Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

[Dekkerd]

So my neighbours house cooked this weekend. My boat was nearest thing in our driveway to it. The indirect heat was hot enough to melt the vinyl, brown the gelcoat, melt a tower speaker. Any plastic is melted including trailer lights and straps. The boat decal is discolored.

I have full replacement boat insurance, also might be covered under house insurance. What im here to ask you guys is there any chance of hidden damages. I will be talking to my insurance company tomorrow. Should I be demanding some sort of hull strength tests? Some people have suggested that fiberglass will lose strength if it gets to a certain temperature. Maybe theres seals around the leg that got cooked. My trailer tire might be ready to pop?

 

[Boats-A-lots]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Wow.. great pics, felt like I was there, but what a tragedy for you and your neighbor. I'm not sure how hot the motor has to get, or the drive to melt or distort the o rings, and gaskets.

 

[QC]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Wow. I am guessing everyone is OK. Does this become a claim on your neighbor's home insurance? I am guessing your insurance company will handle that, but just curious. My guess is that there is nothing structurally wrong. Just a guess at this point. I would seriously doubt any engine or drive issues. Good luck, to you and your neighbor!

 

[Viking62]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

WOW! I can't help with your question but that is a FIRE. Hope nobody got hurt!

 

[Dekkerd]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Just there kids were home, they got out fine. This was at 4am. They woke up to the smell of the smoke, no alarms went off. By the time they realised it was basically what you see in the pictures. Firehall is 2 blocks away so 5 min after the 911 call was made there was water being put on the flames. Cause of the fire was electrical, started in the garage and the electrical panel.

So theres a good reminder to go check your smoke alarms!

oh also my neighbour replaced there old cedar roof 2 years ago, we replaced ours last year. If we still had the 20 year old cedar shingles up there both houses would have been burnt. I would have woke up to flames falling on me rather just flames outside my bedroom window.

 

[Jlawsen]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Hum, what would I do.. Not sure I don't know the laws in BC. I guess I would ask for a hull survey done by a qualified marine surveyor to determine the value of the boat before and after repairs. It's possible that your insurance company will do this when they are makeing a decision to repair or replace. I was once told by a person whom I trust that if I was offered full replacement insurance to pay for it. THe insurance company will still have to honor it even if they decide to repair this time.

 

[Dekkerd]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Yah Im curious to how the insurance will play out. One of the fire captains mentioned my insurance company will go to my neighbours insurance company to pay for it. But thats all done for me, I only deal with my insurance company. Ill definitely ask for a hull survey. This will be my first time dealing with private insurance. I know how ICBC works for auto insurance and there write of policies. We'll see if its similar with this private company and boats.

Even just cosmetic repairs, all new vinyl and a cut polish to the gelcoat wont be cheap. Atleast 5000$

 

[skyking897]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

I'm not sure about your fiberglass boat, but aircraft made of fiberglass or whatever you want to call it are very succepible to high temps. And that critical temp is not all that high. The glass layups will actually begin to creep and loose structural integrity. One reason most glass aircraft are painted white. Dark colors get too hot inside the panels. I'm thinking if your gel coat bubbled you had better get someone who really knows fiberglass to check it out.

 

[metriccrescentwrench]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

I'm not sure about your fiberglass boat, but aircraft made of fiberglass or whatever you want to call it are very succepible to high temps. And that critical temp is not all that high. The glass layups will actually begin to creep and loose structural integrity. One reason most glass aircraft are painted white. Dark colors get too hot inside the panels. I'm thinking if your gel coat bubbled you had better get someone who really knows fiberglass to check it out.

The deal with fiberglass airplanes is that most all of them use a structural foam core which will soften at a relatively low temperature. Planes are all built using epoxy resin, whereas nearly all production boats still use polyester resin which has a significantly lower Tg (glass transition temperature, the temperature the cured resin will "soften") than epoxy. In this case if the boat got hot enough to singe the gelcoat it was significantly hotter than the polyester resin Tg and there's no way in hell I'd trust the fiberglass structure after that.

Sorry for the bad news.

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Fiberglass boat is actually a misnomer. The hull material is actually fiberglass reinforced plastic. The plastic is a liquid styrene monomer catalyzed to a polymer which is a solid. It is susceptible to ultraviolet light which is why all hulls are coated in gelcoat--it is actually a UV barrier.

If the heat was intense enough to discolor the gelcoat there is a good possibility of styrene damage, breaking the polymer bonding. I would not trust the hull. I would get a good marine surveyor to go over it and then deal with insurance.

 

[Lakes84]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Tough situation, sorry about your boat and neighbors house. Glad there wasn't any injuries. Insurance companies know a lot about that sort of thing. They'll look at the temps that would melt surrounding materials as well as the damaged areas, to get a good indication of the heat your boat endured. I used to be a fire inspector and we had a sort of formula that we would used to measure the charring of wood and other materials. They'll more than likely use a similar formula. I think if you push them, you might get a replacement boat. I wouldn't want to have them make repairs and then keep wondering about your hull strength. I'm not thinking they could prove it isn't compromised. Just pray their insurance plays ball.....

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Do yourself a favor and get a marine surveyor or independent insurance adjuster. Insurance companies are a for-profit business and they don't make a profit by paying maximum dollar. While having insurance sets your mind at ease, in reality they don't have your best interests as primary concern.

Since the fire was unexpected and if it was not due to negligence, the burden of paying for damages is very likely NOT on his policy but YOURS.

True life example: A large tree in my yard was blown over by wind, crushing a neighbors garage and the car inside it. I contacted my homeowners insurance. Because it was an act of nature, because the tree was sound and growing, and because I had not been previously informed that the tree was unsafe, my insurance told me I had no liability. I was not negligent. His homeowners policy was totally responsible for damages.

 

[emoney]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Man, I really feel for your neighbors because of the stuff that "wasn't valuable" from a monetary standpoint. Those are the things we cherish the most (pictures, memory keepers so-to-speak). Glad no one was injured, as that's all that truly matters.

@Frank, wouldn't the fact that it originated in the wiring panel in the garage make it NOT be an "Act of Nature"?

I think you're dealing with a much larger issue that you may be considering. I agree with the above that if nothing else, your hull at least on the starboard side, has weakened at minimum. Also, your boat looks like it's a relatively newer model and depreciation does and will come into play. Sure, most anything is fixable, but if you become a seller, at least in the States, you would need to disclose that repair work because it will be noticeable to someone looking at it. That lowers the value of your boat and that's AFTER it's fixed. Should the insurance company decide it's repairable, then you need to also seek compensation for "future loss". Most people don't ask for this, but the insurance companies are fully aware of it and they know that's part of the claim. I've seen that become the difference between a "total loss" and a "repair", and it should be. Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[oldjeep]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Only thing I have to add is to check the wiring harness in the boat. They generally run very close to where the upper and lower hull are assembled and you're going to want to make sure that the isulation did not crack, melt or get brittle from the heat.

 

[emoney]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Great point Jeep. Also, I'd want them to "split it". Remove the top half so the foam underneath, and the wiring Jeep mentioned, could be inspected. Of course, then you're dealing with a boat that's been split and is no longer "factory". See how these things start to add up rather quickly?

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

while Frank is rightthat sometimes the insurance companies are not going to be "on your side" I have found them often surprisingly cooperative and even generous.

I'd start by calling yours to notify of the loss and see what they recommend. you do not have to file a claim against yours now but you should notify immediately. Yours may direct you to file a claim against theirs; yours may pay yours and get subrogation from theirs.

You would be better off with a "total" and not worry about what may have happened.

What may end up is your insurance pays your replacement and his pays yours the value of the boat. Remember, replacement is part of your contract. If your used boat is worth $8000 and it costs $16000 to replace, your neighbor, if he's liable, only owes you for what he damaged--an $8000 boat.
Check your policy to see if "replacement" means brand new or just like what you have--including its year.

It would be unusual for your homeowners to cover a boat that size.

 

[BF]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Scary stuff. If they argue to repair rather than replace it, consider you loss of use during the repair process. If they factor in a rental for some outings during the repair process, it might push it into a total loss category... If it were me, I think I'd be pushing for a replacement. How about the shift and throttle cables? They're right behind that fiberglass and would've got hot. I'd be worried about issues like that coming up even if it worked fined for the first while after repair.

 

[shrew]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Keep in mind that at 212F water boils and essentially turns to steam. Why is this important? The gaskets, hoses, etc. are all designed to exceed this temperature. However, how much more than 212 F? How hot did the rubber and platic items get in proximity to the fire? In my mind, every hose, gasket, electrical wire sheath in the boat would now be suspect until I'm told or proven otherwise.

The best answer, IMHO is:

1) Get your neighbors insurance information.

2) Contact your boat insurance company and notify them of the potential claim. Ask them to advise further.

3) Contact your homeowners insurance company and notify them of the event and also a possible claim on the house.

4) Consider getting the boat surveyed.

 

[Scott Danforth]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

gaskets and o-rings are good for at least 250 degrees F (121C) (or higher with some of the fluoroelastomers)

the wiring is GXL insulation which is 125 degree C (258F)

the PVC / Vinyl / resin starts to melt at 70C (158F)

from that, your wiring and driveline will be fine. the hull on the other hand may not.

 

[Dekkerd]

Re: Neighbours house set on fire, hot enough to melt my boat. Hidden damages?

Thanks for all the info guys, gave me some knowledge while approaching the situation to make shur things are getting done correctly. Now for an update.

Insurance is all on mine, its common for one insurance company to go after another but for me I just deal with my boat insurance. The insurance company sent a marine surveyor to do go over the boat top to bottom. He was actually a trainee of the well known local surveyor, and the expert was to go over everything he documented. He didnt know to much about fiberglass. Everything I repeated from you guys on here he didnt agree with. But regardless he was very thorough in his inspection. Recorded everything. Today I brought it to a repair guy that not only did the surveyor suggest, one of my friends in the boat industry also suggested. They all seem to be connected and know eachother.

Its up to my repair guy to make an estimate, that gets compared with the surveyors estimate and the insurance company makes a decision on what to do after that. The repair guy said first thing he's goona do is start some exploratory grinding into the hull. Everywhere theres a gelcoat "blister" or bubble he'll grind untill he reaches good material. He's seen it before, heat damage from a car burning next to a boat. And he ses its clear as day where the resin and matting of the fiberglass is coming apart.

Regarding a total loss it will depend on what he finds and how the costs add up. Completely new interior is a guarantee. All the little melted things. But its all up to the starboard side. If 2/3 of the gelcoat needs to be grinded down to fiberglass and resprayed. With fiberglass repairs to 4 feet of that. Good chance insurance will say dont bother. Boats insured for $25,000. The policy states need to reach 80% of that but by the sounds of it these boat insurance companies deal with it case by case.