Dog training (Update)

[QC]

Considering BoatBouy's topic I am gonna start off with little to no controversy. The little tiny bit of possible controversy is that this probably belongs in non-Boating Tech topics . . .<br /><br />We have a Lab who is a Frisbee a-holic. I have worked with him since he was a puppy and he is very good . . . for about 5 minutes. He will run out, retrieve and return the Fris perfectly and then he starts to slip. Basically as time goes on he progressively fights harder and harder about releasing it to me. For the first few throws, absolutely flippin' perfect, then he gives a little extra tug on it before he lets go and then it goes downhill fast from there. I have tried everything: we took a month off, I stop after 5 throws and give him extra treats, I have twisted his ears until he screams, I have rolled around on the ground in a full-on fight for control of the "F", I usually win, but it is a VERY shallow victory.<br /><br />Sometimes I think he simply knows the end of the fun is coming and he knows it won't stop if he has the "F". Sometimes I think he is just tired and he doesn't know what to do with himself.<br /><br />Thoughts?

 

[alden135]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Originally posted by QC:<br /> I have twisted his ears until he screams, <br /><br />Thoughts?

My thoughts are that you have recieved training in one of GW's secret overseas prisons. <br /><br /><br />Wait.........my phone is clicking now.<br /><br />Is that you QC?<br /><br />No post goes unpunished

 

[QC]

Re: Dog training (Update)

I told you I was gonna set up a hotkey for this: LOL @ Alden . . . <br /><br />Edit: BTW, I understand that the ears twisting thing is what hunting dog trainers recommend. It is nothing but abuse when it comes to this dog; he just won't let go when he's done.

 

[Bob_VT]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Go here and look for their book....<br /><br /> http://www.newsketemonks.com/guesthouse.htm <br /><br />We have used it and it works very good with our lab. I am lucky I actually live pretty close to the place.<br /><br />Happy Holidays!

 

[deputydawg]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Sounds like the pup is getting bored with the game. Starting to act up to get a reaction from you. The reaction adds to the fun of the game, if not that then the tug of war adds to the fun of the game.<br />Most dogs are hard to train from bordom, and no amount of disciplin will get them interested. Find new ways to make it fun for the dog.<br /><br />Just an idea...

 

[QC]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Originally posted by deputydawg:<br /> Sounds like the pup is getting bored with the game. Starting to act up to get a reaction from you.

This may be, but this dog cares more about Frisbee than anything else in the world. He stalks me around the house to play, stares at me sooo deep it is scary. I still think that he is worried that he will have to give it back.<br /><br />I have heard of some Frisbee guys that just leave the Fris with the dog 100% of the time. They even serve their food in it. Seems backwards to me and this dog will chew a Frisbee into 300 pieces if I left it with him.

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Find a treat he likes and train him to release to a treat.<br />Then slowly make him release more for the treat etc.<br />Works for me on Shepards and Rotts.

 

[heycods]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Originally posted by alden:<br />

Originally posted by QC:<br /> I have twisted his ears until he screams, <br /><br />Thoughts?

My thoughts are that you have recieved training in one of GW's secret overseas prisons. <br /><br /><br />Naaaa hes a democrat . remember LBJ used to pick his beagles up by the ears. Media raised He!! about it. <br /><br /><br />]

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Dog training (Update)

How old is the pup? I have four dogs. When they refuse to release after a retrieve, I end the game. No more throwing the toy. Thankfuly, they all grew out of it.

 

[QC]

Re: Dog training (Update)

RF,<br /><br />It's the infamous Bear in Chair, he is 5 years old.<br /><br />I have tried the game gets shorter thing, and he just starts the refusal gig earlier, like after three throws. Again, he lives for this game and releases perfectly for up to 10 throws, when I shorten it, he shortens his span before holding on for dear life. I have tried playing until he's about to drop dead, I have tried lite tugging, I have tried release without looking at him. All of these things work until he says he's done. When he starts a little tuggin' I guarantee the won't-release-period-thing starts in two more throws.<br /><br />I have even tried treats for every release . . . he spits out treats if I am holding the Frisbee. This one is a puzzler. He's almost like a shark with their eyes rolled back in their heads . . . err, maybe that's laser beams attached to their heads? . . . hmmmmm.

 

[Reel Poor]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Im thinkin he likes tug-of-war better than fetch. How mant times would you go get something someone keeps throwing away, everytime you bring it back??? <br /><br />Switch toys on him..Throw two different Frizbee's. Make him "drop" the first before you throw the second. Sort of a Frizbee rotation.

 

[QC]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Originally posted by Reel Poor:<br />Throw two different Frizbee's. Make him "drop" the first before you throw the second. Sort of a Frizbee rotation.

I will try that. Makes as much sense as anything I have done before. This dog is VERY trainable, with this one exception, so maybe this will work.<br /><br />Thanks.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Just say no. He knows what he's supposed to do but tug o' war is just sooooo much fun it's too tempting. Treat it as you would with any other command he didn't follow. Don't give him any positive reinforcement until he releases. Keep saying "no" til he complies.

 

[QC]

Re: Dog training (Update)

jtex,<br /><br />Waaaaaayy past that. I have stood out there with an emphatic "leave it" (that's our command) for a half hour solid. That's when we end up rolling on the ground . . . This is not "fun" for him. You can tell he hates it, he just won't give it to me. He acts like he is almost embarassed.

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Maybe he is gettng physically tired/sore. Have you had his hips looked at?

 

[QC]

Re: Dog training (Update)

I used to think he was just tired, but I don't think it is a physical thing. He is very agile, fast etc. Our other one has some physical issues and she is a slug compared to him.<br /><br />The reason I now discount tired though is that when I have experimented with shorter and shorter sessions, he just starts doing the tug earlier in the session. I tend to think it is a control thing. He knows the end is coming and he can control that by not letting me have it when he senses the end is near.

 

[tylerin]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Read the book "Smart Fetch" by Evan Graham. Best on the market for force fetching your dog.

 

[QC]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Originally posted by tylerin:<br />force fetching

I'll look into the book, thanks. What is "force fetching"?

 

[tylerin]

Re: Dog training (Update)

QC, it's a process of a dog being forced to fetch, even when they don't desire to. You would think that a retriever wouldn't need this process, but under certain hunting situations they do. I'm sure that's where your ear pinch method was taken from. Ear pinch will be the first process and then can be transfered to an e-collar if so desired. i have 2 waterfowl dogs at the house and besides basic obedience the next step is to "Force Fetch" your dog. they do it alot to pointer and flushing dogs that don't have near the desire to retrieve as a Lab. Once a dog is force fetched all other aspects of training become simple. I hope this helps.

 

[QC]

Re: Dog training (Update)

Tylerin,<br /><br />Yeah, could help. You noticed that he is awesome when we start each session? He is absolutely picture perfect, he almost throws me the Fris on the first 2 or 3 retrieves . . . Still sound like a case for the force fetch routine?