Floor material

reelfishin

Captain
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
3,043
I recently came across several sheets of 1/8" aluminum diamond plate sheeting.
Since I'm in the process now of redoing my Sportboat, I am seriously considering adding a few extra cross braces and riveting in an all aluminum floor. I've also considered doing the rear floor in three pieces, thus leaving a removable panel in the middle secured by screws or even just riveted that would allow me to access the bilge for maintenance or to run cables or wires. This would depend on whether I end up going with a center console or stick steer. If I go stick steer, then the rear panel will be done in one or two pieces. The sheets are wide enough to allow me to use only two pieces for the whole boat, one on the lower section, one on the upper section with a short rear section left separate to access the bilge, and possibly to recess the battery into the deck part way.

I could also frame the forward deck to have a removable storage panel or fuel tank compartment which is serviceable.

Its only slightly more work than doing it with wood and it would no doubt be permanent.

I'm already coating the inner hull with Gluvit and replacing all wood cross members for the deck with aluminum, adding an all aluminum deck would make it as durable as possible.

I would still paint the deck, most likely with something to aid traction, as well as to reduce the sun's reflection. a light gray would work well, primed with a self etching zinc chromate primer with some grit added to the final coat.

My concerns are that it will take too many cross pieces below the deck to make it sufficiently solid under my 300 lbs, and that boxing any compartments would be more trouble then their worth. Cutting the aluminum can be done with a plasma cutter, or circular saw at the expense of a few blades, but not a big deal. Welding up H shaped frames is doable but a real pain but I could also make the access panels run cross ways too, much like the original deck is made now, (the original forward deck is three pieces of plywood, the middle one lifts out if you pull it up from the front first and could easily have been hinged. It may have been for a factory tank option?).

It would be nice to be able to have a boat that I could come home after a long day on the water fishing and just park it till the next day without worrying about it getting wet in the rain.

Things the are in question if I go stick steer are where to mount the fish finder and GPS unit as there will be no dashboard. As well as what type of front seat and how to secure it and make it strong and solid on an aluminum deck. With wood, I'd be using 5/8" plywood and adding an extra floor support or two where the seat will be. The aluminum would pretty much mean putting in a three pack of cross braces right below each pedestal seat and anchoring right through those cross members with stainless toggle bolts. This could also ruin any plans to tuck a fuel tank under the forward deck. This is something I'd really have to measure and think about first. Weight wise the aluminum is actually a few pounds lighter even though its a larger sheet, but it would require adding a half dozen or more extra floor cross members, which would make the overall install heavier, but since if I use aluminum, I'd be going with a stick steer set up, that would eliminate the weight of the console and rear leaning post. The rear seating would also be a pedestal seat, meaning I'd dump the rear fold down seat to eliminate all wood in the boat. I think the final weight would end up being slightly less than with the console. But do the benefits outweigh any compromises?
 

JoeMan

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jun 29, 2006
Messages
322
Re: Floor material

I like your no-maintenance aluminum idea. Please check out the Comanche thread...Dave also used this same aluminum sheet material to highly customize his boat for fishing. Lots of pics there, and more available. Not sure how much Dave has been visiting this forum these days, but I would suppose he might have some ideas/suggestions for you in regards to all of your options. I could hook the two of you up to have a conversation if you like.

Please post pics of your project as you go. I use www.tinypic.com Go to that site, browse for and upload your pic, then copy all of the text in the "IMG Code" box. The code for your picture will always begin with
Copy that code and paste it into your reply here...and your picture will appear just like the one I did above. (just in case you wanted some image posting help) Love to see it as you go!

As for the overall additional weight...I would not worry about that so much, given the weight capacity of that hull. Even as a 300 lb guy...if you had another 300 lb guy on board, some additional structural aluminum weight and your gear...you still won't approach the maximum capacity. I think the decision is which structural options you prefer and are able to do.

I like the removable rear section idea for the bilge area. I will at some point re-do my floor (it will be wood again since she is always put right in the garage), and the rear section will be removable for the same reason. I did leave an open area to get to the bilge pump and the drain plug, but that's it. I'm not having problems, but would like total access when needed.

For the forward section of raised decking... I can imagine that since it's about 8 inches raised, it would take 2 or 3 layers of cross member supports to provide the strength you need for that raised height. Or...instead of multiple layers of cross supports, what about using just one layer of H welded cross members under the decking, and then take cut pieces of the H support material just several inches long each, and run these vertically from the cross members down to the existing box stringers in perhaps 8 or 12 spots? Some would need to be cut on a slight angle since the stringers are not all flat on top. I did this with wood block pieces to support my floor. You'd need to make some L angle pieces to rivet these vertical H pieces to the stringers and then again to connect the H pieces to your top cross members. Then the decking would be riveted to just one layer of cross members. Does that make sense? This may be just as much work, but keeps the space under there more open and with less material.

As far as not having a spot for your GPS/Fishfinder controls, what about making an upside down L panel section out of that aluminum you've got? Attach it to the inner existing side panel and then to your flooring. Like this guy did:

2955p3k.jpg


I like the forward fuel tank idea, under the raised decking. The vertical H support pieces added to one layer of cross members (as opposed to several layers of cross members) leaves more open space for this, so it would seem to me. As far as needing to run 3 sets of cross members underneath your seat...can you simply bore some holes through the cross members to allow the fuel line to pass through? If so, you could protect the fuel line by lining the cut hole with circular rubber channel of some kind. I've used thick rubber tubing for that on my boat; the fuel line could then rest on that and alleviate the concern you'd have if it sat directly on a cut aluminum hole.

Hope I've shared something of value for additional options.
 

reelfishin

Captain
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
3,043
Re: Floor material

The forward floor now sits only on a few sheetmetal cross panels, the front doesn't use any wood supports. To add enough support to hold the weight of a seat, atop where the tank will be, I'll need to add a few cross supports or floor joists under the seat area. To not trap the tank in place, what I meant by H braces was to build an H shaped frame around the tank, and a removable panel held in place by screws. The panel itself would also be reinforced with the same tubing.

I'm still contemplating a few options, the snow is melted and the weather is starting to finally warm up so I'll be looking to get back to that boat soon.

One option I'm also thinking about is 3/4" PVC panels, it would be more money but a lot less work, and less weight both due to the lighter material and it won't need as many aluminum cross members to prevent flex.
 

JoeMan

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jun 29, 2006
Messages
322
Re: Floor material

I like the PVC idea...sounds like a stroke of genius. Maybe you could post a few pics when you do the process, so that some of us can learn from it?
 

reelfishin

Captain
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
3,043
Re: Floor material

I like the PVC idea too, but not the $325 per sheet cost.
I'm going this week to pick up the 2x2" tubing for the floor joists or supports, along with some light aluminum angle for brackets.
I also want to redo the transom wood, it's fine up top but the bottom has been water logged. It dried out fairly well but I'd prefer to have some new wood in there. It's probably fine with the 40hp on it now but my intention is to hang a 70hp on it or more. I still can't imagine this thing getting on plane with a 40hp.

Once I get the floor support cut and in place, I can lay a temporary deck in place so I can work on the transom. Right now I'm straddling the hull bottom standing on only the stringers.

I'm still on the edge about how to lay out this boat, the original set up is out, I go out alone too often and too often I outweigh any other fishing partners, so me sitting at the helm off to the side may not be a good choice. I like the idea of stick steer and keeping as much floor space as I can, but this opens up a slew of issues as to how to arrange seating, and how to arrange things like the GPS Plotter, fish finder, etc.
The step in the deck midship is also a concern, if I go with a center console, the ideal console placement would be at the point of that step, meaning that I'd have to build a raise portion rearward under half of the console, then the seat would have to be extra tall, and most likely require a foot rest or raised platform. It's the idea of the raised platform that concerns me as it might be a tripping hazard while fishing. I have a center console, it's one with a built in forward seat, and just large enough to hold a helm and mount the fish finder and GPS on. The controls would have to mount on the side of the console, which is fine with me. Putting the console at the mid point would allow me to make use of all the original cables as well and eliminate the need to buy a Stick Steer set up.
My concerns in using the CC is both the need for a raised rear platform and seat, and putting my 300lb self too far rearward in the boat.

Having a stick steer and only a single forward pedestal seat would be the ideal weight distribution, and would allow for a simpler fuel system as the tank could remain in the rear. I could run off a single 12 gallon portable under the splashwell and carry a reserve 6 gallon portable under the forward deck or in the bow.
I've had stick steer boats and really like the system. It allows me to deal with the anchor, controls, and have good visibility at all times up front. It however puts the driver in the worst spot to fish as most fishing is done off the stern.

Putting the rear section of the console on a raise platform will mean that the seat post will need to be really high, too high to sit on without stepping up first. Something I did consider is a cooler seat behind the console which can flip and provide dual seating rearwards for fishing off the stern but this idea would be hampered by if the seating is set on a raise platform, (feet would be dangling when facing rearward). The only solution then would be to raise the whole deck to one level, but I really like the added side height the way it is. It adds a level of safety when in rougher water.

Any ideas?
 

JoeMan

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jun 29, 2006
Messages
322
Re: Floor material

Could you leave the floor at the bi-level height the way you like, and then just have a portable "step" (just a wood box covered in carpet) for feet rather than raising the entire floor?
 

reelfishin

Captain
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
3,043
Re: Floor material

I thought about that but I'd also like the helm seat to be reversible for fishing, having to keep your feet on a loose or unmounted box could be a problem, if not dangerous.

The more I think about it, the more I think I either have to custom make a console, and forget trying to use the factory made one I have, or go with stick steering.
I like the idea of driving up front, but also like the idea of being at the helm or within reach when fishing. I fished for a bit on a buddies boat over the weekend, a 17' CC with a flip back cooler seat at the helm, and a single forward seat ahead of the console. Fishing from the front just don't work, and there's not enough room to move around next to the console. The boat just felt cramped to me. There wasn't enough room for both to fish from the stern, and fishing from the forward seat was useless as the lines kept trying to go under the boat and out the back.

It would be fine in still waters or freshwater lakes but I fish mostly saltwater and rivers.
After this weekend, I'm leaning towards the open deck idea with a box or pedestal seat up front and maybe a fold down seat or second pedestal at the rear.

Something else I considered was just using a stick steer set up at mid ship, mounting a pedestal seat at the helm position and one up front.

If the boat was wider in the stern, I'd say maybe putting two pedestal seats behind a console would work but I think anything wider than the narrowest console of single file seats would hinder fishing.

I did see something this weekend that may also be an option, a guy had an older skiff set up with a normal helm mounted along one side, much like a stick steer set up, but still with a wheel, and the motor controls were right ahead of it. He had a cooler seat mounted just ahead of mid ship, the driver sat on the right side of the cooler seat and had both steering and controls at his right hand. He was using the boat for crabbing, and the set up let him spin the wheel into a full turn, and sort of pivot at idle around the crab pot he was pulling, never touching the throttle to stop, he just motored on crab pot to crab pot, pulling each onboard with a side mounted trailer winch and hand crank.

What it amounts to is finding the best way to make the most use out of a small boat. Using the small console I have now would work as far as room, but the controls will be side mounted on that console, and that may be just enough of a protrusion on one side to cause a problem. So I'm really leaning towards some sort of side mounted steering. I do like the idea of using a regular helm versus the stick steer box, it gives me finer control, but I think the wheel will need to be very flat and on the large side to work well.

I need to decide before I lay the deck in this thing, if I opt for no console, it'll make a difference in how I build the floor. No console, and it won't need any center access panels to get to cables. I also strongly prefer to have all cables run in the gunwales vs in the bilge area.
 

JoeMan

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jun 29, 2006
Messages
322
Re: Floor material

One thing is for sure...you have options and it sounds like you are quite capable to make the best combination happen! Do you believe you'll have her ready to go by early summer.
 

reelfishin

Captain
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
3,043
Re: Floor material

Probably not, I've been working on this in between four other projects, and I plan on being away on vacation for at least two weeks next month. I've actually got 5 boats in the process of various repairs. Along with all that I still need to find time to fish.

I've got no garage here so I'm also at the mercy of the weather. Its been raining here for the past two days.

I figure that by the end of summer, I should have a handle on the bulk of it.
The transom will be the deciding factor in how long it takes. If I can find a way to slip the wood out and get it back in place without ripping out a ton of rivets, then it's gonna be a much smoother project, but I won't butcher the hull to fix the transom wood. If I have to, I'll laminate up a new transom panel using several thinner pieces of plywood, and use fiberglass and epoxy to build it up to the original thickness. I may even just make up a completely laminated transom panel, that way it's one less thing to ever replace.

The goal here is to make this a one time project, and I'd really like to make all the repairs permanent. I don't want to be doing this again when I'm 60 or 70. It lasted for 45 years with wood and foam, I'm the same age as the boat, so if it goes another 40 or so years, I'll be too old to be doing this type of work then. I want this thing to last. It's the best hull construction I've seen in any aluminum boat so far, it's built like a tank.

The way I see it is that this is the one boat I'll most likely keep for good, they don't build them like this today and I can't buy anything close out there now built like this thing is.
The other boats I have will sooner or later get sold off, I'll keep one of my smaller aluminum boats and this.
 

JoeMan

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jun 29, 2006
Messages
322

reelfishin

Captain
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
3,043
Re: Floor material

Thanks for the pics, I've been dragging a bit here getting back to working on mine, but it's been raining every day I've had off work so far. I knew the hull design was different on the lapstrake hull models but didn't realize how different. It's hardly the same boat other than the open layout and overall length. The step in my floor is just about mid ship, I woudn't have room to mount a console and seat on the lower deck and still have any room behind the seat to walk or stand. I also don't have as much of a closed bow as the newer models do. Maybe 18" or so at best of closed off bow area.
That seat is sort of what I meant by a cooler seat for mine, like this one: http://www.iboats.com/Permanent-Mou...9364314--**********.189091191--view_id.272273

Of course I hadn't really thought about just making one, maybe I could build on out of aluminum, and build a drain right into the deck that went to the bilge area or to it's own pump. The thought of making it a livewell also crossed my mind.

I though mine was on an oversized trailer, mine sits on a 2400lb capacity Loadrite roller trailer with an extra long tongue. When I first got this thing and before I dug out all the rotted foam, I may have considered putting it on a tandem, but now it's gotten at least 1000lbs lighter minus all the wet foam. I suppose there's still some ahead of the forward compartment which I've not dug into yet, but will as soon as I get back to working on it.
In taking my time, it's letting me really consider a lot of different ideas, which hopefully will make it a one time build that I really like when its done.
 
Top