Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

[MostlyHrmlss]

1985 85hp powerhead installed on 1978 85hp everything else. Just serviced lower unit (new impeller, cleaned friction plate and pump housing, new oil). I put it all together, installed the telltale, put on the muffs, cranked it up and I get no water out the telltale at idle and a little faster (didn't want to rev it too much with no water). Removed the thermostat housing, still no water. There's plenty of water coming out the exhaust port and the two holes halfway up the midleg, just nothing from up top. Dropped the bottom end and shot water up the pickup tube, some came out the thermostat hole, most came out the exhaust; shot it down the thermostat hole, it came out the pickup tube, so I figure the passages aren't blocked.

What else do I look for?

 

[jerryjerry05]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

You test the thermostat?It sounds like the passages are clear.The hose might not be suppling enough water.Tape the muffs or a big bucket or in the lake.J

 

[MostlyHrmlss]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

Yeah, the thermostat opens when hot. It was open when I pulled it off the head, and it closed back up as it cooled. The telltale passage is on the supply side of the thermostat, so even if it were bad, I should still get water out the telltale, no?

I just consulted an online manual, and it mentions a water bypass valve, but not what it does or why. It's at the lower left corner of the exhaust cover, held in by two itty bitty 1/4" cap screws. Of course I twisted one of them off, afraid to touch the other one. Seems to me if something called a water bypass valve were stuck open, you might not get water where you expect it to be, but I'm no expert. Could this have anything to do with my lack of water at the thermostat?

 

[jason32038]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

I don't know I was disassembling my engine a couple of days ago and removed an oval/football shaped thing with a spring in it on the bottom of the water jacket cover. I know it has something to do with the water but im not sure what it's function is. Maybe your spring is broken. Is this a high pressure valve and does it open up at WOT i dont know.

 

[MostlyHrmlss]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

Just did a search for "water bypass valve" and got a great posting from Frank on how the whole cooling system works. The one thing he didn't go into was what happens when the bypass valve goes wrong. Any comment, Frank?

 

[MostlyHrmlss]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

Forgot to mention, I opened up the water pump from the '85 and there was a noticable amount of sand and small rocks in the passages, so some of that could have gotten in the bypass valve, right?

 

[MostlyHrmlss]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

I just tried to remove the bypass valve, with no luck. Of course I twisted off the remaining bolt, but apparently it didn't matter because I could not get the cover loose for the life of me. I tried to pound a screwdriver under it, didn't help. Any ideas?

 

[jason32038]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

Tap the sides with a hammer to see if you can loosen it up.

 

[jerryjerry05]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

That bypass is for when your pumping optimal water it releases the spring and it goes straight out.If you try to remove the cover you might never get it back on.
Your motor should work with or without the bypass.
If they have been operated in salt water they gum up right now.Most stop working after a while unless they have been routinley removed and cleaned.J

 

[MostlyHrmlss]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

What nobody is telling me here is what happens if it sticks open? Wouldn't that divert cooling water from the block straight out the exhaust leg?

I ran it in a tub tonight, still nothing coming from the telltale. There's some suction at the inlets, but not a bunch. On the bright side, I found out that my #3 plug isn't firing (see other post).

 

[Blackacid]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

I got nothing out of mine until I replaced the gasket for the thermostat housing, and re-installed the crankshaft seal/retainer correctly. Not sure which of those was the "fix" but my first guess is the thermostat gasket.

I used some of that instant-sealant stuff you get at the auto shop stores for the gasket.

 

[MostlyHrmlss]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

I don't think the thermostat seal is at issue here, since I don't get any water up to the thermostat to leak out a bad seal in the first place. What of the crankshaft seal/retainer you mention? By retainer I assume you mean that metal ring at the end of the lower unit shaft, and that is in place, groove side up. I never saw anything that looked like a seal in conjunction with it.

 

[mrdibs1]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

I just put a tell-tale in too. Nothing comes out until I rev it with muffs. Someone may yell at me for saying this, but if you have the drive unit in water and rev the engine cold, it would seem safe if you don't let it get hot. just to see if it'll prime itself with a little pressure from the impeller. That or prime it yourself by squirting some water in the tell-tale hole. I'm not sure if mine's right yet either, but seems I'm closer than you.

 

[jason32038]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

I believe the thermostat has to open first to allow water to the head and telltale. Might have to warm up for a few minutes.

 

[mrdibs1]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

The thermosdat doesn't have to be open for the telltale to work. It's on the cold side.

 

[emoney]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

The OP may be long past this issue, but I'm about to install a telltale myself
and noticed something yesterday. Mine is a 50hp, and has a water tube
going into the thermostat and I've been told to put my telltale into this tube
in the form of a "tee". Anyway....

On muffs, and in a trash can, there was hardly any water coming out the
rear and only a trickle in the 'water tube' that goes into the thermostat.
Once we raised the trash can to where water was 2-3inches over the
cavitation plate, basically halfway up the middle section, then water flowed
freely and that tube filled. Don't know if any of this makes sense or
even applies, but might be something to consider

 

[MostlyHrmlss]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

I haven't addressed the cooling issue since I found out I have ignition problems, too. Ah, the joys of antique outboards!

It does make sense, but it's a problem for me to achieve the same thing because the lower unit on this motor is huge. It wouldn't fit inside a 55 gallon drum for being too long. What I have is the biggest tote Wal Mart sells. I bolster the sides with plywood and use a ratchet strap to keep them from bulging out, but I can only just get the cav plate covered. It's a 45 minute drive to the nearest ramp, so putting it in real water is inconvenient. Some have suggested taping the muffs in place, I'll have to give that a try.

 

[87blf125]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

did you check the tube that comes down the leg and conects to the impeller housing? if it was not connected good water could be escaping there and not letting much up to the motor? just a thought...

 

[JAMGO46]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

Tape the muffs with plenty of tape to hold it tight and turn the water wide open. Same thing happened to me, these motors dont like muffs. However, when you put it in the lake or river and get plenty of submersion you will see it works just fine.

 

[MostlyHrmlss]

Re: Just put in telltale, nothing coming out

I'd like to think that, but the first/last time I put it in real water, the overheat alarm went off about a minute after I cast off, which is why I started looking at it in the first place. It's great fun trying to dock only running the motor a second at a time. 'Twas made easier by the PO bypassing the neutral safety switch so I could start it in gear.