Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

[hkeiner]

My motor seems to run fine with the Idle Stabilizer module still installed. However, I have read several recent posts about the wisdom of removing this module to avoid potential problems from a module failure, such as mentioned in this link: http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=417952

I am planning to remove the module on my motor to be on the safe side, but I want to be very clear on how to do it without messing up the timing. Removing the module itself is the easy part for me, but I am a bit unclear on the how to set the max timing with the module permanently removed. The shop manual provides timing specs (21 at cranking and 19 at WOT)), but I expect these apply with the stabilizer being used on the motor. Plus I am not sure I understand all that is said in the manual about the idel stabilizer and what applies to my particular motor. I do know how to set max timing at cranking speed.

Further, the above linked posts states that timing should be 23 degrees if the module is permanently removed, but does not mention if this is at cranking speed or WOT.

In short, these are my questions:
- What should the max timing show (with a timing light) at "cranking" speed and what should it shown at "WOT"?
- Do experienced (wise) mechanics actually check the timing at WOT out on the water or are they happy with the 'cranking speed" max timing adjustment.

I ask this latter question because I once tried to check the timing at WOT out on the water and it seemed like a pretty crazy thing to do. My boat goes pretty fast...

 

[j_martin]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

My motor seems to run fine with the Idle Stabilizer module still installed. However, I have read several recent posts about the wisdom of removing this module to avoid potential problems from a module failure, such as mentioned in this link: http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=417952

I am planning to remove the module on my motor to be on the safe side, but I want to be very clear on how to do it without messing up the timing. Removing the module itself is the easy part for me, but I am a bit unclear on the how to set the max timing with the module permanently removed. The shop manual provides timing specs (21 at cranking and 19 at WOT)), but I expect these apply with the stabilizer being used on the motor. The above linked posts states that timing should be 23 degrees if the module is permanently removed, but does not mention if this is at cranking speed or WOT.

In short, these are my questions:
- What should the max timing show (with a timing light) at "cranking" speed and what should it shown at "WOT"?
- Do experienced (wise) mechanics actually check the timing at WOT out on the water or are they happy with the 'cranking speed" max timing adjustment.

I ask this latter question because I once tried to check the timing at WOT out on the water and it seemed like a pretty crazy thing to do. My boat goes pretty fast...

The timing is set at cranking speed, after a bunch of other steps including verifying the location of the timing pointer in relation to flywheel markings. You may notice that the timing pointer is bolted to plastic with a single screw, and could easily be out of place. Relying on it without checking it could be inimical to the well being of your engine.

I suggest you get a manufacturer's maintenance manual, and learn the timing and linkage adjustment procedure in it, before you go wrenching on the timing components of your engine, or deep six yourself trying to do something that is unreasonably dangerous without much special equipment. (checking timing at full plane on a high perf boat.)

hope it helps
John

 

[hkeiner]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

John,

Thanks for the response. My first post was probably a bit unclear at to what I know and what I do not know. I do know how to do all link and sync steps (I have done them in the past) and I do have a Mercuy OEM manual. I was not clear, however, on what the max timing should be at cranking speed with the stabilizer permanently removed and I was not clear if wiser mechanics ever check the max timing at WOT. I tried to do that once and decided it was not wise, but I thought I would ask this along with my question on the timing spec.

Anyways, is it correct for me to understand that the Max timing at "cranking speed" should be set to 23 if the idle stabilizer is permanently removed and that it is not necessary to again check the max timing at WOT?

Thanks

 

[jmj120]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

It's my understanding that timing is done with the idle stabilizer unhooked. That being the case, I would think you'd be safe just to unhook it. I guess it doesn't hurt to verify the timing.
I removed mine (xr6 150) and have had no problems.

 

[hkeiner]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

Yes, the manual states that the stabilizer module is disconnected while setting the max timing (21 at cranking speed) but it also states that the the module is reconnected afterwards. I am thinking that the manual's 21 spec may be correct only if the stabilizer module is reconnected afterwards.

What is not certain to me is what the max timing should be at "cranking speed" if the module is NOT reconnected afterwards. The OEM shop manual does not speak to this. I am almost to the conclusion that the Max timing at cranking speed should be 23 if the stabilizer module is NOT reconnected afterwards, but I wanted to get a definitive answer to this before proceeding.

Thanks

 

[westexasrepublic]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

http://www.themarinedoctor.com/videos/statictiming.wmv

properly setting the timing at dry crank will set it for WOT on the water. Watch the video it will explain. You can see in the vid it is set at 3? at neutral and since he disconnected the throttle lever he was able to move the timing to simulate WOT and thats when you then see the flywheel advance to about 25?. Which as he describes is 2? more then the actual WOT (23?) on the lake.

What manual are you referencing? I know the Seloc manual explains this, but dosnt give an actual time setting. Every motor is different but most run best with max spark advance about 23? which means to set yours in your driveway to 25?

 

[sschefer]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

Don't fix what aint broke!

 

[westexasrepublic]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

or yah, if its running good why advance timing...but incase you feel you have to, I think the vid I posted is usefull.

 

[j_martin]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

Set WOT timing at 23 degrees at cranking speed.

 

[hkeiner]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

Don't fix what aint broke!

I can agree with this in many cases, but I thought that the idle stabilizer module is a risky item to keep on the motor and that if it "breaks, it can cause the timing to go haywire and cause some serious damage to the motor. This is the only reason I was planning to remove the module and reset the timing (to 23 at cranking speed as I now understand). I think that waiting for the module to "break" before removing it is not a wise thing to do. This might be debated by some but I figure removing the module is less risky that leaving it on the motor.

Setting the max timing at 23 at cranking speed was the information that I wanted to confirm. Also, knowing that it is not necessary to check/tweak the max timing to get a different specific reading at WOT was also valuable information. Thanks to all for the great feedback and advice on this subject.

 

[sschefer]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

I would bet that if you took a poll and got honest answers, there would be only a handful of folks with engines that failed due to the module. I would put it in the same category as oil pumps.

Merc doesn't sell them anymore but CDI does so there's still a market for the replacements.

I've seen some of the motors that supposedly failed because of the modules and I gotta tell ya, if it wasn't the module it would have been something else. Most of the time (not always) they're just run down motors that are on their last legs anyway.

So like I say, if it aint broke, don't fix it. But, if you feel uneasy about having it then remove it just remember that you no longer have that as a safety factor and you need to monitor and maintain your engine like wind up watch.

 

[Faztbullet]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

The idle stablizer only works at idle, if rpm's fall below a set limit(550rpm) it will attempt to raise rpm by advancing timing untill it senses it is acceptable and return's to normal timing. I have only seen 2 engine's in 35+yrs of working on motor that the advance box burnt down the engine and both had the wiring insulation falling off them. If its in good shape I leave them on ....

 

[mxzeatr]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

The idle stablizer only works at idle, if rpm's fall below a set limit(550rpm) it will attempt to raise rpm by advancing timing untill it senses it is acceptable and return's to normal timing. I have only seen 2 engine's in 35+yrs of working on motor that the advance box burnt down the engine and both had the wiring insulation falling off them. If its in good shape I leave them on ....[/QUOTE]

Thats exactly why I'm removing mine.

The wires are SHOT and I think I'm lucky nothing has went wrong.

 

[sschefer]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

The idle stablizer only works at idle, if rpm's fall below a set limit(550rpm) it will attempt to raise rpm by advancing timing untill it senses it is acceptable and return's to normal timing. I have only seen 2 engine's in 35+yrs of working on motor that the advance box burnt down the engine and both had the wiring insulation falling off them. If its in good shape I leave them on ....[/QUOTE]

Thats exactly why I'm removing mine.

The wires are SHOT and I think I'm lucky nothing has went wrong.

I agree with your removal, you have all the right reasons.

 

[hkeiner]

Re: Removing Idle Stabilizer and new timing specs

I initially thought that removing the module is what everyone was doing and that I was remiss in not doing so too. I now see that suggestions about removing a stabilizer module that is not broken is similar to suggestions about removing an oil injection system that is not broken. Good opinions can vary and one sometimes has to decide among them.

I've decided to leave the stabilizer module on the motor. The motor and wiring are in excellent shape and the motor is running fine as it is. Thanks to all for the good feedback guys.