Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

[wuzafed]

I have a 95 Johnson 130 and after she sits for a while (couple of days to a week) she is a real bear to start! Refuses to idle but if I can get her to idle she smokes out the marina. Once I get her away from the dock and get her up and running she runs great for the rest of the day, with no problems at all. I was told once that there is a idle/slow speed set of jets and the VRO is probably dumping too much oil into the gas fuel mixture so she won't run properly until I get her cleaned out by flushing the low speed jets with the middle speed jets. I think I understand what they are saying but I really hope there is some sort of adjustment I can "tweek" regarding the VRO at idle... Any help is really appreciated. Thanks

 

[The Marine Doctor]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

Does the smoke go away after a while or does it continue?<br /><br />Are you in the habit of unhooking your fuel line?<br /><br />If so..do not do this.<br /><br />It sounds like you are getting oil pumped into the carbs while the engine is not running. This will create a lot of smoke.<br /><br />TMD

 

[ob]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

wuzafed,Had the same scenario on my 96' model 70hp.Problem got proressively worse.Since the oil system stays primed,in my case it was a failing actuating rod seal between the oil and fuel half of the VRO pump.With engine off ,oil was weaping through causing engine to run oil rich on startup.The longer it sat ,the more smoke on initial startup.The cure for mine was simply using the VRO as a 50:1 pumper.The cure for yours ,if this is your problem ,is to replace the VRO unit.My local dealer has no parts or kit to resolve this and wouldn't touch a VRO pump rebuild in any case.

 

[The Marine Doctor]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

Same fix here...Remove and replace the VRO pump.<br /><br />TMD

 

[AUGIDAWG]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

Try pumping the gas line bulb before starting, and after 30 seconds of starting.

 

[wuzafed]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

Thanks guys for the advice. Sounds like you hit the nail on the head. (I do not remove the fuel line when not in use.) <br /> OB how did you convert your VRO into the "50:1 pumper"? Is that an optional unit that replaces the VRO or do you somehow alter the VRO hookup? It does seen to be getting a little worse, but as long as she starts she is "good to go" for the rest of the day. If I disconnected the oil feed to the motor when not in use would that help? Is there a way to do that? Do you know an approximate cost for a VRO unit that I would need to replace? Thanks

 

[hookemncookem]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

Fed, consider removing the pump entirely..If you had done this before the "swamping" then as long as the carbs are getting fuel they are oiling..If your gonna pour oil into a tank then why not make it your fuel tank? Every start will deliver the proper mix regardless. Premixing is the only way to ensure you are delivering at 50:1 at all throttle settings..If the VRO fails at high power settings the damage may occur before you realize whats happening..Premixing is a no brainer and kinda like insurance against some very expensive repairs..Just my $.02

 

[ob]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

New VRO pump for your engine is around $225 give or take.Disconnecting the oil line from engine may very well help to alleviate the oil rich startup problem.Trouble is , any time you disconnect and (reprime the oil line) it is recommended to run at least 75:1 premix in fuel tank unitl oil consumption from remote oil reservoir can be established.Now you're smoking all over again.VRO unit works fine as a 50:1 pumper if that is what you choose to do.Just need to securely blank off the oil inlet to VRO and disable the vro alarms,leaving just the engine overheat alarm.

 

[wuzafed]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

OB Thanks for the info. I saw where you were talking to T-290 and gave himadvice as to how to use his VRO as a 50:1 pumper. Could I follow the same procedure? I may try that after the fuel tank gets down a bit (so I know how much fuel I have left).<br /> Two quick questions:<br /> 1) the tan overheat whire that you suggested to be grounded on the block. I should leave it grounded after the "test" with the key in the on position - Right? (Other VRO whires - just remove them or leave them disconnected - right?)<br /><br /> 2) the red lever on the electronic choke. looking at mine, I'm a bit confused which way is correct. I can point it to the block (starboard) where it is now or the other position, after coming around pointing it to the bow, is just past port slightly to the stern. If I select the "port" position will the fuel be cut off to the electronic choke? Hope I was clear enough!

 

[ob]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

wuzafed,The same VRO disable procedure applies to your engine.Once you disconnect the four wire harness from vro at its connector,just secure both disconnected ends so that they are not swinging loose in engine compartment.The tan temp sensor wire will only be grounded as a test procedure.The red manual lever on the primer solenoid should be normally end facing aft inline with the body of the solenoid.if you ever have a need to manually prime the engine the lever would then be placed perpendicular to the body of the solenoid.

 

[93bronco]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

you can go over to the outboard shop <on rivers ave> & they can get you the premix conversion pump #438402 <$165>. they can usually get it in a couple of days.

 

[oldboat1]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

got to side with Hookem on this. If you are manually premixing anyway, why bother with a pump that might fail. Just mix it in the tank and get out from under some bad engineering.

 

[wuzafed]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

Thanks for the all the suggestions. oldboat/hookum if I understand you correctly I can: <br />1) remove the VRO tank and system all together.<br />2) hook up the fuel line feed from the gas tank to where the VRO feed currently goes into the carbs. I should be "good to go", right?<br /><br /> I was of the impression that the "VRO pump" was acting as a "fuel pump" and that I needed the VRO pump to get fuel (and oil) to the carbs. If I understand you correctly the motor has its own fuel pump and I really don't need the VRO pump.<br /> <br /> Am I right? Thanks

 

[The Marine Doctor]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

NO...the VRO is both the fuel pump and the oil pump.<br /><br />TMD

 

[oldboat1]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

I was assuming (incorrectly, it appears) that there is a normal fuel pump in addition to the VRO system that is intended to add oil. If the VRO pump replaces the fuel pump, I would look for a way to premix the oil in the boat's tank, still partially using the VRO system (i.e., the pump). Offhand, it would seem that the oil line would need to be blocked, while keeping the rest of the system in place. This seems like a simple fix if the VRO pump would still pump the premixed gas from the fuel tank into the carbs -- but would want to be sure that the pump would function properly in this manner and that it would not be damaged by the change.

 

[wuzafed]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

Thanks TMD. I thought so, based upon all the great info that you and others are providing.<br /><br />2KBoat is that the Boston Whaler place near I-526? I assume the conversion pump will replace the VRO pump. Is it necessary to replace the VRO with the conversion pump? Thanks for the help

 

[ob]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

No need to replace with conventional pump unitl your pump fails.the fuel half of the VRO pump works superb as a 50:1 pumper once you have blanked off the oil inlet side of VRO and disabled the VRO alarms.

 

[93bronco]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

wuzafed- yes it is.<br />you can see it on the rite as you are going to mt.pl. before the n-rhett exit.<br />great people to deal with.<br />especially if you already have the part #.<br />the red cross is on the other side of rivers & 526.

 

[wuzafed]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

Thanks ob<br /> Just one lingering question, once I test the tan wire by grounding it on the block, with the ign onn, do I leaave it hooked up grounded or should I "unground" it aafter the test? Thanks

 

[ob]

Re: Hard to start and smokes like it was winterized!

Unground it.The grounding just simulates an overheat by completing the alarm circuit.