Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

[mylesm260]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

Here is an example of what made me initially think that a 4bbl will do nothing for you're hole shot (again this is auto world)

http://www.superchevy.com/technical...cp_0610_small_block_bolt_ons/dyno_charts.html

In this example, you can see absolutely ZERO gain from the 4bbl setup until around 2700 rpms or so.

 

[King P.V.]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

To answer your question. Retail on a High 5 is $625.00 You can get them discounted at many places. Heck, I'll give you 15% off if ya like. Also, you will need the vent plugs to go along with the prop. maybe 6 or 7 bucks additional.
Remember, no matter what anyone says>>>>>......... this is important now. ..... No other prop will give you the satisfaction you want than the prop I'm talking about. No SOLAS, or 4 blade or cheaper aluminum, or............ blah, blah,... The high five is like.. high def TV. You don;'t watch black and white tv anymore, do you??? You may not like the price (remember, it's alot less money than all these guys trying to sell you four barrell carbs... ) but you'll be frick'n amazed how it pulls your arms out of your sockets !!!!!!! Everyone, including your girlfriend will love what you;ve done with the boat to get so much more "power" than what you've had before. To bad you can't sneek it in bed with you...
BTW, IF you did put a four barrell set-up on your motor, (and I could not believe you would be so sorry to do so), you'd find more fuel consumption as you'd always have the secondarys open, suc'n mucho gas. And, since you'd not be increasing the cubic inches of the block, questionable pulling power, if any at all. In 1997 and prior, 4.3's were 170 hp and 190 hp for 2 vs 4 barrell units. When GM wen't to Vortec, the hp went to 190 and 205 hp. Votec is definatly better, but in either case., The simplist and cheapest way is to prop it correctly. High Five with adjustable vent plugs is the "nuts". When you do buy one, you'll never go back to aluminum again. Your spare will always stay in the bilge. If you ever damage it, you'll HATE the performance loss of using the aluminum again and can't wait to get it back on. If you ever loan out your boat to your brother in law, put the aluminum back on for him. Screw him, he's a dweeb anyways!!

 

[Bronc Rider]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

.... No other prop will give you the satisfaction you want than the prop I'm talking about. No SOLAS, or 4 blade or cheaper aluminum, or............ blah, blah,...

The cheaper aluminum props are a good recommendation. They are inexpensive and can give the op an idea of what a prop change will do for performance. If he has the desire to go straght to an SS prop, good they usually give great performance.

(remember, it's alot less money than all these guys trying to sell you four barrell carbs... )

The only person trying to sell him anything is you. I showed him a link to the iboats store. And no, I dont own iboats. \/ \/ \/

To answer your question. Retail on a High 5 is $625.00 You can get them discounted at many places. Heck, I'll give you 15% off if ya like. Also, you will need the vent plugs to go along with the prop. maybe 6 or 7 bucks additional.

If I was going to spend money on performance a 4bbl upgrade would be much better than a prop change. I would upgrade to vortec heads before I spent the money on a high five also.
If its a sweetwater boat an edelbrock intake and carb work great. If you hit a rock you would get to keep your 4bbl vs replacing an expensive prop.
Since the op is mostly going to use his boat for pulling, a prop change is the easiest way to do it though. I just don't know if going to a really expensive prop is the best solution. If I was going to spend $500-$650, I know what direction I would take.
In the end, I really do think that a $100 prop would cure his problem.

 

[df909]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

I agree with Bronc. I'd rather have $100 hanging off the drive than $600 if the performance is even similar. I ordered the 4-blade from iboats already.

If I were to spend $600, I think I'd do some engine stuff that's not going to hit that little reef I just couldn't see.

 

[mylesm260]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

I run the solas 4 blade prop, I have no complaints.

I'm sure I could get 5% better performance if I spent 5 times more on the prop, but like you said, if you bang it up, you'd rather be out 100 than 500...

 

[King P.V.]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

. I'm not gunna get into a debate on how you guys think that "maybe" smart tabs could solve his problems, or how a 4 blade Solas prop is better 'cause it's cheaper OR him "trying" a 4 barrel carb and manifold 'cause of bigger/better cfm.... I will stand by my decision that he should try a high 5 prop. Untill he does, he just DOESN'T KNOW HOW MUCH MORE PERFORMANCE HE CAN "JUST BOLT ON". I sell alot of props to customers who desire more "performance" , hole shot, mid-throttle accelleration, or even top end, . Not everyone has the money for a high 5, nor do they desire to take the chance that an impact could/may/will cause outdrive issues due to the extra mass of the expensive stainless prop. OK !!! My lake has lots of rocks that seem to just jump up and fling themselves into boater's props. i sell and repair hundreds of new and rebuilt props each year. It's a big part of my business. I will buy back a high 5 prop from a customer if he doesn't like it. and the only person who ever came back was a guy whos wife had a fit because it cost "too much" . Fair enough! But he told me that it was "friggin Awsome" and he was truely sorry that his biatch of a wife couldn't see the benifits versus the cost, he could! ........ And anyone can feel the difference 1st time out.with a good stainless prop!! .. And if you think an aluminum Solas prop is even close to a 5% difference, well... ??? Comments like that tell me that you've never tried one either!
Surely, if you are in a habit of hitting things with your lower unit, don't go stainless. That's true of any stainless AND why most people have insurance coverage (all insurance policies cover impact damage, BTW) So, to repeat one more time. If you've never seen High Def TV, you'll never know what you've been missing. Would you agree that there is a definitive advantage compared to "regular" tv? But once you see it, you now know what you've been missing! You may not be able to afford it, but you know.... A Solas 4 blade aluminum prop is no-way even close to the power of a high 5. No-way ........ not even remotely close. It ain;t any better than Merc 4 blade aluminum (quite honestly, I hate 'em. ) And remember this, Solas props are marketed in the US as a cheaper alternative to OEM style props. Perhaps equal in "performance" to a Merc 3 or 4 blade, but really just less money. Our friend really should go to his friendly Mercruiser dealer and talk about the ski prop of choise, even go to the up-coming boat shows and see... Heck call up a few prop shops on the internet. I think everyone would aknowledge there is no-better than a high 5. It's cheaper than a new carb/manilofd and a different prop that would be needed if the carb job was done anyways..Let me say one more thing. I know of none, zilch, nada, not one marine dealership that would encourage a customer to take off a perfectly good 2 barrel carb and manifold and install a 4 barrel set-up in the desire to get more low end performance for sking. Now, the world is full of boat dealers and repair shops, some without knowledge of a high 5 made and sold by Mercury, so, it's possible that someone would encourage a customer to buy/try a Turbo, or a Ballisatic or a............ (see , there's all kinds of nice expensive props) but a high 5 still is the best, for the need, for a little scratch. Just don't ever try one..... Oh, and I'm not trying to sell him one anymore than people who are trying to convince him to upgrade to Vortec heads AND a carb switch. I'm surprised no-one has mentioned marine headers yet......Afterall, they don't hang outside the bottom of the boat either!!

 

[ricovw]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

I agree with P.V. A high five is the way i DID go. I needed a little better hoeshot. My boat is a 17.5 ft bowrider with a 3 litre. When i load it up with people, it was a slug. I really wanted more power but i didn't know where i was going to get the power. Someone told me about these high five's. I found one for sale from a local prop shop. I paid 500 for it (used, but like new). I was scared to buy it because of the money. The guy said, "pay me and use it for the weekend. If you don't like it, i will buy it back." Long story short, i never did see him again. I love the prop, and i would say to spend the money. Look for a used one in good shape if you want to save some money. It is well worth it. I had 5 grown men in the boat, and 1 on ski's, and i could pull him up. Not a chance with my 3 blade aluminum 19P prop.
I bought a 19P high five.

 

[sickwilly]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

I have an high 5. Its better than my 4 blade aluminum, but no so much better than I worship it or want to bring it to bed with me!

However, I am reading this thread because I have in the back of my mind that one fun project to do in the future is to dump the 2 barrel mercarb and go the 4 barrel route.

I just have an addiction to tinkering and might have to do this for the fun of it some day.

That being said, the original poster is doing the right thing by starting with a prop.

Want to really get this thread messed up, well here we go. I have a hydrofoil on too, and it helps with hole shot!!!!

 

[Bronc Rider]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

Here is an article where they have a propeller shoot out on a 4.3 engine. The high five does win in acceleration. What is interesting is how close other propellers come to it in performance. Even a "cheap" aluminum wheel only gets .5 seconds slower in acceleration. If we are talking 1/4 mile drag racing, half a second is huge. If we are talking about a boat going 0-40 mph the difference is tiny. When I was comparing props, I was looking at the 19" pitch props, the ones with the fastest acceleration.

High Def prop? I don't think so. Good quality like many other props? Sure.
Here is the link: http://www.stingrayboats.com/products/reviews/tb03_06.html
And man, that little stingray can haul azz for it being a fully stock rig.

 

[df909]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

Haha...you just threw a wrench into this with the hydrofoil.

I tried a hydrofoil and ended up taking it off and returning it. I didn't notice a really big difference planing, but it really changed the way the boat handled. I found that I had to really play with the trim or I'd actually bow down and really lose speed, occasionally the baot would list a lot, and some turns the boat would do fine and others it listed way, way too far. The boat was unpredictable with the hydrofoil on. I'm sure I could play with the trim all the time, but that would be a pain because depending on my speed and if I was turning I would have to trim all the time. That's a pain in the butt & I'm trying to teach my wife to drive and that's just one more thing she'd have to worry about.

I spoke with a guy at a Merc shop and he told me that sometimes water will travel over the hydrofoil in ways that negatively impact performance.

 

[mylesm260]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

High Def prop? I don't think so. Good quality like many other props? Sure.

LOL

one thing to remember, the people telling you that the 600 dollar prop is WAAAY better than the 100 dollar prop are the same people that just spent 500 more on a prop, and are now trying to justify it.

Fact of the matter is, Yes stainless props perform better, but just slightly. Also, were comparing apples to oranges here. A 5 blade prop is going to have different characteristics than a 4 blade or a 3 blade anyway. Don't more blades just make your "low" speeds more efficient and your "high" speeds less efficient? would that not explain right there why the "high 5" 5 blade prop is getting slightly better acceleration?


If you had 2 options:

#1. A high 5 prop, and no trim tabs

or

#2. A solas aluminum 4 blade prop and trip tabs (and 200 bucks in you're pocket)


you would be MUCH MUCH better off with the solas 4 blade and the trim tabs in my opinion.

And, if you bang up you're prop, you will be even MORE thankful you didn't sink 600 into it.

 

[sickwilly]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

Haha...you just threw a wrench into this with the hydrofoil.

I tried a hydrofoil and ended up taking it off and returning it. I didn't notice a really big difference planing, but it really changed the way the boat handled. I found that I had to really play with the trim or I'd actually bow down and really lose speed, occasionally the baot would list a lot, and some turns the boat would do fine and others it listed way, way too far. The boat was unpredictable with the hydrofoil on. I'm sure I could play with the trim all the time, but that would be a pain because depending on my speed and if I was turning I would have to trim all the time. That's a pain in the butt & I'm trying to teach my wife to drive and that's just one more thing she'd have to worry about.

I spoke with a guy at a Merc shop and he told me that sometimes water will travel over the hydrofoil in ways that negatively impact performance.

I have a stingray like the one in the prop fest link above, but carbed. For watersports, its a given that these hulls need smart tabs or a foil. I don't have the problems you talked about with this hull and a foil. Some day I would like to try the smart tabs.

The reason I went to a high 5 is because with the 4 blade aluminum I got great hole shot, but I lost cruising speed and top end. It seemed to suck the gas right out of my boat. The high 5 is a smaller diameter, and you get a higher pitch on it than you would think for hole shot. I get the same hole shot as the 4 blade, but better mid and top end.

Lastly, my wife seems better able to hold low speeds for wakeboarding and kneeboarding with the high 5.

Get the solas, watch ebay and get a high 5 later, add smart tabs, add the carb, how about a wake board tower----enjoy your boat! Trying things on the boat is part of the fun for me.

 

[King P.V.]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

I should give up, Stubburn, I am. So one last time. Look, The "stingray" prop test doesn't hold water. They took stock, out of the box props and compared 'em. Doesn't work. 1st, the benifits of most of Mercs stainless porps are that they are built for PVS vents. Stock props(just out of the box) have the vent holes pulgged solid. (That's what Stingray used in their test) So the atributes of the high 5 weren't even available to compare. Customers can then adjust/fine tune each prop for the particular application by replacing the solid plugs with three different plastic sized vents to allow for superior adjustment of hole shot for the particular boat/motor/ desire. It''s what gives the stainless prop (from Mercury anyways) the ability to be adjusted for, in this case, a 18 or 19' boat with 5 guys in it, with "only" a 4.3 litre engine. It also allows you to have a fairly high pitch prop, while staying with-in the prescribed RPM range, and not losing too much top-end speed. You usually will find that adjusting down in pitch for the low-end hole-shot you want means you have to give up a fair amount of top-end speed/rpms. So just about all props are a compromise between what you want and what you can have. The high 5 gives you the ability to adjust, with PVS plugs, phenominal hole shot and still have the top end speed of higher pitch. The PVS vents allow for , in some cases substancial bleeding of exhust gases ovedr the blades when just accelerating. Instead of only exiting out the rear exhust hub, now they can bleed out the vents. It works like you can't believe. At higher rpms/speed there is too much pressure outside of the prop hub and now there is no more relief through the vents so all the gases exit out the back of the prop, SO, now the higher pitch of the 5 , slightly smaller blades which controls max rpms) gives you the speed you really don''t want to give up.
Look, If you don't like having $600 hanging off the back of your boat, fine, I can understand that fact. I looked up the price of Edelbrocks marine 4 barrel carb they sell yesterday and it's $289.00. Manifold is probably 200 or 300 hun more. Labor more unless you do it yourself.. A properly set up high 5 stainless , YES, expensive prop with the middle vent plugs,( that's what I automaticly almost always use), is $600 And we'll give you back your money IF YOU DON"T LIKE IT. It could be cheaper to know that a bolt on item may be fantastic (or not) AND he can return it IF he doesn't like it. Can't do that with a set of "tabs" or a 4 barrel carb he just installed..I usually have a 19 or 21 prop in stock & I always tell people to return it after you try it as long as it's not damaged. I won't go order a weird 26" prop for someone, but a 19 or 21 is what most dealers will let you try/buy/return if you're not happy. How could you lose?? Try a properly set up one and you'll be surprised as many are. It truely is awsome. Is it that hard to say ," Gee, perhaps, since we haven't acutally tried one, that it really could be better than we think?? " Final thought, As far as comparing a Solas 4 blade aluminum prop..... oh, never mind!! Well, I'm done. Have a good day!!

 

[df909]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

This area is great for advice, which I had a lot of. I don't, however, think this area should be used as a means of convincing people to purchase a product. I don't think it's appropriate or professional to recommend something you're selling so much. A brief mention of a product is great and maybe a brief explanation of why you think it's better, but not several very long posts about why what you're selling is better. You should buy advertisement space for that and not use the free forum. If I, or someone else, wanted more information and technical data on a product we will seek out the company that makes or sells the product.

 

[sickwilly]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

There is a lot of education and information in PV's thread, its not just a commercial.

There s a reason high 5's are nicknamed stump pullers.

 

[King P.V.]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

Gee, DF909.
You ask how much a high 5 prop is,, I tell you it retails for $$$$$$ . "it's so expensive, who wants to hang that much $$$ off the back of my boat?", I tell you there are many retailers, (including me, or your local dealer, prop shop OR the internet)) that will discount it to help defray the cost. People give you very old, inaccurate info, I try to set you on the learning path correctly. People who have never actually installed a 4 barrell carb/intake on a 4.3 litre engine tell you what you should spend YOUR hard money on, I tell you I disagree but here is what most people so...... because the results are... well, impressive AND it wouldn't potentially cost you anything if you didn't like the results And now you accuse me of using free space on Iboats to advertise and sell parts because I must be too cheap to pay for that advertising space. I'll tell you I don't "buy" advertising space "on the internet". Very seriously. Every business has overhead, the knowledge learned day in and day out in a "brick and mortar" store can not be learned from a book, or a catolog/brouchure provided by ANY manufacturer. That learning curve I and many others have learned came from selling, repairing, PROPING hundreds of boats and engines over many years . I'm sure when you bought your Solas prop from Iboats, the person whom you spoke to did not try to convince you to buy perhaps a different prop that could potentially be better for you specific application. He took your order, logg'd you credit card and told you it was in stock and you would get it in four business days. Now, that person may actually know more than what I've just given him credit for, but it was a decision you made based on price and also perhaps a means on your part to help pay for the internet services that iboats provided. Afterall, someone has to support the overhead that iboats actually has, right?? But iboats doesn't pretend to tell you what boats is better for your family, what engine you should/could have installed in it, they suggest you go to the forums and "discover" what information the many people who frequent the message boards have for you. I attempt to give accurate info to help you and others. No, I don't pay iboats to do so. I don't redily give out my business phone number either. That would be because I'm offering my knowledge for free. You don't want it. I won't give you any more.

 

[wca_tim]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

Seems like some folks could use some time on the water....

 

[df909]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

So...I got my new 4-blade 19. prop and put it on. Made a big difference with planing, hole shot, and top end. When I hit it the bow pops up and planes quickly, the RPM's are closer to what they should be at WOT, and the top end is even a few faster. I fingure the speen might be since I have a nice, clean prop. The one I was using was used to cut underwater trees a few times.

Happy with the prop and it did what I need it to do. Maybe a future project will be a new intake manifold and a carb...but that's after the other 50 things on my boat wish list.

 

[liquidlew]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

You can also vent your own prop, I did this to my Solas 4 blade 17p and felt a little extra giddyup, really helps when the boat is full of bodies. Check out this link I saw awhile back on this forum.

http://marinemechanic.com/site/page76.html

 

[conway22]

Re: Upgrade 2b carb to 4b on 4.3L for hole shot power

Here is an article where they have a propeller shoot out on a 4.3 engine. The high five does win in acceleration. What is interesting is how close other propellers come to it in performance. Even a "cheap" aluminum wheel only gets .5 seconds slower in acceleration. If we are talking 1/4 mile drag racing, half a second is huge. If we are talking about a boat going 0-40 mph the difference is tiny. When I was comparing props, I was looking at the 19" pitch props, the ones with the fastest acceleration.

High Def prop? I don't think so. Good quality like many other props? Sure.
Here is the link: http://www.stingrayboats.com/products/reviews/tb03_06.html
And man, that little stingray can haul azz for it being a fully stock rig.[/QUOTE


Great Link!!!