Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

[cherokee-rick]

I bought a 1976 Oiachita Spirit with a 1976 Johnson Javelin 85. The boat had not been started for about four years. I drained out all of the old fuel and blew compressed air in the fuel line going to the carbs. I put fresh fuel in and after a while I got it running. It was running just a bit rough so I called a home mechanic in Greenfield, Indiana and told him it was running rough and that I wanted him to look it over and find out why.
He called me and said "bad news-you have no spark-nothing-just dead". He said it needs all new coils, powerpack, stator ect. and that it would cost $1200 for parts and five hours to install bringing the total to $1700!!
I said "I'm coming to get my boat".
Once I had it at home I pulled the plugs out one at a time, grounded them to the motor and turned it over and guess what- I have spark!!! I actually got it running!!!
This guy did not expect me to come and get it. I knew better-after all I had it running!
These mechanics think people don't know any better and that we will just say "well, I need my boat and you know what your doing so go ahead and fix it" but not me. I am very mechanically inclined and I plan to work on the motor myself. I ordered a manual for it and I have been reading this forum for about 3 weeks and learned a lot.
I'm thinking that the carbs need rebuilt. I am looking into replacing the powerpack and ccoils just to be safe.
Can anyone give me advice ? I'd be glad to hear it.
Thanks in advance and I'm very happy to be a new member here at iboats!

 

[cdn-pk]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

welcome, yup i'd learn everything i could too. theres a top secret section at the top of the page with tons of good stuff. plus heres the link to some good info on bringing back motors that have been sitting for a while

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=158086

 

[AlTn]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

you've no doubt read about checking the spark with an air gap spark checker...as long as each plug will jump a gap of 7/16" they are good to go and you can focus on compression and fuel delivery..a new to you motor should also have the waterpump or at least the impeller replaced as well as the l/u lube

 

[instantheet]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

good for you Rick.......i would of called Bill back after i got it running just to hear what he had to say........im new to iboats to the best site for boaters i've been on.....take care an get that motor running smooth.......

 

[watergecko]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

ugh, no names! im not a lawyer, and i didnt stay in a h.i. express last night but...mentioning names is a good way to get sued for libel and or slander. locations are fine and you can pm ur personal experiences to others but to post on a public website an "alleged" concern....is dangerous. i dont kno you or the guy ur talking about, just some friendly advice from a fellow boat owner.

 

[mancho]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

Good luck getting sued for slander of libel. There was nothing negative he said about the guy that quoted him... I don't think he called him a "dirty rotten scoundrel" or anything as such.

He just stated the experience. However, lawsuits have been filed over less!

 

[cherokee-rick]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

I fixed it!!! I put a new power pack on and now it starts at just the touch of the key and runs pretty smooth! I will take it out for the first time tomorrow.

 

[boobie]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

This is a good example of knowing who you are dealing with. Remember the old saying of "word of mouth advertising".

 

[jbjennings]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

I fixed it!!! I put a new power pack on and now it starts at just the touch of the key and runs pretty smooth! I will take it out for the first time tomorrow.

A bad powerpack could very easily result in NO SPARK whatsoever when he tested it, then "worked" when you tried it.
If all those parts were original replacing everything the mechanic mentioned in your first post may not have been a horrible thing to do. Otherwise, some borderline part, or part that 30 years of changing temps had near failure might have damaged the new powerpack or some other 40 year old electrical part might go out soon leaving you stranded and you'd think he did a lousy job. I can't imagine having to make a living as a mechanic after all the bizarre stuff I run into fixing neighbor's and relative's motors that are about the same age as the motor you have. When you have an ignition system with 40 year old parts on it, a mechanic doesn't want to just replace the one bad part, just to have another old part that he didn't change go out and cause the motor to break down and make him look like he didn't do his job.
Just sayin' it's not easy to make money repairing old motors; the main reason that lots of dealers won't even work on 'em.

timer base 340.00
4 new coils 185.00
power pack 150.00
rectifier 50.00
stator 404.00
total = 1129.00 not counting shipping or taxes

+500 labor......... not totally unreasonable.

Was the guy trying to put it to you, or just going overboard on parts? Fact is, you may have fixed it and it may last a long time for cheap by doing it yourself. No doubt you probably saved yourself a lot of money. I'm just not totally certain the mechanic was trying to do you wrong. Like you, however, I wouldn't have paid 1700 to have it fixed.......
JMO,
JBJ

 

[Tig]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

I fixed it!!! I put a new power pack on and now it starts at just the touch of the key and runs pretty smooth! ....

So he wasn't wrong after all. He was just expensive. +1 on what JBJ said.
I'm curious, why did you change the power pack after you found spark?
I wouldn't have liked the price either, but I don't begrudge a man from making a living.

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

i agree with the last 2 post, If I was a professional mechanic with a shop, I would have told you the same thing when you brought me a junky old motor that obviously did have some spark issues. Very possible it did not spark for him when he tested it. Since it is such a old motor with old parts he did not want to fix one thing then have you get stranded out on the water because an old worn out stator or coil goes out. Sounds like he was actually doing his job. If you are so mechanically inclined then why take it to him to begin with?? If you are going to DIY then you can test and replace only needed parts, but I would probably replace all the coils and plug wires, wow that stator is pricey, I never price javelin parts before, but I would think you could get one for less than that. The timer base is not as prone to wear as other parts, at least in my experience, I think I have only ever replaced 1. It was on a 89 200HP Johnson. You should test that regulator, it can run with a bad one and burn up your stator and/or power pack.

 

[fmalott]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

i agree with sparkieboat it's just like a car to do the front brake yourself $100 get a shop to do it your paying $500 that what shops are for to do the work you don't want to. i own a shop and do you think i'm going to do it for a $100 yea right

 

[cfauvel]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

i agree with sparkieboat it's just like a car to do the front brake yourself $100 get a shop to do it your paying $500 that what shops are for to do the work you don't want to. i own a shop and do you think i'm going to do it for a $100 yea right

$100 for DIY front brake is steep.

$20 for turning the rotors
$40 for the pads

$500 for professionally done front brakes...is basically robbery.

$60 for parts, *10% markup = 66.00
1 hour labor @60 per = 60

so a pro should charge 126.00 in my view.

 

[cherokee-rick]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

The reason I took it to the mechanic is that I had just bought this boat and knew nothing about outboard motors. It ran but was not running smooth and I wanted it running smooth before I took it out. While he had the boat I had been reading this forum and learning alot about them. I am also very mechanically inclined and when he said it had NO spark quoted the price I said "I'm coming to get my boat". I bought a manual and began reading and learning. The first thing I replaced was the water pump (with the new improved design that comes with the housing)-SEE, I learn all I can when I'm forced with a repair bill that I can not afford and I do it myself and the secret file here suggested replacing that.
The reason I replaced the power pack was just a lucky guess. I found a new one on the internet and just thought i'd go ahead and order one. I will be replacing the coils next and other things as I can afford them.
Here is the thing with the mechanic; He has his own shop, he seems to know his stuff. So why didn't he test the parts and find out what was bad and call me and say that part x is bad? I had told him that it ran but was not running smooth so he should have started it to see how it ran and get an idea of what may be causing it to run rough. It just didn't add up to me.
I ordered a carb rebuild kit-the COMPLETE kit- I'll do that next.

 

[cherokee-rick]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

By the way-
I took the boat out to the lake on friday and it ran like a charm! It gets up on plane quickly and just skims accross the water! IT ALWAYS STARTED EASILY and idles very smooth. I had a blast!

 

[jbjennings]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

Nothing like a smooth running motor that you fixed yourself and saved a bunch of dough in the process!!!!
Congrats! I hate fixing electrical problems!!!
JBJ

 

[cherokee-rick]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

This same mechanic told me I need to have him do the work on this motor because in two years you won't be able to get parts for 2-stroke motors or even buy 2-stroke motors due to a ban on them by the government because of polution.

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

you will be able to get parts as far as I know, but they are phasing out 2-stroke carbbed motors.

 

[milliesdad]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

A bad powerpack could very easily result in NO SPARK whatsoever when he tested it, then "worked" when you tried it.
If all those parts were original replacing everything the mechanic mentioned in your first post may not have been a horrible thing to do. Otherwise, some borderline part, or part that 30 years of changing temps had near failure might have damaged the new powerpack or some other 40 year old electrical part might go out soon leaving you stranded and you'd think he did a lousy job. I can't imagine having to make a living as a mechanic after all the bizarre stuff I run into fixing neighbor's and relative's motors that are about the same age as the motor you have. When you have an ignition system with 40 year old parts on it, a mechanic doesn't want to just replace the one bad part, just to have another old part that he didn't change go out and cause the motor to break down and make him look like he didn't do his job.
Just sayin' it's not easy to make money repairing old motors; the main reason that lots of dealers won't even work on 'em.

timer base 340.00
4 new coils 185.00
power pack 150.00
rectifier 50.00
stator 404.00
total = 1129.00 not counting shipping or taxes

+500 labor......... not totally unreasonable.

Was the guy trying to put it to you, or just going overboard on parts? Fact is, you may have fixed it and it may last a long time for cheap by doing it yourself. No doubt you probably saved yourself a lot of money. I'm just not totally certain the mechanic was trying to do you wrong. Like you, however, I wouldn't have paid 1700 to have it fixed.......
JMO,
JBJ

I'm with you JBJ.

Just because he estimated a lot of money, doesn't mean he was taking you for a ride.

When you take something (car-boat ect.) for repair, don't go to the bottom line and start screaming thief. Look at everything that has been done. That is what itimized work orders are for- list everything that was done on the job and it's cost.

 

[milliesdad]

Re: Mechanic tried to take me for a ride!

$100 for DIY front brake is steep.

$20 for turning the rotors
$40 for the pads

$500 for professionally done front brakes...is basically robbery.

$60 for parts, *10% markup = 66.00
1 hour labor @60 per = 60

so a pro should charge 126.00 in my view.

19 markup and 60.00/hr labor?

What rock have you been hiding under?

A shop cannot keep the doors open with a 10% profit on parts and $60.00 labor. There's employees, equipment, rent/mortgage,insurance,taxes and on and on and on to pay. (I know, I USED to make a living wrenching, sold car parts and owned part of 2 auto parts stores. ) Owning a parts store and a boat are about the same- The 2 happiest days of your life are the day you buy one and the day you sell it.