Leak into bilge, bellows?

[gsbarry]

Thanks y'all. I have 2 batteries installed with an on-board charger and plan to wire one bilge pump each to each battery directly. I got around to tearing the bellows/hoses all apart and cleaned up today, and it went smoothly. Before i got into it I figured out that it really isn't that hard to reach the shift cable pull through on the transom, although it is blind. I also watched a bunch of different videos on the process so I have a pretty good idea of the process before hand (I have the manual too, but I find that it sort of jumps around to various components without a super clear order of removal and install). The biggest thing I learned, which came in clutch was to break loose the hinge pins before removing the outdrive (to keep the bell housing locked in place). This unit has never been serviced so it still had the red loctite, which meant propane torch, breaker bar + cheater bar.

What is the common practice on the aft side of the shift cable bellows, do you use the supplied metal clamp? Or go with a strong zip tie? I've seen both methods, curious which one seals better.

 

[Jmunk]

Here is a thread from when I did my bellows in the fall and an order I used for assembly.

Post in thread 'Bellows Installation'
https://forums.iboats.com/threads/bellows-installation.775185/post-5949853

I used a zip tie on the gear lube hose.

 

[gsbarry]

Thanks, your order makes sense to me. What did you use on the aft side of the shift cable bellows? The supplied metal crimp clamp?

 

[Jmunk]

I used zip ties.

 

[gsbarry]

I used zip ties.

Thanks, I was just checking because you mentioned the gear oil hose first, but I was referring to the shift cable bellows. I noticed on your other thread that you put the driveshaft bellows on the transom first, then on the bell housing. Did this order give you trouble putting bellows adhesive on the bell housing side before installing the retainer ring? I’m guessing you can still apply some on there with your finger from the inside using this order.

 

[Scott06]

Thanks, I was just checking because you mentioned the gear oil hose first, but I was referring to the shift cable bellows. I noticed on your other thread that you put the driveshaft bellows on the transom first, then on the bell housing. Did this order give you trouble putting bellows adhesive on the bell housing side before installing the retainer ring? I’m guessing you can still apply some on there with your finger from the inside using this order.

I did not use bellow adhesive on bellhousing side. Get a factory shop manual it lays out in detail the order where to use adhesive etc

 

[gsbarry]

I did not use bellow adhesive on bellhousing side. Get a factory shop manual it lays out in detail the order where to use adhesive etc

Thanks, I took another look at my manual and indeed the aft side of the driveshaft bellows does not call for adhesive (“A” on the diagram). I guess the change to the sleeve in the gen 2 vs the clamp in gen 1 makes the difference in not needing adhesive. Based on what I’ve read on this site and elsewhere adhesive is not really needed on the exhaust bellows, despite what the manual says, so I’m not planning to do that.

 

[Bt Doctur]

an old control cable will work too ,its solid SS

 

[gsbarry]

I’ve got most of the reassembly done, it all went pretty smoothly. The new shift cable was easy to grab and route. Is it pretty common to have to realign the engine after replacing the gimbal bearing? I’m confident the new bearing is fully seated. It just seems a bit odd to me, the alignment was perfect with old bearing prior to replacement, but with new bearing the alignment rod is binding (not fully inserting by hand). The only thing I can think of is perhaps the old bearing either had a bit of slop in it or it was not perfectly seated before allowing the bearing to align with the engine output splines. I test fitted the driveshaft on the outdrive and it goes in easy.

 

[Scott06]

I’ve got most of the reassembly done, it all went pretty smoothly. The new shift cable was easy to grab and route. Is it pretty common to have to realign the engine after replacing the gimbal bearing? I’m confident the new bearing is fully seated. It just seems a bit odd to me, the alignment was perfect with old bearing prior to replacement, but with new bearing the alignment rod is binding (not fully inserting by hand). The only thing I can think of is perhaps the old bearing either had a bit of slop in it or it was not perfectly seated before allowing the bearing to align with the engine output splines. I test fitted the driveshaft on the outdrive and it goes in easy.

yes normal to have to center the bearing by whacking the adjustment tool in 4 directions (i think this is in the manual), and adjust the alignment after doing a gimbal bearing.

 

[gsbarry]

any ideas how I can get a wrench on the lower nuts on the motor mount in the pics below? The engine bay is obstructing the front access and the back is obstructed by oil pan. Trying to raise the bow side of the motor for alignment. I can get a wrench on the top nut, but it looks like I need to loosen the lower nuts first to create room for adjustment. It’s almost like I need a wrench with 2 90 degree bends in it.View attachment IMG_7991.jpegView attachment IMG_7992.jpegView attachment IMG_7990.jpeg

 

[cyclops222]

Same problem with 1950s Oldsmobile V 8 with distributor at very rear of engine next to firewall. Box wrench curved into a C was required shape.

 

[nola mike]

yes normal to have to center the bearing by whacking the adjustment tool in 4 directions (i think this is in the manual), and adjust the alignment after doing a gimbal bearing.

Centering the bearing itself should cure the alignment tool problem... Engine alignment itself *shouldn't* be affected by gb replacement, though who knows. OP, 2 different things we're talking about here

 

[Lou C]

any ideas how I can get a wrench on the lower nuts on the motor mount in the pics below? The engine bay is obstructing the front access and the back is obstructed by oil pan. Trying to raise the bow side of the motor for alignment. I can get a wrench on the top nut, but it looks like I need to loosen the lower nuts first to create room for adjustment. It’s almost like I need a wrench with 2 90 degree bends in it.View attachment 405823View attachment 405824View attachment 405825

crowfoot wrench will work there, some are made to be used with a socket/extension, some have a flex head, all different combinations so you can get to things. I had to be creative to get the lower retaining bolt out on my Cobra's steering actuator, similar problem, the top of the Y pipe was in the way, same on many Volvos.

 

[gsbarry]

I think I was able to get the bearing aligned by hitting the alignment tool up/down with the hammer, went all the way in and spun with 2 fingers. So I’ll leave the engine mount alone for now.

Different problem, I didn’t run into this last time I installed the outdrive. For some reason I can’t get the outdrive to go the last 3/4” after all manner of jiggling around. I ended up tearing the gasket trying to get it back out, so waiting for a new one. So I tried test fitting again without the large rubber driveshaft/u-joint o-ring seal, without the gasket or water pipe o-ring (again just test fitting). Same problem, won’t go the last 3/4”. I double checked the shift shaft is aligned, looks good. Can’t figure out why it’s hanging up. To get that far in the splines have to be aligned. Only thing I can guess is perhaps the bellows retaining ring is hanging up somehow, but don’t see why.
View attachment IMG_7993.jpegView attachment IMG_7997.jpeg

 

[gsbarry]

crowfoot wrench will work there, some are made to be used with a socket/extension, some have a flex head, all different combinations so you can get to things. I had to be creative to get the lower retaining bolt out on my Cobra's steering actuator, similar problem, the top of the Y pipe was in the way, same on many Volvos.

I didn’t know that existed! That should work.

 

[gsbarry]

I think I was able to get the bearing aligned by hitting the alignment tool up/down with the hammer, went all the way in and spun with 2 fingers. So I’ll leave the engine mount alone for now.

Different problem, I didn’t run into this last time I installed the outdrive. For some reason I can’t get the outdrive to go the last 3/4” after all manner of jiggling around. I ended up tearing the gasket trying to get it back out, so waiting for a new one. So I tried test fitting again without the large rubber driveshaft/u-joint o-ring seal, without the gasket or water pipe o-ring (again just test fitting). Same problem, won’t go the last 3/4”. I double checked the shift shaft is aligned, looks good. Can’t figure out why it’s hanging up. To get that far in the splines have to be aligned. Only thing I can guess is perhaps the bellows retaining ring is hanging up somehow, but don’t see why.
View attachment 405831View attachment 405832View attachment 405833

Perhaps the alignment still isn't good enough and that's what stopping it. I ordered the crowfoot wrench and will give that a shot.

 

[Jmunk]

Your splines on the outdrive driveshaft most likely need rotated some to mate with the coupler. With the outdrive in gear I use the prop while pushing it on and it will fall in once the driveshaft lines up.

 

[gsbarry]

Your splines on the outdrive driveshaft most likely need rotated some to mate with the coupler. With the outdrive in gear I use the prop while pushing it on and it will fall in once the driveshaft lines up.

I get that spline alignment can cause the drive to hang up while inserting. However, and tell me if i'm thinking about this wrong, the splines are roughly 3" deep, but i'm getting hung up only about 3/4" from full insertion. So, I'm figuring that the splines are already engaged (over 2/3rds of way the in), and that doesn't appear to be the cause of the hang up.

 

[Scott06]

I get that spline alignment can cause the drive to hang up while inserting. However, and tell me if i'm thinking about this wrong, the splines are roughly 3" deep, but i'm getting hung up only about 3/4" from full insertion. So, I'm figuring that the splines are already engaged (over 2/3rds of way the in), and that doesn't appear to be the cause of the hang up.

a couple of things that have hung me up when almost all the way in - the orings on the driveshaft- are these greased up, and when I have been doing alignment work one can build up a lot of grease in the coupler and take some effort to squeeze out.

Did you check the alignment i ok? While it doesn't have to be 100% textbook perfect, just that the witness marks of grease are reasonably even around it. My current boat was never able to get full grease on the bottom of it, further adjusting just took it farther away... Still on the original gimbal and coupler at 20 years /450 hrs...

If so I have had to give it a good foot shove or lightly ( by hand with very little force) use a rachet and the nuts to get it on. Shouldn't take any real force, just snugging it down with a calibrated elbow