Mercruiser 3.0 diagnosis / serial number decode

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Seaman
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Jun 26, 2022
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Does anything look out of place on my choke plate? Is there supposed to be a spring or something? It just freely flops around right now. I can get the engine to sputter and run pouring gas down the carb and it even runs on its own for a few seconds but quickly does.
 

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Seaman
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Jun 26, 2022
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Also… should I see a visible amount of fuel spraying through into the carb from the accelerator pump while cranking? I don’t really see any.
 

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Seaman
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I’m doing some reading and realizing something may definitely be wrong with my choke plate. It doesn’t automatically return closed as my video from a few posts ago shows. It’s just flopping around, and fully open when the engine is trying to cold start. From my understanding this thing should be fully closed on a cold start.
 

Scott06

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I’m doing some reading and realizing something may definitely be wrong with my choke plate. It doesn’t automatically return closed as my video from a few posts ago shows. It’s just flopping around, and fully open when the engine is trying to cold start. From my understanding this thing should be fully closed on a cold start.
You have to set it by pumping the throttle otherwise it stay in the open position Also no fuel comes out the accelerator pump nozzles unless you pump the throttle. This just over comes the momentary loss of vacuum across boosters when throttle is opening by squirting gas in.
if you can get it to run by dumping some gas down the carb but it doesnt stay running you have a carb issue. Have u tried adjusting the idle mixture screw? If backing it out doesnt keep it running you arent getting any gas and likely carb rebuild and set up is required
 

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Seaman
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You have to set it by pumping the throttle otherwise it stay in the open position Also no fuel comes out the accelerator pump nozzles unless you pump the throttle. This just over comes the momentary loss of vacuum across boosters when throttle is opening by squirting gas in.
if you can get it to run by dumping some gas down the carb but it doesnt stay running you have a carb issue. Have u tried adjusting the idle mixture screw? If backing it out doesnt keep it running you arent getting any gas and likely carb rebuild and set up is required
Ok, thanks. Learned something new again. Didn’t realize the throttle needed pumped.

So just to clear things up: I should pump the throttle several times before attempting to crank the engine. While pumping I should see gas squirt in the carb. However, gas does not squirt while the engine is cranking over.

Does that sound correct?
 

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Seaman
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Jun 26, 2022
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Also, what’s a quick way to tell if I have a Rochester carb or Mercarb?
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
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27,468
disconnect it and test 5 ohms is a lot of resistance but could ground out the ignition
Should be open circuit. If you have 5 ohms, disconnect it and see if the engine starts. 5 ohms is faulty, replace it.
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
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Also, what’s a quick way to tell if I have a Rochester carb or Mercarb?
1 idle mixture screw - Mercarb.
2 idle mixture screws (one for each barrel) - Rochester.

Chris...
 

Scott06

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Ok, thanks. Learned something new again. Didn’t realize the throttle needed pumped.

So just to clear things up: I should pump the throttle several times before attempting to crank the engine. While pumping I should see gas squirt in the carb. However, gas does not squirt while the engine is cranking over.

Does that sound correct?

Yes pumping throttle sets the choke and should spit some gas in thru accelerator pump to richen mixture
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
Joined
May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
I should pump the throttle several times before attempting to crank the engine. While pumping I should see gas squirt in the carb. However, gas does not squirt while the engine is cranking over.

Does that sound correct?
Fuel systems 101...

For younger people who have never driven a carbureted car, boat engines with carbs can be a bit baffling. Here's some basics.

Injected engines. While cranking, the ECU can see the revs and the engine temp and actively squirts (through the injectors) the right amount of fuel into the intake to be drawn into the cylinders. The fuel pump is electric and it's producing flow as soon as the power is applied. The injectors are also fired electrically. If the engine is cold the ECU programming will enrichen the mixture, regardless of throttle setting. Nothing is relying on airflow or mechanical actuation.

Carbureted engines. These engines rely on airflow through the carb to draw fuel through the passages inside the carb and then out through the venturi in the throttle barrel. The slower the airflow (cranking speed) the harder it is to get the fuel to the intake. For the most part these engines also have a mechanical fuel pump, which needs the engine turning before they can get fuel up to the carb. If the throttle is fully closed (idle position) when the engine was last shutdown (how it usually is) then the choke plate and linkages are 'locked' in the open position, so the mixture won't be enriched unless the throttle is moved and that 'lock' is released. And as there is no airflow initially, there's no fuel in the intake, and without a couple of 'pumps' of the throttle, there won't be for a while, so the engine won't fire. Each engine is different and so it'll take a bit of experimenting to find out if your engine wants 1 pump or 3 (or 7!).

So, what are these 'throttle pumps' all about? Within a carb is a circuit called the 'accelerator pump'. As air is less dense than petrol, when the throttle is opened quickly it takes longer for the flow of fuel to increase than the air, resulting in a very lean mixture for a short time (until the flow of petrol can 'catch up' with the air), that will cause the engine to 'stumble' or bog on acceleration. To alleviate this lag in petrol flow there is a (usually) diaphragm operated pump on/in the carb. As the throttle is opened this pump squirts raw fuel through a discharge nozzle in the throttle barrel air stream (one discharge nozzle in each primary throttle barrel). This is how a couple or 3 pumps on the throttle handle squirts fuel into the intake, and why they don't squirt fuel while cranking (no throttle lever movement, no pumpy pumpy).

Hope this helps.

Chris..........
 
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Seaman
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Thanks Chris, excellent explanation and cleared everything up for me.

With that said, I’ve confirmed that there is not a drop of gas being squirted into either of my two barrels by the accelerator pump. I had a helper pump the throttle forward dozens of times. Nothing.

So… looks like I’m looking at a carb rebuild. Does anyone have recommendations on where to order an OEM kit? I see several different model kits, and it’s a bit baffling on which one I need. I’m assuming I need to find a part number on the carb to get an exact match rebuild kit?
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
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If you can give us some identification we can point you in the right direction...
1. Need to know the numbers on the side of the carb (or on the red tag that may be under one of the cover screws)..
1656473372523.png
2. Mercarb or Rochester? (book says it should be a Mercarb, but parts catalog also calls out parts for the Rochester, so need to know which.
1656473396772.png
1656473470493.png

Chris.....
 
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Mar 27, 2010
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Just to confirm the issue is at the carb, you could remove the gas line from the carb inlet again, and stick it into a 5 gal pail, have someone crank the engine over for about 15 or 20 seconds or so and confirm fuel squirts out of the line into the bucket. It won't be steady flow, it will pulse fuel in squirts, due to the diaphragm in the fuel pump moving back and forth. It very well could be a stuck needle valve in the carb not letting fuel into the bowl or could be a clogged pick up tube in the gas tank.

In post #4 you mentioned not getting gas to the carb. In post #37, you mentioned you replaced the fuel pump and pretty sure your getting gas now, but didn't sound really positive you are.

Before you tear into the carb, I personally, would confirm there is gas getting to the carb inlet before you get deeper in.
 

Scott06

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Thanks Chris, excellent explanation and cleared everything up for me.

With that said, I’ve confirmed that there is not a drop of gas being squirted into either of my two barrels by the accelerator pump. I had a helper pump the throttle forward dozens of times. Nothing.

So… looks like I’m looking at a carb rebuild. Does anyone have recommendations on where to order an OEM kit? I see several different model kits, and it’s a bit baffling on which one I need. I’m assuming I need to find a part number on the carb to get an exact match rebuild kit?
I get my carb kits here-

 

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Seaman
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Jun 26, 2022
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60
I owe all of you a beer if I ever meet you, you guys are so helpful.

So here's where I'm at now. I clarified things this morning.

1. Removed fuel line at carb and put in plastic bottle. Fuel squirts in bottle in pulses while engine cranks. Hose is currently attached to boat gas tank, so at this point I can rule out the fuel pump, gas hoses, anti siphon valve, and fuel tank pickup.

2. Here's the red tag on my carb. Reads 1389-9562. I'll look around to see if I can find the correct carb rebuild kit, since that's most likely what the issue is now.

IMG_4633.jpg
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
Joined
May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
What's the best rebuild guide for these carbs available online?
The Merc genuine workshop manuals are about the best you can get. But since 'flash player' got killed off they are no longer available online.
 

Scott06

Admiral
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Agree on merc manuals Also check out tech documents and videos at mikes carbs he has rebuild videos of Rochester 2 jets and mercarbs
 
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