New OMS install and now this......

simmonatural

Cadet
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
9
Hi all,

I had hoped I would be posting on the fishing forums by now but apparently, I need more help or at least an idea of what I need to do next

1992 VJ150exenc (with OMS active)

Initial symptom.... falling on face while on plane, engine stalls, pump primer bulb, starts up, back on plane then fall on face again, and again then, runs fine with no issues. (got symptoms to repeat on subsequent solo trips)

No longer family friendly, start to investigate.

Compression good in all 6 cylinders.

Rig is 20 years old and no plans for new boat or engine so, new OMS (including pulse valve (blue)), new fuel lines, new sending unit, check anti siphon valve, not there...(that's ok from my standpoint...all uphill feed) tank vent, clear, pickup tube screen, clear. Install new Racor to replace old sierra water separator. Service oil tank with new oil line, gasket, primer bulb.


So, fuel bracket back in place, everything is tightened up.
Run new install procedure with test tank w/ 50:1 mix, reconnect oil line to inlet with fresh oil right at the tip.

Start engine...wait to hear no oil alarm, don't hear it. Instead, engine stalls. Pump fuel bulb...(5 to 7 times, feels like there should be more fuel present in the line), engine starts back up and stalls after carbs are emptied. with a lot of smoke too because oil pump is pumping.

Raise test tank above engine and she runs and runs and runs, smokier than usual because oil is pumping, and I am running 50:1 premix in test tank resulting in a rich mix.

Please excuse the length of this post, I want to make sure you guys have all the info...

Seems like no vacuum from the pump to draw fuel through the system .(maybe 8 ft of line)
I have seen the oil level drop in the oil tank.
Hooked it up to below deck tank and runs out of fuel. (same as test tank when slightly below the level of the fuel intake)
Fuel is readily available through main fuel line.
No fuel supply restrictions, new pump, new pulse hose and fitting.

What could be causing the pump to not pull fuel?

I am stumped, hoping I didn't get a bad pump.
Any help is always appreciated.
 

fireman57

Captain
Joined
Aug 24, 2004
Messages
3,811
Re: New OMS install and now this......

sounds like a bad fuel pump. When it starts to bog have someone pump the primer bulb repeatedly and see if it picks up. If it does just replace your fuel pump.
 

Chris1956

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 25, 2004
Messages
28,580
Re: New OMS install and now this......

Since it is a new OMS pump, let's ignore that for now. What about the vapor pump on the vapor seperator? Maybe that diaghram is bad? How about the vapor seperator inlet needle and seat/ Vapor seperator cover gasket?
 

DC20

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 5, 2007
Messages
361
Re: New OMS install and now this......

Chris, what does the vapor seperator do? Besides seperate vapor:)
And what are the symptoms of a bad one?
 

Chris1956

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 25, 2004
Messages
28,580
Re: New OMS install and now this......

Vapor seperator is like a sealed carb bowl. It has a float, inlet needle and seat. It provides a bowl of fuel that gravity feeds to the OMS pump. I believe the vapor pump and the OMS pump share the load of pumping fuel from the fuel tank to the carbs. If the vapor pump was bad or the vapor seperator components were bad, I would think the motor would starve for fuel.

I have never had the "pleasure" of having a bad vapor pump or vapor seperator, so these are just suggestions, based upon my study of the OEM Service manual.
 

boobie

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
Messages
20,826
Re: New OMS install and now this......

Take the inlet fuel line off of the oms pump, hook up your 6 gal tank and run it. This by-passes the vapor seperator and ect. It it still doesn't run you've got a bad oms pump. If it runs,you have other probs.
 

simmonatural

Cadet
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
9
Re: New OMS install and now this......

Thank you gentlemen for your responses.
The vapor pump is the one component that I did not touch.
I set the float (level and drop) and replaced the needle and seat in the VST.

So, after a quick check, if there are vacuum pulses sucking into the vent hose (from the baffle to the vapor pump) something is definitely wrong, and air is being sucked into the VST making it impossible to have a primed system, among other bad things I'm guessing...
I think i need a new vapor pump!

I will follow up when i have more time to dig in... I hate when work gets in the way of boat repairs.
Thanks again for the thoughtful advice and link.
 

Chris1956

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 25, 2004
Messages
28,580
Re: New OMS install and now this......

Did you check the Vapor Pump cover gasket? If that leaks you will not have a good fuel pump function.
 

simmonatural

Cadet
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
9
Re: New OMS install and now this......

boobie, thanks for the tip, i had the dang test tank connected to the main fuel inlet.
Runs fine...still super smoky but I guess 25:1 will do that.
Chris and Faztbullet,
I see this is not the first time you've had this conversation...
I replaced said gasket when i did the needle and seat. The cover is good.
The vapor pump is not good, going to rebuild and re-test soon. Will report back.
The pictures really helped, thanks again...
 

simmonatural

Cadet
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
9
Re: New OMS install and now this......

Hello gentlemen,

Just wanted to let y'all know that the vapor pump rebuild, and re-assembly was a success. Motor started right up and ran for 15 minutes like a top. That is a pretty important part of the fuel supply system.

The metal disc was slightly dented, is that ok?? I replaced the diaphragm and reused the other gasket and thats that.

I may have spent a bit too much money on this repair, but in the end, she's running great and I have a bunch of new stuff in the most important area on the motor. (and possibly a nice bunch of spare parts ;-) )

Now its time to test WOT on the water. Thanks for the help
 

simmonatural

Cadet
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
9
Re: New OMS install and now this......

Got out on the water far a quick test. Runs like new....almost.
I feel like anything plastic or rubber in the fuel system finally reached the end of it's life and started to fail.
After 45 mins on the water i pulled cowling and silencer to have a look. Noticed wet areas around stbd fuel intake manifold.
I also noticed a fuel soaked area on the foam on the inside of my cowling.(on the stbd side)
6 new orings later and she is practically new and my thoughts of repower have started to be replaced with fishing destinations I need to hit this year before they go up the river....

Thanks for providing a great service to guys like me...
 
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