Fat Fifty... Any advice?

[Erik.C.]

I had to take a break for a couple of weeks, but I hope to be back working on this motor this weekend. It's a 1959 Evinrude Starflight 50 (model 50518). I've got it running, but not very well. I have a friend who has more tools than I do and he is willing to possibly give me a hand Saturday. I need advice on how best to proceed.

It is running pretty rough and backfiring quite violently but it's kind of intermittent. I have re-done the timing, re-set the points and adjusted all of the carb linkage thanks to help from many great guys on here. I have not done a compression test yet for lack of equipment. That will probably be the first thing I do Saturday.

When I bought it, I found a lot of rubber pieces in the fuel tank and the primer bulb was in pieces. Also, the fuel filter was not connected in the fuel bowl so who knows what might be in the carb. I have cleaned out the fuel tank and replaced the fuel filter.

I have a video and I hope someone can hear the backfiring and give me some advice. I just need a direction. Thank you guys again.

 

[Faztbullet]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Fat wallet.... Check the rotor and cap in dark for crossfires along with carb settings.(lean)

 

[steelespike]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

I second check the cap and rotor. also run it in the dark look for stray arcing.
Pull the plugs and note the condition Plug wires may be bad. They are screwed into the cap.Don't try to just pull them out.
Do you have a factory service manual?

 

[F_R]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

When does the backfiring start? I didn't hear any.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Gee, Don't you think it is time to adjust the carb under running conditions? Hard to adjust it in a tank, in neutral. I would recommend setting High and Low speed needles to initial settings and launching that puppy. Adjust the idle needles, in gear until she runs OK. Now the tricky part. Run her up to full throttle and adjust the High speed needles for smoothness and speed. Then redo the idle mixtures.

Is the carb float set properly?

 

[Erik.C.]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Cap and rotor looked pretty good visually. I didn't see any signs of crossfire like carbon trails or anything, but that doesn't mean much. Running in the dark might be worth a try. The plug wires aren't great, but I know they aren't easy to get either. I tried to pull one while it was running with a pair of insulated pliers and shocked myself pretty good. Ouch!

The backfiring is really hard to hear in the video. Maybe backfire is the wrong description now that I think more about it. It's more like the motor just misses real bad, and I get a hard "poof" out of the exhaust, into the water, and water pops out of the bucket.

And Chris1956, you are right. I need to get it back in the water to adjust better, but that's how I ended up back in the bucket. I launched it and when I tried to go into forward it was popping out of gear real bad. I brought it home and was going to try and get some of the slop out of the shift linkage and wanted to run it in the bucket before making changes to see if it would pop out of gear in the bucket so that I could see if the shift linkage changes make a difference. Kind of like a base line to compare against. Then I started wondering if this violent miss is ripping it out of gear.

I don't know if the float is set correctly yet. I have been reluctant to take anything apart that requires a gasket until I can hopefully diagnose the problem, just because parts and gaskets aren't real easy to get for this thing.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Erik, I had one of those fattys with a bad shift dog and sloppy linkage, as you seem to have. There is a way to set it to stay in forward or reverse, but not both at the same time. Rather than replace the gears and dog, that is what I did. So I never had reverse gear.

You might try it, until you get it sorted out. To adjust to max forward. Set shifter to neutral. Loosen lock nut at base of external shift arm. Move shifter linkage toward forward until forward gear is felt when spinning prop. Back it off a bit until prop spins free and tighten lock nut. That should give maximum contact between gears and dog, in forward.

 

[Erik.C.]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Thank you Chris1956. I may give that a try. I just feel that I need to apply a few bandaids to this thing for now so that I can figure out how expensive the real surgery is going to be. Haha. I want to get this thing right, but it's as money allows.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Pick up some permetex #2. If you are careful, the carb will come apart and the gaskets will be intact. A little of the black sealer will make them like new again.....Your gonna wanta clean that carb....

 

[F_R]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

OK, I watched the video again and still don't hear any backfiring. Perhaps I did hear it sneeze once. I do see you fiddling with the carb idle needles a lot but don't see any real response. I say you need to get that thing in the water and adjust it properly.

Now for the rest of the story: You say it pops out of gear. That is a whole different ball game. The clutch dog and forward gear probably are shot. And if it has been doing that awhile, it may have beaten the shift linkage to death. Sorry, there is no short cut. You must take care of the worn dog and gear, and also restore the linkage if it is damaged.

No, backfiring won't make it pop out of gear. But many people mistakenly think it is backfiring when actually it is the gear jumping. In any case, you are running it in neutral in a barrel, so the problem is not showing up. It must be in gear to tell anything about that.

 

[Erik.C.]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Well, I really appreciate all the responses. I guess a lot of it comes down to getting it on the water. I did some more research on parts and was pleasantly surprised that I can get the gears and shift dog much cheaper on ebay. I was seriously worried about the amount of money going into this motor.

As far as manuals, at this time of year it's hard to spend $70 on a factory manual. Has anyone had any good experience with Seloc? I can get a "Johnson/Evinrude Outboards, 3-4 Cylinders, 1958-72 (Seloc Marine Tune-Up and Repair Manuals)" for about $5 used. Or the Seloc manual online is about $20. Any recommendations? budgets are pretty tight this time of year since I am in the construction industry and I have a son expecting Christmas. lol.

 

[Willyclay]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Any recommendations?

A factory manual is very desirable but not essential. Lots of good info in the Clymer manuals available FREE at the link below. I used the same Clymer manual for your motor for over ten years with my 1962 Johnson 75HP. Good luck!

http://forums.iboats.com/boat-topic...nline-service-info-not-just-boats-393281.html

LOGIN as directed then drill down to: Small Engines, Marine/Boat Motors, Evinrude/Johnson, Outboard 4-Cylinder 50 to 85HP (1958-1968) and, finally, Condensed Service Data.

If you are unable to access the website and obtain the manual, send me a PM with your email address and I will reply with a copy of mine attached.

 

[Erik.C.]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Wow. Thank you so much Willyclay! I had some of had some of that info, but I REALLY appreciate that link. That's a huge help.

 

[boobie]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

O'Well , I'm from the old school and still say Seloc and Clymer manuals Suck . The best thing yet is an OEM Factory Service manual. I know I'll get some heat from this but what the heck. I've only used the OEM's for 46 yrs, but what do I know.

 

[Vintin]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

......and it's not like you buy an OEM manual and then it's not worth anything. The OEM has resale value, even if the motor turns out to be carp.

 

[boobie]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

Well spoken....Maybe I should start selling some of the ones I have but just haven't got the heart to do it. I still use them.

 

[Erik.C.]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

No, I totally agree with you boobie. I know that there is no comparison to the factory oem manual. I would love to have one, but it's just not in the budget right now. I will say though, I had a '74 Camaro in high school and while I was building it I bought a factory assembly manual. Wow! Talk about cool. There isn't anything like factory info.

 

[59 Fatty]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

How's the engine restoration going? I really enjoy seeing someone else with a fat 50 that is being re-born. Great old engines, look cool too!

 

[JRegier]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

My engine was actually backfiring when I would try to start it. It was so loud I could hear the neighbours swearing!:lol:

 

[Erik.C.]

Re: Fat Fifty... Any advice?

My project was kind of put on hold for the holidays. I'm hoping to be able to start working on mine again soon. I did, however, find one of the gears i'm probably going to need so I bought it. $100 every where else. I got mine for $20 plus shipping. Score! I also found a part number for a carburetor rebuild kit instead of having to by individual gaskets and such. I haven't bought that yet though.