Surge brakes lasted 1200 miles of highway, whats wrong

[joelger]

I have a continental tandem axle boat trailer that has surge brakes. Over the summer i found that one of the wheels had worn right through the pad, backing plate and even chewed up the caliper. I replaced the caliper and the pads on all for wheels as well as the rotor. I just took the trailer from NY to Fla and when i got here i found that all four wheels have no pad left and are rubbing metal on metal.
To start with everytime i stopped for gas, (every 250 miles) i would check the temperature of the hubs with an in-fared thermometer. They were never hotter that 95-100 degrees. When i got to fla i found that pads were worn away.
If the calipers were hanging up i would think the hubs would have been hot ass hell,, they werent. Also when i changed the pads i made sure that each wheel rotated freely. I dont get what whas happened here. I was thinking maybe the shock absorber at the master cylinder might be bad so the brakes didnt fully release? The problem with that is the hubs should have been hot.
My issue is that i am in fla for 5 weeks and have to get this boat and trailer home.

Any thoughts?

 

[alldodge]

First guess is the master cylinder is not designed or modified for calipers.

If its a unmodified brake shoe master cylinder (MC), then it doesn't allow for bleed back without pressure from brake shoe return springs. The MC can be modified by make a small hole in the valve at the brake line connection

Interstate driving it has time to wear the pads down from the last stop. Truck stops and brakes are applied. Truck takes off and pads are dragging, but by the time you stop again they have wore down so their not touching and things cool down

 

[joelger]

This is a 2016 trailer and everything is original

 

[alldodge]

Then I would think the same issue but MC must be clogged. Either that or setup is wrong, might need a pic of how it rides.

Disconnect trailer then put receiver hitch in trailer coupler. Jack up one wheel and spin to see if its fee. If its free, push receiver down as hard as you can to engage the brakes. See if its still free to spin once receiver is lifted back up

 

[joelger]

wheels spin free with no pressure on hitch. I can lock the wheels by putting pressure on the hitch using a come a long. it all seem to be working fine. i just curious if the shoch absorber has something to do with it

 

[alldodge]

If wheels lock up and when released they spin easy again then they are working as they should.

The shock is there to soften the trailer moving forward when brakes are applied or when on bumpy roads. Now if the trailer doesn't have the right amount of tongue weight it may bounce back n forth, but not seeing

Your original problem was one pad worn out, and now all of them. With just one I would expect the single caliper, with all its either MC, setup or something in the line not allowing fluid to release pressure

 

[dingbat]

What brand brakes?

Using ceramic pads?

When is the last time you serviced the sliders and or rebuilt the calipers?

What make and model coupler that requires a come along to actuate?

My coupler can be actuated enough to stop the wheel from spinning by hand.

 

[Scott Danforth]

what brand of calipers?
what brand of master cylinder?
at highway speeds, there is enough air flow that if you are draging your calipers slightly, you wont heat the hubs
a loose damper may cause the brakes to come on and release a bit. however only if the trailer is bucking
where in florida are you, I can point you to some local trailer shops if on the gulf coast

 

[briangcc]

What's the trailer to vehicle connection look like? Is it level or slightly up? Or is the nose of the trailer slightly down so that the surge brakes are partially engaged?

 

[Scott Danforth]

What's the trailer to vehicle connection look like? Is it level or slightly up? Or is the nose of the trailer slightly down so that the surge brakes are partially engaged?

good point

 

[Lowlysubaruguy]

I have a continental tandem axle boat trailer that has surge brakes. Over the summer i found that one of the wheels had worn right through the pad, backing plate and even chewed up the caliper. I replaced the caliper and the pads on all for wheels as well as the rotor. I just took the trailer from NY to Fla and when i got here i found that all four wheels have no pad left and are rubbing metal on metal.
To start with everytime i stopped for gas, (every 250 miles) i would check the temperature of the hubs with an in-fared thermometer. They were never hotter that 95-100 degrees. When i got to fla i found that pads were worn away.
If the calipers were hanging up i would think the hubs would have been hot ass hell,, they werent. Also when i changed the pads i made sure that each wheel rotated freely. I dont get what whas happened here. I was thinking maybe the shock absorber at the master cylinder might be bad so the brakes didnt fully release? The problem with that is the hubs should have been hot.
My issue is that i am in fla for 5 weeks and have to get this boat and trailer home.

Any thoughts?

Make sure the surge brake rollers are free and lubed well. If you have a ratchet strap you can pull the trailer towards the truck with one pretty easy and see if anything feels rough. Do you have a reverse lock out solenoid its possible it is hanging up after being applied as well. Ways to check surge brakes without jacking up all four wheels is harder. One option might be to find a harbor frieght and buy a temp gun there about $30 and very useful for brake and bearing issues. The rubber hoses ( Flex lines) fail more often than one might think there hard to pin point because there often intermittent the rubber liner fails and becomes a check valve the inside diameter of a high pressure brake line is very small so it isnt hard for this to occur. Also make sure none of the steel lines look damaged they can get pinched and cause hydraulic pressure to remain for a while after each application. For sure the temp gun will help you know for a fact that wheel is acting up. Ive had issues with cars clutch lines plugging up shows up when we try to bleed them after a repair. We flush them with alcohol and compressed air and it proves they sludge up pretty easy a boats brakes sit for long periods brake fluid is water solvable so it pulls moisture in this causes corrosion. I can go on and on. Worse case scenerio on your trip you pull that line off and plug it. Thats if you have solid brakes and enough truck to get away with it. And ill state for a fact that theres a ton of trailers rolling around out there in the lane next to you with one or more brakes not working all the time so deleting one to get you home aint any worse then the 50 trailers youll pass on your trip with worse brakes that’s you will have after doing that. And a lot of them are semi trucks carrying more weight than there supposed to as well.

 

[Lou C]

Agreed in using the IR temp gun that will tell the tale if one or more brakes are sticking. I know on some disc brakes there was an issue with non stainless backing plates causing the pads to swell and drag on the rotors.
If they are Kodiak brakes with painted steel backing plates for the pads change them to the stainless aluminum ones.

 

[bruceb58]

I had Kodiak brakes for over 10 years and never had an issue like that.

 

[Lou C]

It was reported on salt water boating boards like the hulltruth a number of times, Kodiak then revised the material used and problem solved.

 

[Lou C]

KODIAK 10"-12" Disc Ceramic Pads w/SS Back, #K71-DBC-225-PAD-SS

Stock# 1561031KODIAK #K71-DBC-225-PAD-SS Ceramic disc brake pads with Stainless Steel backing. Fits 3500-6000 lb. axles, Kodiak 10" and 12" disc brake assemblies with DBC-225 caliper. Includes (4) pads to repair two calipers.

www.easternmarine.com

https://www.thehulltruth.com/trucks-trailers/812955-trailer-brakes-stainless-kodiac-calipers.html

see post #8
just a thought we don't even know what brand of brakes the OP had.

 

[kenny nunez]

I had a problem with the drum brakes on my car \ex boat trailer heating up and found a tiny piece of something wedged in the brass fitting at the master cylinder. It would let the fluid pass to apply the brakes but stopped it from returning. I had to stop and release the pressure on one of the bleeders. The metered hole in the fitting is smaller than a pin hole. I chucked it in my lathe and bored it out to 1/16” which cured the problem. I realize the purpose of the metered hole was to keep the brakes from coming on too quick but I could not feel any difference.
And as posted above it could be a flex brake hose restricting the fluid from returning.

 

[dingbat]

KODIAK 10"-12" Disc Ceramic Pads w/SS Back, #K71-DBC-225-PAD-SS

Stock# 1561031KODIAK #K71-DBC-225-PAD-SS Ceramic disc brake pads with Stainless Steel backing. Fits 3500-6000 lb. axles, Kodiak 10" and 12" disc brake assemblies with DBC-225 caliper. Includes (4) pads to repair two calipers.

www.easternmarine.com

https://www.thehulltruth.com/trucks-trailers/812955-trailer-brakes-stainless-kodiac-calipers.html

see post #8
just a thought we don't even know what brand of brakes the OP had.

Like Bruce58... never had an performance issue either.

I could see not be particularly keen with rusting backing pads on a full stainless steel setup, but I'm running Dacromet rotors and KodaGuard calipers. A bit of rust on the pads is the least of my worries

Had issue with the brake pads wearing out in short order from the rust buildup on the rotors. Switched to ceramic pads. Now get 5-6 years out of a set of pads.

 

[Lou C]

Well they came out with the stainless backed pads for a reason don’t you think?

 

[dingbat]

Well they came out with the stainless backed pads for a reason don’t you think?

Because people who spend $1,000 on a set of SS brakes don't like to see rust on them....and are willing to pay $70 for a pair of brake pads...lol

As much as I've run Kodiaks in SW over the past 10-15 years, surely I would have had an issue by now

 

[bruceb58]

KODIAK 10"-12" Disc Ceramic Pads w/SS Back, #K71-DBC-225-PAD-SS

Stock# 1561031KODIAK #K71-DBC-225-PAD-SS Ceramic disc brake pads with Stainless Steel backing. Fits 3500-6000 lb. axles, Kodiak 10" and 12" disc brake assemblies with DBC-225 caliper. Includes (4) pads to repair two calipers.

www.easternmarine.com

https://www.thehulltruth.com/trucks-trailers/812955-trailer-brakes-stainless-kodiac-calipers.html

see post #8
just a thought we don't even know what brand of brakes the OP had.

I rinse my brakes every time after dunking in salt water so that is why I never had an issue. Kinda dumb not to do that actually but some people do not maintain their stuff very well.

Since the regular pads are the exact ones used on some older GM cars, just replace the pads more often or go with ceramic for the same car...which is what I did. Don't have to order Kodiak brake pads.

In addition, stainless is a very poor conductor of heat which is another reason you don't want stainless plates. For the same reason, you really don't want stainless rotors