Dude, Where's My Civil War?

[steamboatwilly]

Re: Dude, Where's My Civil War?

Boomyal,Now Im confused.Have YOU turned against Bush? Just kidding.hehe.

 

[dogsdad]

Re: Dude, Where's My Civil War?

My nephew is home from Iraq for a little while---he has been in Baghdad the last four months. I will talk to him this afternoon. I will pass on the gist of what he tells me.

 

[QC]

Re: Dude, Where's My Civil War?

Thanks dogsdad. That is what we need, first hand info from someone without an agenda . . .

 

[dogsdad]

Re: Dude, Where's My Civil War?

Okay, it's Sunday morning. I saw my nephew yesterday. Here is the gist of what he said:<br /><br />Yes, there is a "civil war." He says every night, the troublemakers come out and fight each other. There is no sign that the general populace is willing to engage in the festivities. The "civil war" is more like rival gangs going at each other in an urban setting under cover of darkness.<br /><br />The Americans are highly regarded by the majority of the people. He has contact mostly with Sunnis and says that he thinks the Shiites are more accepting than the Sunnis.<br /><br />He also told me he thinks that the Iraqis just want peace, and that they don't care who's running the place. When I pressed him with the extremely high Iraqi voter turnout as a counter to that statement, he had no real argument to back his opinion. I don't have a sense of what he was saying or why.<br /><br />I tried to fish more out of him, but he's taken a stance of remaining focused on his own little realm and refraining from forming an opinion of the higher leadership. He seems to have the traditional enlisted man's skepticism for the senior officers' competence, but has the highest regards for the leadership of the NCOs.<br /><br />When asked if we are winning, the answer was a resounding YES. When I pressed him for a prediction for how it's all going to turn out, he declined to give an opinion, again choosing to keep his focus on the locale he can influence for survival's sake.<br /><br />It was really good to see him. As I expected, he's got a little different look in the eyes now that he's seen and participated in some of the fighting. I could tell that when it comes to the subject of eliminating the bad guys, he lights up in a way that's hard to describe.<br /><br />He goes back in a few days. I loaned him a Leupold scope set up in a mount for an M-16 or M-4, and told him he absolutely, positively must bring it back and return it to me himself. <br /><br />So, I got it straight from one of our finest and related to everyone here as faithfully as my somewhat beer-soaked memory will allow.

 

[QC]

Re: Dude, Where's My Civil War?

Interesting. Sounds a lot like the guy's opinion from the story link . . . <br /><br />

Originally posted by dogsdad:<br /> So, I got it straight from one of our finest and related to everyone here as faithfully as my somewhat beer-soaked memory will allow.

Can't ask for much more than that Tell him thank you and that we are thinking about him. Let us know how he likes the scope . . .

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Dude, Where's My Civil War?

Interesting. Sounds a lot like the guy's opinion from the story link . . .

Not hardly QC. You need to find your own Iraqi Freedom vet and sit a spell with him. They aren't willing to give up their body armor yet. <br /><br />Are you not aware of Rumsfeld's new strategy announced approx. 6-10 weeks ago? Part of it was to spin more positive storys out of Iraq. Some would call this propaganda. <br /><br />So how would you explain that not even a month ago Bush, Rice, and the US Ambassaduer to Iraq all sweating bullets over a possible civil war? Others would call this reality. <br /><br /> http://famulus.msnbc.com/famulusintl/ap02-24-070603.asp?reg=europe&vts=22420060727#body <br /><br />BTW, from those of us that were in the military; the areas that allow for posturing for photo op's and joy riding were know as LZ's (Liberated Zones)and are extremly well rehersed.

 

[QC]

Re: Dude, Where's My Civil War?

Skinny,<br /><br />I am only commenting on what I posted and what dogsdad's nephew said. I thought they sounded similar. Sorry?

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Dude, Where's My Civil War?

What that young hero declined to speculate on and the "story" you posted contain greater differences than similarties.<br /><br />No need to feel sorry, your topic.

Dude, Where's My Civil War?

So how would you explain that not even a month ago Bush, Rice, and the US Ambassaduer to Iraq all sweating bullets over a possible civil war?

 

[PW2]

Re: Dude, Where's My Civil War?

I don't know.<br /><br />The very fact that he is still fighting, and in harm's way, does not speak well to the progress being made, IMO.<br /><br />"Victory" in my view, is not necessarily an end to the violence, but when the Iraqi military and police force can on their own keep the violence under control, and the leaders form a consensus gov't that the majority of the people can get behind. That is as much a political victory as a military one, and I'm not at all sure military folks are the ones to ask.

 

[QC]

Re: Dude, Where's My Civil War?

Dude, it was the title of the link I posted.<br /><br />Nobody ever said that the risk of a Civil War was non-existent. In fact the author noted that it is still a possibility . . .<br /><br />

The country may still see a civil war one day. But not just yet, thanks. Violence continues. A roadside bomb was found in the next sector to the west. There will be more deaths, including some of our own troops. But Baghdad's vibrant life has not been killed. And the people of Iraq just might surprise us all.

Sometimes it is refreshing to hear (read) optimism instead of the incessant pessimism that IMHO is, at least in part, fueled by hatred of Bush and hatred of war, any war. I also think the negative press is inherently racist. It is inconceivable to them that Iraqi's understand, deserve and even want the same freedoms that they themselves enjoy. Personally, I see these people as equally deserving of the life that many of us take for granted.