Sink Or Swim

[PolarBear]

Well, as reading here prepared me for, there is always something MORE wrong than just what you think you need to fix.<br /><br />Although I was not able to make it visibly flex pushing on the outboard, the inside of the transom of our Charger has a very flaky section. I found it after removing all the obstructions while trying to adjust the steering which was terribly out of whack on the boat. After aligning the outboard, I started poking around under the splashwell and noticed that the nut on the bolts for the engine bracket was embedded in the transom. I was able to wiggle loose the nut with my fingers, and began picking around it. It's not good. I've been reading about all the options for transom repair on here and anywhere else but I am left with a couple of things I would appreciate someone confirming.<br /><br />1) It's a fiberglass boat, with a plywood transom. If I just cut out the bad wood from the inside, will it be strong enough to replace the section of transom if it is properly glassed in and sealed up afterwards (leaving the outer hull glass intact)? Would it be better to reinforce joints where the new wood meets the old or is this overkill once it is all glassed in?<br /><br />2) What is the best way to remove the old fiberglass material from the wood? Using a grinder worries me about cutting too much away but sanding seems to be very slow. How abrasive a material can you use, and what is best for cutting into it?<br /><br />This is my first boat, and my first time doing anything like this. I have read a lot of information online but a good portion tends to be the kind of thing that is "this is why our product is better than anyone else's". I just want to do this as cost-effectively as possible but still making it safe: i.e. more elbow grease is fine if it saves cash.<br /><br />Or should I just find the deepest lake I can and scuttle the beast? (just kidding about that, I really want this boat to work)<br /><br />Thanks!

 

[bigboy]

Re: Sink Or Swim

Scuttle it <br /><br />1/ just make a hole new transom, i'm rebuilding my boat: transom, floor, stringers... The transom is easy to do! Believe me...<br /><br />2/ Cut it away. With a saw around the spot. <br /><br />My opinion, if you want to do this why dont spend a few hours more to reinforce a new, supersolid transom.

 

[JasonJ]

Re: Sink Or Swim

Polarbear, the usual way to do a transom job is to remove everything from the inside and glass new wood in, usually plywood in layers. you do have a degree of freedom when doing this. You can make the transom thicker than original as long as it can fit between the splashwell skin and hull outer skin. Mine was only an inch, so I made mine thicker. Replacing the entire transom is the better way to do it, and is worth the extra work. A 4 inch angle grinder with metal cutoff wheels makes very short work of whatever you need to cut, but you have to be careful, it goes through fiberglass like butter. I had my entire structure out pretty darn quick. You can click my link below and see what I had to deal with. Good luck...

 

[PolarBear]

Re: Sink Or Swim

I'm actually in the middle of this job right now. I did not like how much moisture was in the wood all around although it was not rotten, so I am cutting out the transom and replacing it. In the process, the floor is going too, I was going to do the back part only but the heck with it, the whole thing needs doing.<br /><br />The original transom appears to be 1 1/2 inch plywood. I am putting in 2 3/4 inch pieces with a layer of glass in between... Is that stronger than it originally was? It had no fiberglass on the inside originally either so I am going to glass over the whole thing to add some protection and hopefully strength.<br /><br />In between the layers of plywood, should I use fiberglass mat? Obviously I don't want to make it TOO thick, I have some room to play with behind the splashwell but it is likely only 1/4 inch tops. From what I have read mat is the strongest but I am not completely sure of that.<br /><br />I'm actually kind of lucky - my boat does not have stringers, or at least it didn't. I think I will be putting in some reinforcement under the floor, though, rather than exclusively foam.

 

[G DANE]

Re: Sink Or Swim

Well to my eyes your boat definately has potential. A good looking, well built hull and a nice design. Chrysler always did a good job on those boats. I like the old design style, with thicker lay-up and less reinforcement, although its not done like that now, probably due to economy.

 

[Mark42]

Re: Sink Or Swim

Oh, wow! Went through your project on Shareaproject.com. Excellent project and boat. Almost bought one of those a few years back. Now I'm sorry I didn't. Start contacting the boat salvage and liquidator yards to find a replacement window. Do a search on "boat liquidators" to get a few hits on the major sites. There are probably some out there somewhere. <br /><br />One thing to think about when doing your transom: A common place for water infiltration in transoms is around the outboard mounting bolts. Sealing them with boat sealers only lasts so long. A nice design solution is to take a 2" hole saw and make holes in the plywood that line up with the motor mount holes. After installing the plywood, and before glassing the inside back on, fill the drilled holes with epoxy or polyester resin/chopped glass mix. Then after the transom is complete, drill the 5/8" or 3/4" hole needed for the mounting bolts. Now if water does leak past the bolt, it will only get to epoxy or solid fiberglass/resin and NOT directly into the plywood. Also, I would suggest using pressure treated ply, but be sure it has had time to fully dry indoors (like a month or more) before use to be sure the excess water is gone.<br /><br />That is going to be so cool!

 

[PolarBear]

Re: Sink Or Swim

Hey Mark, that's a good idea. I had 2 plans I was considering: CPESing the crap out of the area of those bolt holes and any other openings through and then packing with sealant, or possibly embedding some kind of metal sleeve in resin in the area so that it was sealed in as watertight as possible. Your idea has now trumped those, as it is far easier and MUCH more reliable to get it sealed up.<br /><br />That is one great idea, thank you! And just in time because in the next few days I need to build a transom now that the old one is out.

 

[swimmin' for shore]

Re: Sink Or Swim

Hey PolarBear. That's a nice looking boat. And don't feel bad about nearly cutting through the hull. At least you stopped in time. Do a search for that. Another one of my posts will come up. <br />BTW-in answer to your title: Never sink. Good luck with your project. Are you planning stringers under the floor? Refoaming? I haven't wrapped it up yet, but I'm doing a very similar repair on my floor. I took old foam out and am making hatches for storage under there. I don't have a big thing for foaming under the floor, especially as it gets watersoaked and heavier. Keep us updated.

 

[fishingdan]

Re: Sink Or Swim

Nice project polarbear. That is going to be a great boat when you are done. <br /><br />I like to use marine plywood for transoms (fir or meranti). Seal all surfaces with at least 2 coats of unthickened epoxy. That with Mark's excellent suggestion for the bolt holes will result in a transom that will outlast your (and probably a few subsequent owners) use of the boat. <br /><br />I don't like to use pressure treated because:<br /><br />- I don't like to wait until dries (and how do I know when it is fully dry)<br />- More importantly for me, the pressure treated stuff in my area is typically a pretty poor grade of exterior plywood. I don't want any voids in my transom.<br /><br />The mat between the 2 3/4" plywood pieces for the transom isn't necessary. You can add it if you want to, but I pre-kote all surfaces with unthickened epoxy, make an epoxy/woodflour mixture and glue them together without any fiberglass. Apply enough epoxy/woodflour mixture so that it oozes out when pushed together. To hold the pieces together, I lay them on a plastic sheet and then put 1 or 2 gallon jugs full of water on on the wood. <br /><br />There are a lot of other threads that discuss how to bond the new transom to the hull. <br /><br />Good luck with the project. <br /><br />Dan

 

[PolarBear]

Re: Sink Or Swim

At this point the job is feeling huge. I keep posting on shareaproject as I get a little done but it sure seems like I can't get much progress made. Maybe it is hte anxiety over winter coming that makes it seem so slow.<br /><br />Nah, it is just going slow.<br /><br />swimmin': My plan is to do a two-fold approach. I am going to install some stringers or partial stringers for floor support. The old floor was 3/8 ply or thinner which suprised me. I am putting in half inch which is stronger, adding 2 stringers, adding a drain channel down the line of the keel and then making a hybrid foam filler for under the floor. I originally was going to skip the foam but upon reading some safety regs and such I decided the foam would help add a margin of safety as long as it was done in a way to help work against it becoming waterlogged (hnce the drain). The plan is still evolving at the moment because I need to experiment with some materials to see how they fit the bill. <br /><br />fishingdan: I need to add some thickness and I want this thing to be as strong as possible, so I am putting some mat in between. I know a lot of people are recommending epoxy resin and such but I just can't afford it - it is double the price. I'm using the same poly resin a local boat repair company uses. I've bought some CPES to treat everything, and adding as much reinforcement as I can without having a 3" thick transom I have read in a few places that pressure treated wood can create its own set of problems, so I am using untreated wood and doing any waterproofing and rot-proofing myself.

 

[swimmin' for shore]

Re: Sink Or Swim

PB, if you read back through some old posts, the epoxy vs. poly has come up a LOT. Everyone seems to have that for one of their first questions, when contemplating floor work. I was no exception, and I bought into the epoxy frenzy just like many people. A few seasoned boatbuilders from this forum have convinced me otherwise, since then. It isn't in question that epoxy is the better product. Polyester has lasted for the last 35 years in the boat you're rebuilding, though. There's no reason it won't last for the next. <br />As for your plans coming together slowly, stick with it. It's easy to be overwhelmed. Pick one task at a time, working from the inside out. If you look at the whole project and want it done all at once, you'll just end up walking circles around the boat, not to mention trying to learn too many things at once. Set a pace and maintain it. You have all winter, weather allowing(or an inside place to work), so set small goals. It'll work out, and it'll be a fantastic looking boat in the spring. Wait until all your neighbors are looking at you with envy. 2 or 3 guys from my street stop by every week to see what I'm working on. These are people who grew up with boats, but they come to me for advice and help now. You'll be proud like a new father when that baby's done.

 

[fishingdan]

Re: Sink Or Swim

Poly will work fine for you. I personally prefer to use it only for interior repairs, but there are lot of experienced builders that use it everywhere. Besides cost, it cures much faster than epoxy and you can accomplish a lot in very short time.<br /><br />I just can't stand the poly fume and since I do most of the work in a garage that is attached to my house, I try to avoid it. <br /><br />Good luck with the project PB

 

[SeaMasterZ@aol.com]

Re: Sink Or Swim

Remember that you have to allow for fiberglass mat between the boards ... since you are making a fiberglass laminated transom it will be vastly superior to the original, so it can in fact be thinner, but it CANNOT BE THICKER than the original, or it wont go back together until you grind away the interference material<br /><br />Me, i love my aluminum boats, the transom stays good forever ... the holiday is over 40 years old and its transom is just now getting into that "help me" stage ... the Super Sport is 31 and solid as a rock!

 

[Evinrude Boater]

Re: Sink Or Swim

PolarBear, I love your shareaproject page. Despite your experiences you still add humour to your commentary. I've added your page to my favourites. Don't throw those seats out. I'll come and get them if you're replacing them. They look better than my chocolate brown seats with the mouse hole chewed through the top.

 

[dolluper]

Re: Sink Or Swim

Can I make a suggestion from what I learn't on mine useing poly resin to,make sure it's "WAXED" poly ,clamp your pieces of ply in place and drill the holes for your motor mounting, drain holes, tow hooks at 3/8 size all and maybe a couple extra holes down lower closer to the hull[can fill them later].Get some 3/8 bolts and washers for clamping it when you resin things together.I used a piece of mat on the hull then the ply piece of mat then ply and you have to work real ,real fast this way then bolted and clamped on top.If your not the best with fiberglassing I would suggest you glass your mat to the hull and glass one sheet of ply then clamp it up,sand and clean after it's well set and repeat the process I'm sure you will have better results that way.Make a test pot of resin and catalist and see how fast it hardens!!!The mat will take up about1/16 inch each piece,put some duct tape over the holes in your hull and cut a little slit in the middle to insert your bolts,so the resin will stay in and not just run down back of your hull Check my link below "transom repair" any questions ask here or e-mail me dolluper at gmail.com