New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

[kenimpzoom]

OK guys, just a simple question.<br /><br />On Tuesday morning, they knew the levee broke.<br /><br />By Wednesday they should have been air dropping water/food around the city where the surviors were located.<br /><br />Why was this not done?<br />Or was it, and the media didnt cover it?<br /><br />Ken

 

[rodbolt]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

was not done due to incompetent planning from the administration yes men. most of us that have lived in that area knew the levee were not designed nor capeable of a major cat 3 storm surge or above. that point has been studied for some decades. the army corps of engineers came up with a price tag in the 90's to upgrade the levee system to withstand a cat 5 surge. they feds ran a cost benifit analysis and decided to gamble. they lost. a massive airdrop on tuesday maybe should have happened. its excusable that it did not. however what is NOT excusable is the fact so many hospitals and nursing homes had no one even check on them for 3 to 4 days. also even on sunday one of the soper dome engineers had concerns about using the dome as a shelter. they were concerned with 2 points. one was the roofing system and the other was the fact that on sunday all concerned knew the building infastructue,toilets, food services etc etc would fail within 24 hours as they were never designed for that continued type use. so its not excusable that the dome was not evacuated when the winds died before the floods started. the day of Isabelle here they had helicopters at the hospital with supplies. seems they did not need them but with no communication the USCG showed up anyway to check on the local hospital. I can find any hospital or nursing home you wish with google and yahoo. I can find no other excuse other than incomptence for why the hospitals and nursing homes from AL to LA had to go 3 to 5 days with no backup generators or supplies. if someone has one post it. this storm was huge and massive. its pointed out serious flaws with the homeland bunging system. its time for them to produce a plan and publish it for all to see. the spokesman was on CNN today saying the reason why all the prepositioned equipment to cover a disaster like this has not moved is because the goveners have not asked. that response is totally unacceptable. they did ask. I saw them ask. I just wonder how the rest of the MS LA coast and low points 100 miles from the coast are doing. the infastructure of that area of the world is iffy in good times. most the bridges over various bayous and creeks were built with WPA programs in the 30's. but most those folk are rather self sufficient and can hold out a few days. I saw someone post the dumbest thing ever about trying to walk out. if you could only walk 10 miles a day, and my artheritis would most likely preclude it, that would mean from my house walking all day I would still be 10 miles in a storm that had hurricane force winds in a 200 mile diameter. thats 100 miles each side of the storm. so even if I walked 2 days I still only made 20 miles. thats still not near far enough to get shelter. I dont know about the Orleans area but my friends in the MS/AL area and my mom says there was nothing but local volunteers and locals. seems some teams from VA,OH and PA were onscene in a day or so to do SAR stuff but had no real equipment. all I can think of is the amount of equipment sitting on the ground that was not used. we have combat bridges that can span almost a mile of water that can be assembled in less than a day. I have seen the training the seabees do with it. we have the airforce combat engineers that build runways and set up air traffic controls in 5 hours or so. we have marines and navy and army personel, some are cousins, that were ready to deploy sunday. they sre still waiting chomping at the bit. but its ramping up. its amazing how fast. a slow start to be sure but its going, now to see if they will use some of the closed bases for refugees. how long can 20K people stay in the astrodome? not long is my bet. this catastrophe has met many many predictions. the predictors were laughed at. but alas it has come. look up the predictions for when mt rainer pops its top. not if it pops, when it pops cause pop it will someday. will make this event look like a thunder storm. but mostly I think the ansew to your question is just poor planning. the plan relied to much on local autority and we all know that for some days after a total catastrophe there is no local stuff. that has been demonstrated at least 10 times since 1969.<br /> its not anyone in particulars fault, although as president the final responsibility is GW's. authority can be delegated, responsibility cannot. its that simple. its how the military runs. if master chief came down and said petty officer knucklehead I need this machine moved to here by liberty call. I would say aye aye master chief. if I called up a couple seamen and seamen apprentices and told them move this machine here and they did not at liberty call its my arse that gets blistered not thiers. I gave them the authority to move it along with a direct order, it does not relieve me of the responsibility of the movement. thats kinda why I cant think of any good reason someone would actually want to be the president, that in itself shows a character flaw .but as I have personally seen most the time the people in charge have all the book learnings you can imagine but no ground experience. that makes the machine to top heavy to move rapidly. its a shame but it is what it is. its kinda like going to volvo, yamaha and merc schools. most the instructors as well as most the service reps have never worked in the field as a line tech. all they know is what the school house told them. I went to a drive train school last year. the closest the instructor ever got to actual outboards is he worked on the OMC assy line in cahoon GA. other than that hed had no experience and was teaching a course that was not OMC or BRP. you go figgure. my last service rep was an aircraft tech in the USN 6 months before he became a field service rep. he had never worked for any outboard dealers or service depts. same as with our govt today. appts are based on party loyalty and not on sheer ability and if anyone says the emporer has no clothes they get fired.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Ah defeatism at its finest. As to your comments about rowing/walking out well you are just flat wrong. If you could make it just 30 miles north of NO you would be on dry land and on hwy. 10. Water was waiting. This wouldn't qualify under the category of an Incredible Journey. People have been known to lift automobiles in life and death situations but a thirty mile walk just isn't possible in your opinion. Horse Feathers!!!! The Refinery on 10 between NO and Baton Rouge is already up. That is 38 miles. Sorry to hear about your arthritus but then you wouldn't qualify under the "able bodied" heading. Note, the coast guard is a government body and were on the scene almost instantly. But to say that people couldn't have helped themselves shows exactly what part of the problem is.<br /><br />I agree with your assessment of the bloated and oversized government unable to react quickly. I also agree with your assessment of political appointed leadership positions creating paralasis by analysis. Most Phd's teaching today couldn't find their arse with either hand in the field. I used to be the book smart tech, now I am the seasoned field rep. and learned quickly the difference. You know the old saying that sargents win the war. Very true. I work for a large company and our inability to change quickly puts us sometimes at a disadvantage versus the smaller more flexible competitors. <br /><br />But enough with fixing the blame there is much work to do here.

 

[CalicoKid]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Ken, simple answer: We screwed up.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Amen, C-kid.

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

I think there is a ton of misinformation out there and before people assumes they know anything, they should wait for the facts. 2 or 3 nights ago I heard people complaining about the MREs in the Dome. So was there food or not? What was all the garbage (looked like food and water bottles to me) but who knows? So, keep your powder dry.<br /><br />The next thing to remember is the State authorities have control over their states and have PRIMARY RESPONSIBILITY for disaster relief (remember the crap Jeb caught a few years ago with one of the big storms?). Not the Feds as some seem to think, The Feds can not send troops in or do a damn thing without the Governor asking for it. In fact, active duty troops are prevented by Federal law from acting in a law enforcement capacity within the US. The Guard and Coast Guard are exempt. The Guard is under the direct control of the Governor, not the President. On O'Reilly an "investigation" about why the Guard was not called in showed the Governor did not call them in. No one knows why. Some think there was a communication problem. Some think it was a decision problem. For some reason, they sat on the outskirts waiting for orders to move.<br /><br />Finally remember, all the air assets were used to save people who lives were in IMMINENT DANGER. Even so, they were taking fire from the ground form those they were trying to help.<br /><br />So, like I said, before anyone points fingers and hurls invectives, wait for the facts.<br /><br />I do have some questions:<br /><br />1) Why weren't the people evacuated before the storm? Why weren't provisions made for the people in the projects who local officials should have know would have a hard time getting out? Why weren't all the available school busses pressed into service to get people out before the storm?<br /><br />2) Why weren't there provisions for evacuating the prisoners rather than simply letting them out onto the street and telling all the innocent people to "run, we can't protect you"?<br /><br />3) Were provisions stocked at the Dome and Convention center? If not, why not? Who's responsibility is that? Why weren't they bussed out rather than put in the dome anyway?<br /><br />4) Where were the police? Why is the French Quarter untouched?<br /><br />5) Why didn't the Governor declare Marshal law?<br /><br />6) Why didn't the Governor ask the Feds to take over when the scope of the disaster became clear?<br /><br />7) Why weren't the levees beefed up years ago?<br /><br />On and on they go...

 

[wildbill59]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Wouldn't mind seeing if the money was well spent.<br />Just this week it came out that LaCrosse, WI bought a $130,000 armored car with Homeland Security funds. Boy that Homeland Security sure has a lot of money to toss around.<br /><br /><br />IEM Team to Develop Catastrophic Hurricane Disaster Plan for New Orleans & Southeast Louisiana <br />June 3, 2004 <br /> <br />IEM, Inc., the Baton Rouge-based emergency management and homeland security consultant, will lead the development of a catastrophic hurricane disaster plan for Southeast Louisiana and the City of New Orleans under a more than half a million dollar contract with the U.S. Department of Homeland Security/Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). <br /><br />In making the announcement today on behalf of teaming partners Dewberry, URS Corporation and James Lee Witt Associates, IEM Director of Homeland Security Wayne Thomas explained that the development of a base catastrophic hurricane disaster plan has urgency due to the recent start of the annual hurricane season which runs through November. National weather experts are predicting an above normal Atlantic hurricane season with six to eight hurricanes, of which three could be categorized as major. <br /><br />The IEM team will complete a functional exercise on a catastrophic hurricane strike in Southeast Louisiana and use results to develop a response and recovery plan. A catastrophic event is one that can overwhelm State, local and private capabilities so quickly that communities could be devastated without Federal assistance and multi-agency planning and preparedness. <br /><br />Thomas said that the greater New Orleans area is one of the nation’s most vulnerable locations for hurricane landfall. <br /><br />“Given this area’s vulnerability, unique geographic location and elevation, and troubled escape routes, a plan that facilitates a rapid and effective hurricane response and recovery is critical,” he said. “The IEM team’s approach to catastrophic planning meets the challenges associated with integrating multi-jurisdictional needs and capabilities into an effective plan for addressing catastrophic hurricane strikes, as well as man-made catastrophic events.” <br /><br />IEM President and CEO Madhu Beriwal is the recipient of a s pecial merit award from the Louisiana Emergency Preparedness Association ( LEPA ) for her work in New Orleans hurricane emergency preparedness. <br /><br />IEM, Inc. was founded in 1985, and is one of the leading emergency management corporations in the U.S. While some organizations include emergency management as one of many business areas, helping to plan for and manage emergencies is IEM’s core business . IEM’s clients include some of the foremost federal emergency and defense organizations in the U.S., including the Department of Homeland Security/FEMA, the Defense Threat Reduction Agency and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. www.ieminc.com<br /><br />Established in 1956, Dewberry is a multidisciplinary planning, engineering, and design firm, employing more than 1,600 individuals. As FEMA’s largest contractor, Dewberry plays a significant role in the national effort to reduce the impact of both natural (flood, fire, earthquake, tropical storm, cyclone, hurricane, tornado, and winter storm) and man-made (hazardous waste, terrorism, etc.) hazards on people, property, and the economy. www.dewberry.com<br /><br />URS Corporation provides planning, engineering, architecture, and applied science to hundreds of government agencies and private industrial and commercial companies worldwide. The company has more than 26,000 employees -- the largest Architectural & Engineering firm in the U. S. for the fourth consecutive year.URS has approximately 500 employees in Louisiana. URS has over 30 years of experience in hazard mitigation planning and engineering support work for FEMA and other customers. www.urscorp.com<br /><br />James Lee Witt Associates, LLC, established in 2001 by the former director of the Federal Emergency Management Agency, is a leader in public safety and crisis management. Headquartered in Washington, D.C., with offices in Atlanta, Chicago and Sacramento, James Lee Witt Associates works with state, local and foreign governments, corporations, hospitals, universities and utilities in conducting vulnerability assessments, after-event audits and reviews, developing all-hazard emergency and continuity of operations planning, as well as with the telecommunications industry on wireless interoperability. www.wittassociates.com

 

[rodbolt]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

wildbill59<br /> other than warm fuzzies for politicians what did the public get for that 1/2 million dollar study ?<br /> Ralph<br /> 1, complacency, contempt of the storm and the fact man thinks he is greater than nature. <br /> 2, same as one. law enforcement usually believes they will be standing no matter what.<br /> 3 no, those places were never designated nor designed as shelters. the building infastructure cannot handle that many people for 24 hours. but it was the only life boat some had. had thjey grabbed every buss in the city you are only taling about maybe 2500 people. takes 3 to 40 hours each way in good weather with no traffic to get far enough to be safe. remember the hurricane force winds were 200 miles and tropical storm force winds and rain for 400. busses dont like wet pavement,45mph and 55mph winds. they tend to be ditch diggers. plus by sunday there were no roads open anyway. all were parking lots. its a flaw in the evac planning. happens here every summer. <br />4, the police found themselves not to be gods. they were just as devestated as the rest of the population. repeaters failed,comms failed its a big city with lots of buildings. with no repeaters you have no radio comms unless its line of sight with the transmitter/reciever. the french quater stayed dry cause its elevation is some of the higest in the area. thats why the french started building on that ridge by the MS river to start with. the levees and marsh reclamation was an american thing. land in the port city was at a premium so they pumped and leveed the ground water. pumps in NO have run almost 100 years just to keep the ground water underground. thats why they bury the dead above ground as well. most cemetaries there if you placed a coffin 6ft under the ground water will pop it back up soon.<br /> 5 and 6. he tyried. he was overwhelmed and who was he going to call? he called the feds but they were overwhelmed as well. goes back to incompetence on all parts. seems the home land bungling we paid for garnered awards and alocades from the politicians but was either flawed,not used or lost.<br /> 7, in the 90's the army corps of engineers was tasked with the studies for that project. a cost benefit analysis was done. it was deemed by the feds that the cost of beefing up the system outwieghed the risk of a cat 3 or larger storm surge. they rolled the dice and this time it was 3's. they can claim 500 year storm all they wish. its possible that another the same size can occur in the same place next week.<br /> pointer<br /> let me get thois right<br /> I have 24 hours notice to start walking in 95 degree heat with about 90%humidity with a wife 2 kids and some possesions, even if its just some spare clothes and paperwork. I start out at 6 am hoofing it west on 158. if I dont get run over on the currituck bridge its a five mile walk to the other side. we are going to assume a mile every 30 min and let the kids take a 20 min break. I may make what 2 miles every hour to hour and a half. lets assume I managed 10 miles by dark. also knowing most stores are shut down and the shopkeepers have bailed as well. so now I am 10 miles or even 15 from kitty hawk. now the winds are tropical storm force. 35mph+ and the rain bands feel like needle and its getting dark. where do me, the wife and the kids sleep? now we have 10 hours or so of darkness. now its light again and I have 4 hours before impact and the windspeed is no closing in on hurricane force. debris is flying, rain feels like a pellet gun. windblown sand penetrates exposed skin(trust me on that one). how many more miles can we make it. the closest thing that may be a shelter is currituck county high school and its 40 miles from where I started. walking out is not an option with a hurricane. unless you have a specific known safe destination its just not an option. if you have never been in the sand,rain and debris field when the wind speed exceeds 60 MPH you wont understand. I have seen the blowing sand here frost windows,dechrome bumpers and remove all paint from the exposed sides of cars. it will also dehide exposed flesh. and sand is something we have a lot of here.

 

[achris]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

America, hang your head in shame. I have been watching this unfold with total disbelief. Lawlessness in the street of a major American city. People trying to help being shot! What idiot gave them guns? And to make it worst, 40 Australians total abandon by the American authorities and the Australian authorities who asked for information told there was none! This is a disgrace! America can't even help its own people, how do they expect to help others, namely Iraq. <br /><br />This is an example of how American society will look in the near future, if something isn't done about very soon.<br /><br />Some moron wrote in answer to my suggestion that this would happen that 'people with guns were citizens, people without guns were subjects'. How do you feel about that statement now, idiot!<br /><br />I wonder how the pilots being shot at and the guardsman who was shot feel? <br /><br />NRA are idoits without any sense of responsiblity. The national guard should have sent that moron leader of the NRA to face what he'd created. Maybe the armed citizens of New Orleans would have granted his wish. From his cold, dead hand. Maybe then all you gunfreaks will realise the futility of that particularly insidious piece of legislation.

 

[Elmer Fudge]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Oh boy! here we go, let's play the blame game, this will positively contribute to an already dire situation

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

looters took chain saws and fishing poles. One gang chased away the security guards and emptied the Wal-Mart of guns and ammunition, enough to arm a company of soldiers.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9179587/

 

[POINTER94]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Chris,<br /><br />superficially one could hear your emotionally based attack on guns, our country, citizens who stand for a position (who you think should be killed), and understand what a perfect utopia you aspire to could be. One problem. Your wrong. Sounds more like Russia to me.<br /><br />First off, the people who are turning this city into a war zone are crimminals. The NRA is against crimminals having guns, which is consistant with the LAW. Therefore they had weapons ILLEGALLY. Liberals want to give these types the right to vote. Now how does that play into your scenario of the future? Who will be providing this insightful leadership in your "future"? If this disaster occured in my neighborhood, crimminals would not bother coming in. It would be a mistake. Of course if you put good citizens in a situation of anarchy, a means of defence is paramount. Lest anarchy remain. <br /><br />Based on your "unique" view, why would the government need guns? No guns, no need for the government to have them unless it is your contention that government always has the best interest of its citizens in mind and would never do anything to hurt it's citizens. See 1.4 million aborted babies piled up. Check out slavery. But hey, it could never happen here right?<br /><br />I didn't know that those guns walked out on the street by themselves, loaded themselves, aimed themselves, and fired themselves at others. Oh wait, that is our new voting constituents that did it. <br /><br />The NRA teaches more gun SAFETY courses than anyone this side of the military. The NRA understands that wether those in Australia don't like what our laws state, the second ammendment was included for a reason. They also understand that if government gets too big, it is the citizens who have the power, see revolutionary war. Those who would have the laws change would then have to a)close all boarders, b) eliminate all international travel, c) have state own all means of manufacturing as guns are not hard to make, d) go house to house in violation of hundreds of laws to remove the millions and millions of guns already in circulation. e) How about knives? Start the process again. f) how about those people who use guns to eat. Ask PW2 how many people in his area live on hunted deer and other animals. Wards of the government I suppose. g) according to the reporting heads, far more rapes occured than shootings, by your reasoning, we should all be castrated. I vote no.<br /><br />Being afraid of an inanimate object is sad. Adults have the right to be responsible, and based on the number of guns in circulation, 99.9% are. More people are killed by cars than guns. Should those be outlawed as well? Did Wayne LaPierre use any weapon in an unsafe fashion? You would like to see him dead. Nice approach. You need to face your fears instead of projecting them on those who understand the dynamic that is the United States.<br /><br />Any and all laws are by definition, restriction of freedom. Less laws = more freedom. Support your local legislator with a gag.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

I am about with Ralph<br /> so far my Fiancee in VE and a friend in lituania as well as a cousin in england have all asked me about the Lawlessness in NO. its all been perpetrated by a very very small segment of society in a place where most civilians are unarmed. thats why you dont hear of house to house burgulary and rape in most the out lying areas and states.<br /> the average goodole boy in LA, MS and AL has not only weapons but the training and practice to actually hit what they aim at.<br /> fireing a weapon with any accuracy requires a certain amount of trainiing and practice. holly wood makes it seem simple.<br /><br /> you read about snipers shooting at rescue workers and helos in the NO area.<br /> what you dont see is how many targets were hit.<br /> had it been me or some of my buddies your headlines would be much different.<br /><br /> if your 100yds away and it was me or some of my friends taking sniper shots odds are you would never hear the sound of the gunshot. same as if your 25yds away when the hammer drops on the redhawk. odds are you wont hear it.<br /> good thing is most of the drug crazed idiots have no training nor practice as most cannot legaly own or practice with a firearm.<br />still makes them a danger but its a lesser one.<br /><br /> goes back to the bumber sticker<br /> if you outlaw guns only outlaws will own them.<br /> this country is awash with firearms, always has been hopefully always will be.<br /> my opinion is gun control means the ability to hit what ya aim at.<br /> I do agree that anyone with a felony conviction must be kept away from any weapons.<br /> the penalty for being caught as a convicted felon with a firearm should be life with no possibility of parole. seems those folks tend to demonstrate they cannot, by themselves, live with the rest of us.

 

[jtexas]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Originally posted by achris:<br /> And to make it worst, 40 Australians total abandon by the American authorities and the Australian authorities who asked for information told there was none!

chris...you forgot something...when travelling abroad, check in with your consulate...contrary to popular belief, we don't implant RFID at the border and track your movements through our country. Maybe then we would have been able to give preferential treatment to your pansy a55es...nah.<br /><br />In Europe they confiscate your passport when you check into a hotel, but since you've lived in the US, you know that we don't.

 

[deputydawg]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Where would you suggest they "air drop" food to? Surely not into the middle of a large puddle of flood water, or into the middle of a neighborhood? <br /><br />In order to drop food and water into a place like this, they would need a large force of armed guards there first to keep order. People turn to animals in a hurry, faster in this situation sounds like. Who would shoulder the blame when the air dropped food was descended upon by a mob? Who would we blame if the mob going for the air drop started shooting each other for their fair share? Who would be to blame if someone was trampled in trying to get to the food and water? <br /><br />If they gave food and water to rescuers to distribute, then they would be spending all their efforts delivering instead of rescuing. <br /><br />If this was done, and someone was to distribute then where do they start? At the edge of high ground, or in the middle, or at the lowest hardest hit area? What if the starting point happened to be a high class or white neighborhood? or maybe a black neighborhood, or the trailer park? Where would they start to avoid the accusations? <br /><br />There should have been a plan in place for where to set up food and water sites and distribution points. Maybe there was but the storm wiped these points out. We are speculating on what the media has told us. By doing this speculating, we are playing right into the media's game and going for their bait.

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Amen DD - back to my theory: The root cause of the expectation problem is most American don't make anything or do something tangible for a living any more. As a result, they have no idea what it takes to do something big and complex. As a result, they expect magic.<br /><br />Who in their right mind is going to take on the tough, complex and dirty jobs in this country any more when all you get in return are cheap shots and criticized. Especially if you belong to the wrong party, etc...

 

[Kenneth Brown]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Originally posted by rodbolt:<br /> pointer<br /> let me get thois right<br /> I have 24 hours notice to start walking in 95 degree heat with about 90%humidity with a wife 2 kids and some possesions, even if its just some spare clothes and paperwork. I start out at 6 am hoofing it west on 158. if I dont get run over on the currituck bridge its a five mile walk to the other side. we are going to assume a mile every 30 min and let the kids take a 20 min break. I may make what 2 miles every hour to hour and a half. lets assume I managed 10 miles by dark. also knowing most stores are shut down and the shopkeepers have bailed as well. so now I am 10 miles or even 15 from kitty hawk. now the winds are tropical storm force. 35mph+ and the rain bands feel like needle and its getting dark. where do me, the wife and the kids sleep? now we have 10 hours or so of darkness. now its light again and I have 4 hours before impact and the windspeed is no closing in on hurricane force. debris is flying, rain feels like a pellet gun. windblown sand penetrates exposed skin(trust me on that one). how many more miles can we make it. the closest thing that may be a shelter is currituck county high school and its 40 miles from where I started. walking out is not an option with a hurricane. unless you have a specific known safe destination its just not an option. if you have never been in the sand,rain and debris field when the wind speed exceeds 60 MPH you wont understand. I have seen the blowing sand here frost windows,dechrome bumpers and remove all paint from the exposed sides of cars. it will also dehide exposed flesh. and sand is something we have a lot of here.

Well Rodbolt I guess you just sit on your a$$ and don't even TRY to save your family. Most peole wlak an average 3-4 MPH, not 2. Even if its only 2 MPH why stop at 10 hours? I am sure that you will be tired but its a chance to be ALIVE. Its not about being comfortable. Its about being ALIVE. I live in the boonies. If we had a major disturbance hit here I could survive, and prosper too. My skills are that good. I spent most of my youth in the wild. I still check out camping/survival books from the library. I teach my children (3 and 10, both girls) what to look for and how to eat it. I make them pick it out thereselves and check them on it. Even the little one can start a fire. I WILL keep my family alive, thats my purpose. To those who choose to sit there and die, well I reckon they deseve it. Thats how I feel, like it or not.

 

[jtexas]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Originally posted by Kenneth Brown:<br /> Well Rodbolt I guess you just sit on your a$$ and don't even TRY to save your family. Most peole wlak an average 3-4 MPH, not 2. Even if its only 2 MPH why stop at 10 hours? I am sure that you will be tired but its a chance to be ALIVE. Its not about being comfortable. Its about being ALIVE. I live in the boonies. If we had a major disturbance hit here I could survive, and prosper too. My skills are that good. I spent most of my youth in the wild. I still check out camping/survival books from the library. I teach my children (3 and 10, both girls) what to look for and how to eat it. I make them pick it out thereselves and check them on it. Even the little one can start a fire. I WILL keep my family alive, thats my purpose. To those who choose to sit there and die, well I reckon they deseve it. Thats how I feel, like it or not.

yo, Kenneth, go easy on us tenderfoots here! We aint all spent most of our youth in the wild...we're not talking about a rural area...not all our youngun's can walk 3-4 mph for 10 hours straight...I ain't criticising your plan, man, it's great. But we ain't sitting around waiting to die, man, we are going to the shelter provided by the city (which by the way I am part of and pay taxes to, so it ain't a govt hand-out, I do have a bit of ownership in it). <br /><br />Anyway, I would not take my family outdoors with the hurricane approaching. I'd urge you not to, either. There's a very strong probability that you would NOT be ALIVE, but instead would be DEAD. But I still respect your decision.

 

[BillP]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Did anybody see the interview of the dude with his wife and kids who walked out from their flooded house to the Dome? And then walked 10 more miles out to get help the next day. He said they weren't going to sit around and wait for somebody to bring help when they could get out and find help themselves. The network showed time and distance walked...2 mph x 5 hrs = 10 miles.

 

[Kenneth Brown]

Re: New Orleans Help - Why didnt they

Originally posted by jtexas:<br />

yo, Kenneth, go easy on us tenderfoots here! We aint all spent most of our youth in the wild...we're not talking about a rural area...not all our youngun's can walk 3-4 mph for 10 hours straight...I ain't criticising your plan, man, it's great. But we ain't sitting around waiting to die, man, we are going to the shelter provided by the city (which by the way I am part of and pay taxes to, so it ain't a govt hand-out, I do have a bit of ownership in it). <br /><br />Anyway, I would not take my family outdoors with the hurricane approaching. I'd urge you not to, either. There's a very strong probability that you would NOT be ALIVE, but instead would be DEAD. But I still respect your decision. [/quote]<br /><br /><br />They had at minimum 48 hours notice. If they walked only half of that at only 2 mph they would be 48 miles away. This ain't a rural area huh, yep, that means you should be able to walk further/faster. I don't know for sure but I bet that anywhere in the city is less than 48 miles to the shelters. Why did they stay in the houses? Why not go to the shelter? I agree with your decision to go to the shelter, IF all you had was your feet to get you there. If you had a car and went to the dome,um, nope. If you were old and crippled hope would be your best bet. Thats where believing in a higher power comes in.