Hydraulic-vs-Cable steering for Performance use

[brownies]

When I first bought/installed this Seastar hydraulic system on my boat (98 Skeeter ZX176 w/150hp), I thought it was HANDS DOWN the BEST thing I had ever purchased. Maybe ever....<br /> At the time, the boats top speed was just under 60mph.<br /> Now, with other upgrades, the boat is faster to the point of chinewalk stopping it from going any faster (mid 60's).<br /> I can't compensate for the "walk" which limits me from going any faster. Any attempt is short lived due to what seems to be a loss of steering "feel".<br /> I know hydraulic is masking the "feel", but, it almost seems as if the system is sort of "bypassing"...or...at the least the boat does not seem to re-act to steering wheel movements during the midst of a "wild rocking".<br /> <br /> I can grab the back of the motor and get about 1/8" of cylinder rod slack by rocking the motor back and forth. I figure this means I've got air in the system. I know I should bleed this again, but, I have done that once and it took "for-ever".<br /> Just wondering...<br />Is it possible to get it COMPLETELY TIGHT?<br />Is 1/8" going to make a tremendous difference?<br />If I upgrade to Kevlar hoses will it make a tremendous difference?<br />Am I wasting my time with this when I should just spend the money for a dual cable system?<br /><br />All the dual cable systems I've found say No feedback. I want feedback don't I?<br /><br />I guess I just liked this hydraulic system SO MUCH when I spent a small fortune on it, that I'd like to be able to use it.<br />Anybody got any answers to 20 questions?

 

[WillyBWright]

Re: Hydraulic-vs-Cable steering for Performance use

Non-feedback eliminates the torque that likes to yank the wheel out of your hands. Let go and the motor cranks hard and flips the boat. Hydraulic and NFB Cable will prevent that. As long as all the air is out (sounds likely), you can't beat Hydraulic!<br /><br />You have a 3-blade prop? Going to a 4 frequently helps a lot. Putting in solid motor mounts can help, but I wouldn't on a 150.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: Hydraulic-vs-Cable steering for Performance use

Some folks will say that you can get the system completely tight, no air - no slop. I've never seen a hydraulic that tight. I'm not saying it cant be done, I've just never seen it.<br /><br />The slop can come from several places. If you don't have the performance helm the valves could be by-passing at speed. The non-kevlar hoses will stretch or expand and the fluid will be delayed moving the cylinder. Any air in the system - at all - allows for slop. The wrong fluid can allow slop.<br /><br />We don't use the hydraulic or no feedback on our performance boats. The Hydrostream we're putting together now has Merc Ride Guide dual rack & pinion.<br /><br />With hydraulic the steering wheel never stays centered. On performance boats we have the trim buttons on the wheel. If it doesnt stay centered, the wires get all tangled around the helm. Eventually the steering locks up. With dual push pull cables the wheel stays centered.<br /><br />Now, I do have the Sea Star on the Hydra Sports and love it. But that's a 22' boat that goes about 40. On trips, crusing at 25 or so, you simply set the course and forget it. Small corrections, but generally you just keep the wheel in hand and cruise along.<br /><br />True, the hydraulic masks the torque in the wheel. With performance boats we add a torque tab on the skeg and play with gearcase shape to get the torque out. Torque in the wheel means the gearcase isnt running straight thru the water. This causes loss of speed and can cause handling issues. We actually want the feel. That way we know when the torque is gone and the gearcase is running straight.

 

[DJ]

Re: Hydraulic-vs-Cable steering for Performance use

Dead on advice/observations from Dhadley.

 

[spego]

Re: Hydraulic-vs-Cable steering for Performance use

Mine does pretty much the same but my hydraulic steering is tight (no movement at the motor and a very slight mush in the wheel) but it took some time to get it like that. I was experiencing chine walk around 60 so I have done just about everything I could think of and came across an article (think it was on Ken Cook's site) that said that torque on the bottom end could cause chine walk (make it fall off pad with light loaded boats) so i installed a torque tab on mine but have had no chance to test it yet.<br /><br />Dhadley has some good advise there for sure and from experience.....I would try to get that movement out of there and try a tab if you have an extra 20 bucks.

 

[brownies]

Re: Hydraulic-vs-Cable steering for Performance use

If not mistaken, every bass boat I've had, DID, have torque steer to the right (hard to turn to the right when running WOT). This was with the tim tab set to where no torque steer until it was out of the water (wot).<br /> Hard to turn to the right....Is my "direction" correct? <br /> The reason I ask is that I...uhhh...forgot which direction.<br /> Also, I did install a torque tab on the skeg. and now at WOT, it's just a bit hard to turn to the LEFT.<br /> This leads me to beleive that I'm "almost there" and just need to trim a bit off of the torque tab.<br /> Problem is....I just need to know if my DIRECTION was correct to beging with...Sorry, I just forgot something that I always just "took for granted". (anybody ever done that before?)

 

[spego]

Re: Hydraulic-vs-Cable steering for Performance use

A quote from Scream and Fly:<br /><br />Wheel Torque: The tendency for the steering wheel to forcibly turn right. Caused by the prop rotation and increases as the engine is jacked out of the water, becoming maximum when only one blade of the prop is entering the water. <br /><br />Sounds like there is too much on that tab.....you are right you may have to take some off to compensate for it.

 

[cart7]

Re: Hydraulic-vs-Cable steering for Performance use

Go over to www.bassboatcentral.com and head to the Skeeter board or the setups by Todd board. There are plenty of guys with lots of experience setting up rigs that can help you.