even a token, (didn't say TOKE Rolmops, Murky knows ya got that part down pat), understandin' of bidness 101.

Of course you can haul in the inflation demons,but those demons are brought to life by too much money chasing too few goods.

Hmmmmmm, Willis jus' who decides how much money ta print? Uncle Joe is it not? Hmmmmmm?

Too much money in the hands of too few people would have the exact same potential of inflation,or worse,deflation where too many goods chase too little money,causing businesses to go under
Besides,a booming economy should, in capitalist economic terms, create a drip down effect.You know,the term made famous by your favorite president Reagan.
I can hardly imagine why anyone would try prevent this drip down business from reaching low level employees...

Rolmops: who would ever want to prevent "trickle down ecomonics", yer proposal to force Murky to pay some sort of magic figure fer labor that makes ya FEEEEEEEEEL good, (n' aparently helps yer irrational guilt over somethin' unknown, that is only helped by forcing others to do what you want) has no relationship to what ya just said. Ya got some of that smoke? I know yer a real smart feller with far more world wide 'speriences then ol' Murky, but yer cornsiderble brain seems ta short out on Econ 101. Respectfully, JR

 

[QC]

Re: What the heck is this?

Does a "living wage" apply to a High School kid over summer? A College kid making some extra cash? What do you guys think happens to part time work when the minimum wage becomes $17.50 or $19.50 or $21.50? Is the "poverty line" where a living wage needs to go? If so, whatever that number is just divide it by 2000 and you arrive at the new minimum wage required to make it a so called "living wage". The concept cannot be achieved without regulating small businesses out of existence. And if you do find a fair "living wage", should I be taxed down to that level so that the Gov't can also afford to pay everyone that number? Profitable businesses lead to higher wages . . . Considering legal business evil leads to lower wages e.g. big bad __________ (fill in the blank Blo Ho, oh yeah, make sure it is any legal business other than yours)

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: What the heck is this?

Not quite sure why Qubblin' Cat chooses to name me, but....
Apparently it is BIG OIL's fault, & the 'trickle down theory" door swings both ways......
If BIG OIL has taken all of the eligible recruits for their operations, then the other businesses owners in the area will either have to raise wages or do the jobs themselves.....
I fail to see how a 'living wage' or 'minimum wage' have an bearing in this scenario......
You will need to raise the wages to meet the demand.......
Apparently there are not enough high school kids to fill the demand....

Considering legal business evil leads to lower wages e.g. big bad __________ (fill in the blank Blo Ho, oh yeah, make sure it is any legal business other than yours)
Not sure what you mean here, it seems that (legal business evil), (what ever that is), it is leading to higher wages.....
A sack of flour cost $100 during the gold rush.......
You are gonna have to make people want to go fill the void....
How you say?.......
Higher wages....
Capitalism at work, IMHO....
The upside is that these jobs can't be outsourced, but it also shouldn't mean a free pass for illegal immigrants or low skilled worker 'visas', at least until the "anchor baby' loophole is closed......​

 

[rolmops]

Re: What the heck is this?

Does a "living wage" apply to a High School kid over summer? A College kid making some extra cash? What do you guys think happens to part time work when the minimum wage becomes $17.50 or $19.50 or $21.50? Is the "poverty line" where a living wage needs to go? If so, whatever that number is just divide it by 2000 and you arrive at the new minimum wage required to make it a so called "living wage". The concept cannot be achieved without regulating small businesses out of existence. And if you do find a fair "living wage", should I be taxed down to that level so that the Gov't can also afford to pay everyone that number? Profitable businesses lead to higher wages . . . Considering legal business evil leads to lower wages e.g. big bad __________ (fill in the blank Blo Ho, oh yeah, make sure it is any legal business other than yours)

Good questions.
I think there should be a sliding scale for minimum wages with a starter wage for ,say, 16 year olds up to 24 year olds. That way, the summer help or part time kid does not need to be paid the "living wage" that the independently living employees need to survive.
This is not a new idea.It is a system used successfully in Europe usually with total support of the trade unions.
Admittedly,American business faces new challenges because of out sourcing and having to compete against cheap imports.This works both ways.
Because basis goods have become cheaper,the minimum living wage did not rise as fast as the cost of living.
As for local circumstances,apart from a federal absolute bottom minimum wage, local government can set these living wages.
As for the the economic effects.These will almost certainly be positive and local. The local worker will probably spend his little bit of extra money locally,instead of going on vacation in the far east.so the money will circulate locally and does not disappear.

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: What the heck is this?

Good questions.
I think there should be a gliding scale for minimum wages with a starter wage for ,say, 16 year olds up to 24 year olds. That way, the summer help or part time kid does not need to be paid the "living wage" that the independently living employees need to survive.

Note the Socialist mind yer bidness instincts, devoid of even the most basic Econ 101 principals. Usin' a term like "livin' wage" assures that Liberals will corntrol the definition. Results = CENTRAL CORNTROL. Wonderfull. BTW: The private bidness does not SURVIVE, n' then BIG NANNY GUBMINT can supply all those livin' wage jobs!! Ever study history: Willis?? Uncle Joe, (thats Stalin), doesn't have a very good track record. Whatcha say 'bout that: Willis?


This is not a new idea.It is a system used successfully in Europe usually with total support of the trade unions.

Hmmmmmmm, ya tryin' ta tel me Europe is SUCCESSFULL: Willis? Got some of that smoke?

Admittedly,American business faces new challenges because of out sourcing and having to compete against cheap imports.

Oh Really? Ya think that's new? Hmmmmmm.

This works both ways.
Because basis goods have become cheaper,the minimum living wage did not rise as fast as the cost of living.

No kidding! Ya get some aspects of Econ 101 then. Now study the history of CENTRAL CORNTROL!!!!

As for local circumstances,apart from a federal absolute bottom minimum wage, local government can set these living wages.

CENTRAL CORNTROL!!!! Ya really want a deflationary depression, or worse a NEW real UNCLE JOE then! Think a bit or stop smokin' a bit n' then try some critical thinkin'.

As for the the economic effects.These will almost certainly be positive and local.

YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING! Cite ANY known facts to back up this theory of yers about the success of CENTRAL CORNTROL!!!!!

The local worker will probably spend his little bit of extra money locally,instead of going on vacation in the far east.so the money will circulate locally and does not disappear.

Hmmmmmmm, so why not jus' force ol' Murky n' Bro Haut n' every business in AmeriKa ta pay $1000.00 per hour since yer clearly through the lookin' glass now?????? Sheeesh! JR