Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

[QC]

Well I was surprised to find that my African Mahogany (AKA Khaya) is probably going to be dark and red enough without any stain. I have worked on this pic a lot to duplicate the actual color I am seeing when holding this piece in indirect sunlight. It is this color on my monitor. Most of the colored parts have been sanded with around 120, the lighter to the right is rough. The darker section to the left was stained with an oil based Walnut stain from Olympic. My understanding was to use water based stains, but I don't think it matters as I like the no stain look. This is one coat of epoxy and I'll probably have at least three or four for protection and multiple coats of varnish on top of that. I am probably not going to use any fiberglass cloth. Comments? Will it be much lighter than I am seeing when on the deck? Against dark blue topsides?

This is a result of my first batch of Epoxy resin. Although I left the brush in the mixing cup on purpose, I am going to keep this as a reminder/trophy for my desk. It got so hot it melted it's way through the plastic cup and leaked out a little I musta skipped that part of the destructions . . .

 

[Bondo]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

Ayuh,.......... Looks like you're having Fun there QC,.........

I am probably not going to use any fiberglass cloth. Comments?

As discussed before,..........
Unsupported Resins, even Epoxy, Isn't very strong,+ kinda defeats the purpose of epoxying in the 1st place.........
If you were to use even a single layer of an Angel Hair fabric, such as a 1oz. weight or less,.........
It'll give the epoxy atleast alittle Support,+ Help to stop any cracking later in it's life........
And,........
You'll Never be able to "See" it........

 

[QC]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

Ayuh,.......... Looks like you're having Fun there QC,........

Oh, yeah, considering I have everything needed to finish a bare wood hull scattered all over my garage, workbench and boat storage area . . . . uh, how would you put it . . . . hmmmmm . . . oh yeah . . . Ayuh!!

As discussed before,..........
Unsupported Resins, even Epoxy, Isn't very strong,+ kinda defeats the purpose of epoxying in the 1st place.........
If you were to use even a single layer of an Angel Hair fabric, such as a 1oz. weight or less,.........
It'll give the epoxy atleast alittle Support,+ Help to stop any cracking later in it's life........
And,........
You'll Never be able to "See" it........

Check back on this thread. Last time I asked, I got a bunch of contradictions. Sorta why I posted again. I am finding that not doing the deck is fairly common, but highly recommend for strength on the sides, bottom and transom . . .

 

[Chinewalker]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

I don't like using epoxy as a finish for this reason. If it does haze or crack over time, it is a real bugger to strip off. At least with varnish you can use an over the counter stripper and start fresh...

And without any glass as to strengthen it, it will crack with the expansion/contraction of the wood and exposure to UV.

Lots of opinions - that's mine...
- Scott

 

[QC]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

Yeah, I have been following a lot of the advice and experience over here: 'http://www.glen-l.com/' Multiple coats of Epoxy and then Varnish for UV protection is the method used by all of these guys. Most use glass too. But they are all one big happy family, and I like to hear these other opinions despite the fact that I then can't make a decision . . .

 

[Old Salt Oz]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

You should avoid using oil based stain as this will not only reduce penetration of the resin but also cause it to delaminate, oil and epoxy do not mix.

The timber being treated MUST be very DRY, this is most important because any moisture remaining in the timber will be trapped and may well rot the timber.

You can thin your epoxy resin to improve the penetration and help prevent surface cracking of the timber by first mixing the resin and hardener, then adding up to 40% Methylated spirits.

The advice above to add a thin layer of glass is very good and you should use it, you will not see it but it will improve the jobs durability.

I hope this helps.

Avagoodchrissie......

 

[DJ]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

QC,

My Whaler upfit has caused me to learn a lot about mahogany. You're right, the African mahogany does come out rather red without stain. I did not stain mine.

I am using 1/1 "Ribbon" mahogany. It is beautiful without the stain.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

QC - A lot of mohagonys have quite a bit of natural oil. This oil does not make for a good epoxy bond. In addition, the new "Spar Urethane" finishes are very good, and compatable with spains and more tolerant of oily woods. You might try a spar urethane, as it will give very good protection and a superior fininsh to an epoxy. Spar Urethanes are made for exposure to UV and the elements, as well.

Prior to the introduction of Spar Urethanes, the best UV protection for wood was Spar Varnish. The urethane product is harder and more element resistant than the varnish product.

 

[QC]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

Thanks Chris. I am building this boat in accordance with Glen-L's Epoxy Encapsulation system and will use the epoxy as an adhesive, a sealer and as the first protective coats. I may in fact use Spar Urethane for the final finish coats as Epoxy is not resistant to UV and is recommended by Glen-L as well although I have referred to it as Varnish. I have some that I am using now for tests. That piece above will have another couple coats of Epoxy on it soon and then I'll start with the final finish coats. I probably have a couple of months before I do the deck and I am going to get experience with the interior ceiling boards etc. prior to what should be the final task other than interior.

Their encapsulation system basically calls for epoxy on every layer and exposed piece of wood. Seems like a great way to insure almost unlimited wood life as it kinda becomes like fiberglass with the wood taking the place of the glass. Do you see the Spar Urethane as capable of replacing the epoxy in all aspects other than adhesive?

 

[drewmitch44]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

In that 2nd picture it looks like you waisted a lot of epoxy resin! Just curious why you would waste that much resin? It seems like a waste to me. I sure enough cant afford that stuff!!

 

[QC]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

Basically because I am stupid . . . I mixed up more than I should've. I was considering doing some slopping around inside the hull and ended up doing a snowboard repair and that test patch. Why do you think I am keeping that as a trophy?

I had a boss once that made a plaque/trophy thing out of a burned up piston from an 8" bore diesel. Expensive mistake blowing that engine up, but it was passed around to whoever had most recently failed pushing the envelope. We called it the Engine Destructor Award and it was an honor to receive it . . .

 

[seven up]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

There are not an abundance of threads around here concerning mahogany as a boatbuilding lumber. That is some primo stuff. Whew !

I had to chuckle over your trophy and how we learn stuff. Your techniques of complete encapsulation of the individual lumber pieces will certainly yield a durable endproduct.

Have you tried the 1:1 epoxy ? It's the most flexible after curing from what I've read. But thick. After reading and reading on assorted forums I've settled on thinning the 1:1 up to 100% with laquer thinner for sealing. Sort of a CPES substitute. Not a good formula for laminating though. What does Glen-L recommend ?

What are you building if you don't mind my asking ?

Well, I gotta say again, That is some fantastic boat building lumber.


Enjoy

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

QC - I can see epoxy resin as a sealer on a lot of non-oily woods, but expect it to be a problem on teak and mohagany. I am curious if Glen-L specifies using it on mohagny, or are they mum on the subject?

Years ago a friend has one of those old mohagny runabout boats. It was beautiful with teh yellow lead between the deck boards and a nice fiberglass skin on the bottom. Eventhough he trailered the boat, that flberglass skin kept falling off. He never could get a good bond.

 

[QC]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

Glen-L specifically recommends epoxy resin with Mahogany . . . Most of the builders over there are doing something with Mahogany decks etc. and they recommend Mahogany for everything except stringers. Here is the thread where I described this project. I am basically completing somebody else's project. Technically there were two of them before me on this boat . . . Monaco

I have changed my color scheme etc. to this now and its why I am asking about the color against navy.

 

[DJ]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

QC,

The boat, in the picture, is truly "classic/classy". That would be VERY nice.

 

[QC]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

It's a Blackbird. Built new in Canada and they sell for $150K Same Cold Mold construction technique as Glen-L recommends, layered wood with Epoxy adhesive and encapsulation.

 

[seven up]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

I have changed my color scheme etc. to this now and its why I am asking about the color against navy.

So then I'll just comment on your question at hand and save the rest for another time.

Your epoxy is dark amber. You could look for an epoxy which is closer to water clear when mixed. The mahogany will be darkened by your current epoxy and uv protection but I would opinionate that the color combo is fine. Dockside the grain will be obvious.

Enjoy

 

[QC]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

The epoxy is Glen-L's standard "Poxy Shield" with the slow hardner, 5:1. They are reasonably close to my home, so I went over, visited for a bit, asked questions and felt like I needed to buy something . . .

 

[LeftFeild]

Re: Epoxy on wood, color, newbie stuff

I can find no reason why you are trying to increase the strength of the hull from the outside, can you elaborate please. Maybe Glenn L. can

The outer side's of a wood boat such as your's,only serve a asthectic quality. If it was my boat i would work from the inside out, that is glass the boat from the inside not the out side. Some one has it backward's maybe Glenn.