My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

scipper77

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Got home yesterday and heard a hissing sound around the side of the house at the gas meter. I wasn't sure if it was a leak or just the normal sound of gas rushing through it (furnace was on). So like the smart guy I am I stuck my face up to the meter and took a whiff.

There was a faint smell of gas. It was faint but was definitely gas. I told the wife about it and then called 911. Didn't take long for the police to show up. The cop smelled the same thing I did but at this point the furnace was off so the hissing stopped. We stood there with our hands in our pockets for a few and the fire dept showed up.

So here I am Me, 1 cop w/ car, 2 large fire trucks with 6-8 guys total, and one fire chief in his fancy Chevy Tahoe with the lights. The 6-8 firemen had on full gear, Hats jackets, pants boots, and even oxygen packs.

They (the FD)got out there gas sniffing device and waved it around the meter declaring it leak free. They told me that the regulators by design "burp" from time to time and that is what I smelled. The FD then went in my house and checked my furnace, hot water tank, gas fireplace and stove.

After declaring that there was no leak the boss man (I doubt he was the actual chief) suggested that they call of the local utility guy, no need for him to come since there is no leak and he uses the same leak detector that they use. I was just about ready to tell them to cancel the call to the local utility when his truck pulled up.

After a brief chat between the FD and the utility tech all of the fire trucks and PD left. The Tech looks at me and says "fire men are good at fighting fired, I am good at finding leaks." Within 30 seconds he had that gas detector lit up like a x-mas tree. Where the FD waved there wand around like freakin' Harry Potter, the tech traced the tip around every pipe nipple and coupling with precision.

I'll spare you the details on the rest of the repair (remove, replace, test) but the tech told me a good story.

A week earlier he went out to a job where a family thought they smelled gas in there enclosed porch. Harry Potter showed up and waved his wand and when they found nothing they told the homeowner that there was no gas and it was just a musty smell, not gas. They tried to call off the utility company here too. When the tech showed up he smelled the gas right away. It turns out that the service was run when the house was built around 1930. The underground pipe had cracked or rusted or something of that nature and there was gas coming up from the ground into there porch. Natural gas rises so that porch was like an upside down bilge.

By the way the utility tech told me that under no circumstance do those regulators ever burp. You should never smell gas at the meter or anywhere else for that matter.
 

dockwrecker

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Wow. I can't believe the fire dept would even suggest waiving off the utility guys. It's their gear, they should be the ones saying it's ok or not. Never heard of that before, and in my business, we break a pipe every now and then. It should always be the utility's call on repairs or safety.
 

Bob_VT

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Now is the time to write a nice Thank You note to the utility guy's boss. Too often the efforts of the worker go un-noticed and a nice leeter would be good karma.
 

scipper77

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Now is the time to write a nice Thank You note to the utility guy's boss. Too often the efforts of the worker go un-noticed and a nice leeter would be good karma.

You are so right. Let me tell you this tech and I got along so well. It turns out he worked with the guy who built my house. He says to me "I remember when Joe built that house." I do similar work to what he does as a part of my job so we had a great time "talking shop" and swapping stories. By the end it was dark out so I got him my inspection light (3W led) and he was teaching me about things like those grease packed fittings they use while I was holding the light and helping him get his job done (this was after hours work for him, he actually missed a class).
 

Cofe

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Glad to hear that you found the problem scipper77. Sounds pretty serious.
Here is a "gas" experience I had awhile back.

A few years ago my daughter came running up stairs yelling?I smell gas? I went down stairs and sure enough, it was hard to breathe, my eyes were watering, and it smelled like gas. I sent everyone outside and shut off the pilot lights on the water heater and furnace. On the way outside, I tripped the main breaker off.

Called the gas company by cell phone and they arrived quickly.
The gas inspector quickly put on a fire suit, and breathing apparatus. He grabbed his gas sniffer and headed into the house. He was in the house about 15 minutes and came out of the house holding a rolled up bath towel. He motioned us over and unrolled the towel. My two boys were standing behind us with their heads down. He then asked, "who was the one playing around with the pepper spray"?????? Needless to say, the boys were grounded for awhile.
 

DaNinja

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Glad to hear that you found the problem scipper77. Sounds pretty serious.
Here is a "gas" experience I had awhile back.

A few years ago my daughter came running up stairs yelling?I smell gas? I went down stairs and sure enough, it was hard to breathe, my eyes were watering, and it smelled like gas. I sent everyone outside and shut off the pilot lights on the water heater and furnace. On the way outside, I tripped the main breaker off.

Called the gas company by cell phone and they arrived quickly.
The gas inspector quickly put on a fire suit, and breathing apparatus. He grabbed his gas sniffer and headed into the house. He was in the house about 15 minutes and came out of the house holding a rolled up bath towel. He motioned us over and unrolled the towel. My two boys were standing behind us with their heads down. He then asked, "who was the one playing around with the pepper spray"?????? Needless to say, the boys were grounded for awhile.

That's the kind of mischief that haunts you for decades. I know..
 

Fly Rod

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

I agree with the tech
 

bassman284

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Well, as long as we're going wth side stories of gas smells, I'll tell mine.

Back in 1968, I was in the Air Force stationed at Offutt AFB in Nebraska. In my search for side income, I got a real estate license and went to work for a broker who was involved with a builder doing FHA 235 houses. I went out one day to look at a couple of houses that were ready for sale.

At this time (older members will remember this) the hot setup was fireplaces with gas starters. The other hot setup was fake wood paneling (remember?). I walk into the family room of this house and get a strong smell of natural gas. I check the valve on the gas starter and it is definitely off. I run. No cell phones back then so I have to drive about 5 miles to find a pay phone. I call back to the office and have them call the utility co. to come shut off the gas. (I knew how but didn't have a wrench with me)

Turns out, the gas line to the fireplace was copper tubing. Because the familly room was on a slab, the gas line was run through the attic and down the wall. When the guys put up the paneling they used staple guns which were kind of new back then. Problem was, they were missing the studs a good part of the time and driving the staples into the copper tubing. Obviously the gas was still off when they put up the paneling. Once the gas was turned on...

Five houses had to be redone and the guy who did the redo told me one of the houses had 9 staples in the tubing. The one I smelled only had 2.
 

tswiczko

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

I agree with Bob, send a nice letter to his boss.

A good tech. gets a lot of practice at using their equipment. Firemen get to read a manual and maybe an hour long training inservice if they are lucky. By the same token I would much rather have a trained fire fighter putting my house out if it were on fire than a gas company service tech.
 

Fireman431

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Sorry to hear about your issue with the FD. Being a 23+ year career firefighter in Florida, I can attest that it is not supposed to be done that way. Unfortunately, it sounds like the officer of the engine (not the Battalion Chief who was in the Tahoe), was unprepared and untrained on how a gas detector operates. Where I worked, we took great pains and great pride in our responsibility to the public. Extensive training on every facet of the job is a must. Occasionally, it is understandable that people fall deficient in a seldom run event, but that leads to identifying a problem and correcting it. Remember, the FD is supposed to be able to, at a moments notice, deal with house fires, car fires, hi-rise events, emergency medical calls, gun shot wounds, drownings, stabbings, animal attacks, car accidents, water flow (hydraulics), high angle/rope rescue, confined space rescue, sick/injured children, hazardous materials events, Paramedic issues (Advanced Cardiac Life Support, medications, defibrillators, IV's, etc), and whatever else comes along in the next 5 minutes.

I don't know what your city's FD Standard Operating Procedure is for gas leaks, but this were to happen in my city, I would want the owner making an appointment with the Fire Chief (or at a minimum, the training department) to bring this issue to light. If they can identify a shortcoming in emergency response such as this, I can bet they would like the opportunity to take corrective action.

Thanks for taking the time to read this.
 

scipper77

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Well the tech himself said that if there was even close to an unsafe amount of gas the firemen would have found it. More specifically he thinks they should just walk in to the residence and if the gas detector doesn't alarm (no immediate danger) let the utility guy worry about finding the leak. Basically the firemen did there job in making sure everything was safe for entry. The mistake was in trying to call off the utility company. My leak was small and was probably there for a while. I just happened to find it because I was investigating the hissing.

My point is that the fire men did there job well. Where they failed was when they gave me bad advice. If the leak was significant I know they would have found it.
 

veritas honus

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Natural gas and propane gas are oderless. This is extremely dangerous (for obvious reasons). There is a gas added to it called methanethiol, also called Mercaptan, or ethylmercaptan. This is the "gas odor" we're all familiar with. When I was still a career firefighter, in the territory of one of the stations I worked, is a Mercaptan depot. Trucks come and go, day and night to fill up and transport this necessarry nasty gas. This depot is on a major bypass/highway in the area I live. Quite often, especially at night when there is less wind, you can smell it in your vehicle as you approach the vicinity and pass through. People from the area are familiar with it. People who are not familiar, very frequently call 911 to report a gas odor. We would generally make 2-3 trips per shift to the depot, usually at 0dark30:facepalm:. We had a gate key and would go in, circle around, get out, shine our lights around, and lock the gate before heading back to the station. There is no natural gas, no propane... Nothing but Mercaptan... Harmless, smelly, and lifesaving. Reading this thread made me think of this, and just thought I'd share it with all of you.

Scipper77, I'm glad everything worked out so well for you.
 

ezmobee

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

We had a similar situation at my old house. I lived in town in a row house. Outside, half the block smelled like gas. So we called the gas company. They came out and tested all over for a leak and couldn't find one. It continued stinking for days. We called again. Apparently so did others. The entertaining thing is that if someone calls, they HAVE to come out. So they were there quite a bit. Well finally the leak got worse or otherwise somehow became more obvious and it was found to be under one of the homes porch where the line entered the house. Major excavation project later, and it was fixed.
 

scipper77

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

At one point the tech jammed a long screwdriver into the ground next to the supply line and pulled the driver back a little creating a pocket in the ground. That's how he used the sniffer to test for an underground leak. Like I said this guy knew what he was doing, the fire dept. did there job but the tech really showed why he is a gas professional.
 

LippCJ7

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

I think the only thing I would add is that I would feel obligated to inform the Fire Department of the flaw in their training. I wouldn't be mad or anything but they need to know that they have a problem and to make sure they don't make another mistake they should be informed. I don't say this to inflame anyone or to make it sound like the fire department is a bunch of hacks because we all know this to be untrue but we all don't have others lives in our hands either. I would make a simple visit to the chief or lead training officer and inform him of the issue, I bet he will take care of it very quickly.

My cousin was a firefighter and was killed in the line of duty, I have huge respect for those that run in while others are running out.

scipper77 I very happy things worked out for you, could have been very bad
 

SS MAYFLOAT

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Glad you got the problem taken care of. Years ago at my old house, the water department put in a new line. Of course these water lines criss crossed the gas lines as well. One morning the air was real still and I could smell gas in the air. I went back inside and called my neighbor and asked if he smelled gas inside his house as there wasn't any in mine. He said no. We both went outside and could smell it. I called the gas company and they were out there in a few minuets. Sure enough when the water company was backfilling their line, an area had the imprint of the front tire of the backhoe they were using. Just so happens it was right over the curb box for the shut off to my neighbors house. The line was broken on the house side of the valve. Gas company shut the gas off and told him that since it was on that side of the valve, it was his responsibility. He in turn called the water company and told them that it was their fault that his gas is now off. The water company paid for the repair without any questions or problems. They also paid for the estimated amount of gas lost as that was going to be billed to my neighbor as well.
 

SS MAYFLOAT

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

In some places, natural gas has leached into the water wells. Not a good thing at all...:mad:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6G6Ap-mF0k

I know that is very true. I stayed with a friend that had that kind of water. Filled a gallon jug right out of the tap and you could light it with a match. It would burn for about 2 minuets. I did like washing my hair in it :D
 

rbh

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

I know that is very true. I stayed with a friend that had that kind of water. Filled a gallon jug right out of the tap and you could light it with a match. It would burn for about 2 minuets. I did like washing my hair in it :D

There are many places around the world were people have sunk wells into/through a seam of coal or shale and the methane just leaches into the water.

You really should have them tested for H2S, that stuff kills at a low PPM.
Our well guy a myself sat down and discussed how to remove the majority of it, his idea and he has put it to practice is to pump the water from the well into a cistern and have a high preasure pump pick it up shoot it through "atomizing nozzles????" into a second cistern that has a high CFM fan in it to draw out the gas, but let the water collect on the bottom to be picked up and pumped to the house.
 

Fireman431

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Re: My run in with the police... and fire dept... and utility company.

Our well guy a myself sat down and discussed how to remove the majority of it, his idea and he has put it to practice is to pump the water from the well into a cistern and have a high preasure pump pick it up shoot it through "atomizing nozzles????" into a second cistern that has a high CFM fan in it to draw out the gas, but let the water collect on the bottom to be picked up and pumped to the house.

I would just move...:facepalm:
 
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