Trim diagnostic

[parasailguy]

I have a 2001 Kad-43p-a with a duoprop dps outdrive.

Neither the trim up nor the trim down work. The relays do not click. I am getting power (red wire) into the relays by the trim motor but that is the only thing that shows power. I installed new relays and still nothing. I checked the trim switch (at throttle control) and that shows no power (I'm pretty sure it should have power). I checked the blue wire for power while engaging the trim switch. I did the same for the green wire and still nothing.

At this point I'm really not too sure as to what should be done next.

If I have a defective trim switch then there should still be power going to it, correct?

 

[cr2k]

Re: Trim diagnostic

There are a few 50 amp fuses somewhere on the engine near the harness plug.
Check these one runs is connected to the tilt/trim. If these are good you may have issues with the control box.

Jump 12+ to each of the Green (down) and Blue (up) terminals, one at a time and see if the drive goes up or down. If so you need to trace back those wires to find the dead spot.

 

[Don S]

Re: Trim diagnostic

Searching my memory banks here, but I think there is a white fuse that doesn't look like a fuse attached to a bracket on the injector lines. Hang in there, I will find a picture of it here in a few.

 

[Don S]

Re: Trim diagnostic

There are a few 50 amp fuses somewhere on the engine near the harness plug.

Never looked at a KAD43 diesel before have you.

 

[Don S]

Re: Trim diagnostic

Item 21 in the picture below is the fuse. You should show 12+ volts on both sides, if not, it's blown.

 

[parasailguy]

Re: Trim diagnostic

I checked the fuse in the diagram and it's good. I think that was more of a master fuse. There is a fuse reset button but I believe it's for the entire boat and my boat has power, just not the trim. If my trim motor was bad I should at least hear the relays clicking as far as I know.

I'll jump the power wire to the blue and see if it goes up, and then I'll jump it to the green, and see if she goes down. Tomorrow though, it got cold here in Cleveland today.

Does anyone know where I can find a wiring diagram for my system?

 

[Don S]

Re: Trim diagnostic

IF you unplug the pump motor, the motor can be checked by putting a jumper on each wire on the motor to the battery. One to neg, one to positive. Blue to positive if you want up.

I have a wiring diagram somewhere for that system I think. I'll look around.

 

[Don S]

Re: Trim diagnostic

The wiring diagram manual did have wiring diagrams for the trim also. I really didn't remember it having it. anyway, here is a link to that manual.

http://www.4shared.com/document/AIMNwIVK/41_Wiring_Diag.html


It would be real hand and helpfull if you had the Volvo serial numbers for the engine and drive, that way I could check out what you actually have. In your original post you say you have a dps out drive. Problem is, Volvo never used the DPS behind the 43's.

 

[parasailguy]

Re: Trim diagnostic

Ask and ye shall receive, there are two sets of #'s for both:

Kad 43p-a
2204302978
869108

dp-s
3868299
no. 4111563690

 

[Don S]

Re: Trim diagnostic

Did you actually verify those numbers as being correct? The 4111 number is a transom shield. not the drive. The drive should be Transmission/Drive 3102181442 DP-D1 1.78 3868022
The engine was changed in 99 to your 43, it used to be a 42.
The transom shield your 4111563690 serial number goes to, will not work with the engine, or the drive that you should have.

Here are pictures of the two different drives. Which do you really have. DP-D1 or DP-S?

another DPs Picture.

 

[parasailguy]

Re: Trim diagnostic

Sorry about that. I started plugging in numbers and downloaded the manuel and noticed where I should really find the outdrive id.

It's the dp-d1
#3102204010

 

[Don S]

Re: Trim diagnostic

Look at this manual for the DP-D1 trim system. Much better wiring diagram also.

http://www.4shared.com/document/U8jYVLQA/DP-D.html

 

[parasailguy]

Re: Trim diagnostic

Thanks for the wiring diagrams. I got around to testing the motor today and it looks like it's fried.

 

[parasailguy]

Re: Trim diagnostic

I took the trim motor out from what it is attached to and tested the motor. To my surprise it works. Too bad I already ordered a new one. The reason why the motor didn't work in the first place is b/c whatever the motor is supposed to turn was locked up. I loosened that part up a bit with vise grips but is still too tough to turn by hand. I know this is all vague, I wish I knew the name of the individual parts. I attached some images so everyone can at least somewhat know what I'm talking about.

Does anyone know how loose the thing that turns is supposed to be? The whole assembly is somewhat expensive. Should I just bite the bullet or can I just order that smaller piece (first photo), or should it be okay with just turning it a few times?

Everything was all super gunked up and smelled of bad b-o. I can say with certainty that the fluid was never changed. When I poured out all the fluid from the reservoir it all came out in chunks.

 

[RRitt]

Re: Trim diagnostic

I have a 2001 Kad-43p-a with a duoprop dps outdrive.

Neither the trim up nor the trim down work. The relays do not click. I am getting power (red wire) into the relays by the trim motor but that is the only thing that shows power. I installed new relays and still nothing. I checked the trim switch (at throttle control) and that shows no power (I'm pretty sure it should have power). I checked the blue wire for power while engaging the trim switch. I did the same for the green wire and still nothing.

At this point I'm really not too sure as to what should be done next.

If I have a defective trim switch then there should still be power going to it, correct?

The relays do not click?
But they are getting +12V to the coils?

The clicking noise is completely independant from all trim functions. You could beat the entire trim system into little tiny fragments, break every fuse, cut every wire, dump water into the motor, cut the rams in half with a torch ... anything you can imagine ..... and the relays should still click if you put 12v on the coil. Unless, of course, the relays are broken or the coils do not have a ground connection.


(oh - sorry ... i did not say what a coil is and it might be confusing ... inside the relay there is a little electro-magnet called the coil. when the electromagnet is turned on it pulls a metal switch. When the magnet turns off then a spring pushes the switch back the other way. That's the clicking noise.)

 

[Don S]

Re: Trim diagnostic

You must have missed his earlier post RRitt, he found the problem.

I got around to testing the motor today and it looks like it's fried.

 

[RRitt]

Re: Trim diagnostic

you sure? i think in post #14 he clears the motor. maybe i am mis-reading him. if so, then sorry.

 

[parasailguy]

Re: Trim diagnostic

I've got the motor mounted back up and working, I just haven't put any fluid into it to see if it will actually raise the outdrive. I pulled a bunch of wires today and it looks like I'm going to have to solder a few badly crimped connections and chase down some wires that go nowhere. There's also one connector that is unconnected, with no clue as to where it might go (holds maybe 7 or 8 wires).

I'm just not getting power to the switch which I think is a good place to start. My system has the all complex (at least from a wiring diagram point of view) digital trim gauge.

Somewhere from the trim gauge to the switch the wiring has gone horribly wrong.

 

[parasailguy]

Re: Trim diagnostic

Does anyone know the correct power trim relay to use on the dp-d1 outdrive trim system?

What I really want to know is what the correct amp rating is. I'm not sure if it's a 20/30 a 30/40 just a 40 or just a 30. Or does it matter?

I've got a couple of the old relays but they are different brands and different amp ratings. I'm not sure if this could have anything to do with my trim system failure. Regardless, I want to get 4 new ones to rule that possibility out but I want to get the right ones to begin with.

 

[RRitt]

Re: Trim diagnostic

most 12v trim systems draw about 20A. If they draw more then it forces designers to use a large cable that costs more and is significantly less flexible. So if they use a motor over 20A there has to be a distinct need for very powerful or very fast trim action.

Most marine trim relays are automotive headlight relays with a different part # printed on the outside. If it works then use it for testing. no worries.