oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

[2MADAKAT]

I am rebuilding a 19' Bayliner as a fishing machine. It is to be powered by a 115HP Yamaha<br />and I have a 9.9 Evinrude for a kicker.<br />My friend suggests taking the oil injector off the<br />Yamaha and he will attached two lines to gas tank.<br />One to feed Yammy and one for the kicker. Both motors are two strokes and have a 50:1 ratio.<br />Question: would it be better to keep oil injector and put portable tank in for kicker or follow his suggestion?

 

[2MADAKAT]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

By the way, I forgot to mention I want to tie the<br />kicker to the main motor. Do I always have to leave the kicker in the down position or is it <br />adjustable?

 

[quantumleap]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

What year yamaha?

 

[Winger Ed.]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

I'd keep the engines seperate so you can raise them independanly. While under way, the little put-put isn't in the water causing drag. And up in tight places you can ride along, and raise the Yamaha to keep from bumping it on the the bottom or other hazards. <br /><br /><br />As far as the oil inject feature:<br /><br />No body I know uses them. They've been disconnected on all my buddy's boats. They are a novel idea, perhaps even a solution for a problem that doesn't exist, but I just don't trust the one that came on my Merc. 150. Maybe if it was still under warranty, I'd feel different, but not with it being a few years old and the fact that if it burns up-- the problem/bill is on me instead of the factory.<br /><br /><br />Basically-<br />Its one more thing that can malfunction, and if it does--- you are going to have a big problem.

 

[2MADAKAT]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

Quantumleap, The motor is a 1988/89 and will be <br />going through a rebuild real soon.<br /><br />Winger Ed, I liked the idea of running two gas<br />lines and mixing as I go, but two of my friends<br />like the oil injection. They say they only have to fill up twice a year and not worry about it.<br />Plus oil is cheaper in bulk. Are there quick disconnects available for hooking up two motors,<br />especially if you are going to be trolling for hours.

 

[quantumleap]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

If the injection works good I would stick with it and premix on your kicker only.

 

[DJ]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

Two engines running off of a single fuel outlet does not work well unless there is a shut off valve for one or both.<br /><br />Oil injection systems are just as reliable as any other system on any outboard. They have been blamed for malodies that were not caused by them.<br /><br />Saying that oil injection is a luxury is akin to saying that hydraulic brakes on a car are a luxury.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

How about a practical suggestion? Do you have room for a portable tank? Do you know how much gas you will need for the kicker? What happens if the big motor dies and you need to go home(or to the repair shop) using the kicker? Can you mix gas while you are on the water? <br /><br />When I get my new (bigger) boat, I will equip it with a 4 cycle kicker, and keep the oil injection on the main engine. They can then use the same fuel supply. I would put a tee in the line with the proper combination of shut off valve. I would recommend that you premix the gas and use a common fuel supply for both motors. It is so much more efficient.

 

[JasonJ]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

I personally would keep the fuel systems seperate. One use of a kicker is as an emergency get-home motor. If for some ungodly reason the main tank got contaminated, you would have two engines running poorly or not at all. With seperate tanks, you always know you have reliable back-up. Alternativley, if you keep up on maintenance and have a good water seperating fuel filtration system, you can run both off of one tank reliably. You would need a valve to seperate the two engines if you go off one tank. You can go either way and be alright, so it comes down to choice based on convenience. <br /><br />As far as running on plane with the kicker, you want it to be out of the water. You also want it to be able to be lowered as far as possible while in use. The lower, the better, because the motion of the boat in swells and confused water can pull the prop out of the water and starve the water pump of water if it isn't going in far enough. The easiest way to tie the kicker to the main motor for steering is with an EZ Steer. It extends and retracts automatically so you don't have to fuss with it. Another technique is to lock the kicker so it doesn't turn at all and use the main motor as a rudder (the main is not running during this). It works fine, but if you are fighting serious wind or current, you can have difficulty. I am running mine this way but I am fabricating a tierod with heim joints because I had difficulty on a really windy day and don't want to go through that again.<br /><br />Lastly, if I had a motor with VRO, I would use it. If maintained, it is a fine system, but like a lot of things on a boat, there is some sort of black magic stigma to it when in reality it is a simple system. If it does fail it is because of something simple that may have been overlooked. Good luck....

 

[2MADAKAT]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

DJ, Why do you need shutoffs if two engines use<br />the same tank?<br />Jason, What is a VRO?

 

[DJ]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

The use of one line tends to pull fuel from one engine instead of the tank. Thus you create an air leak through the fuel system of the engine that is not running.<br /><br />VRO is an OMC term for "Variable Ratio Oiling". In generic terms in means oil injection.

 

[dajohnson53]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

Here's what I have and it works very well:<br /><br />175 2 stroke outboard, premix fuel 50:1<br />9.8 hp kicker premix fuel 50:1<br />Two built in fuel tanks with a selection valve<br />Water separating filter with one inlet and two outlets<br /><br /><br />Tank selection valve is before water filter -therefore selected tank flows through filter.<br /><br />Two outlets from water filter each with shut off valve. One goes directly to main engine, other can plug into kicker. I tend to shut one off when using the other, but it doesn't matter.<br /><br />EZ steer connection between main and kicker - allows either engine to be tilted up while the other is down and in operation. Kicker is on a bracket that can be raised and lowered. The way it's set up on my transom, it's easier to raise and lower the bracket than tilt the kicker to get it out of the water. But either or both can be done while connected to main with EZ Steer. Bery nice set up.<br /><br />The reasons I believe very strongly in having both engines on same fuel system (in my particular case - maybe yours too)<br /><br />1. I already have redundancy with the dual tanks (if one is contaminated, I still have the other; plus I always carry spare gass). <br /><br />2. The water separating filter is virtually certain to prevent problems from particulate or water contamination. If do routine PM on the water filter, I never have fuel related problems. <br /><br />3. An auxillary portable tank for the kicker would get in the way. It would also have very limited capacity if I had to use it for a long day trolling or worse yet (BTDT), going home with the kicker after the main failed. Using the on-board fuel system and having both engines use the same type (premix) of fuel allows me to use every drop on board without the mess and hazard of syphoning.

 

[JB]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

One of the good reasons to have a kicker is to have power if the main engine fails.<br /><br />One of the things that cause main engine failure is failure in the fuel delivery system.. . plugged vent, air leak, water or other contamination in the fuel. With one tank that would make both engines fail.<br /><br />The Yammy oil injection system is one of the most reliable. Keep it and run the kicker off of a portable tank.

 

[BillP]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

Like already posted, I would go for a separate fuel system for each motor. Contaminated fuel, etc is less likely to be a problem...although, fuel age could make it a problem if you don't run it for a season. <br /><br />The vro is just another system and can fail if not maintained properly.

 

[2MADAKAT]

Re: oil inject or mix/ tie kicker to main

The dual tank is a good idea, but too late for me as I already have the floor in. As far as trolling time though, I could go two days on a portable 5 gallon tank, so that is not a problem.<br />I think having the second tank, whether portable or built-in, is the best precaution.