Crankcase breather squirting oil

skipjack27

Petty Officer 3rd Class
Joined
Oct 6, 2009
Messages
79
Re: Crankcase breather squirting oil

I've just got the detailed results for the compression test that was performed on the engine:

1 = 232psi
2 = 247
3 = 283
4 = 283
5 = 232
6 = 276

If these figures look curiously similar (i.e., 1 and 5, 3 and 4), it's because the values provided to me were in bars to the nearest integer and I had to convert to psi (yes, we hate these measures, too - one of the stupidest things Australia ever did was to go metric).

The report reads: "found vertical scoring evident and cylinders polished (no cross-hatching)".

What do people think about this? Is this engine seriously "tired", or is it likely to limp along for a while?

Jeff
 

Bondo

Moderator
Staff member
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70,986
Re: Crankcase breather squirting oil

The report reads: "found vertical scoring evident and cylinders polished (no cross-hatching)".

Ayuh,... That sounds like it's in "Need of Repairs"....
 

HT32BSX115

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
10,083
Re: Crankcase breather squirting oil

That engine is seriously worn out......I'm surprised that it starts easily.........


I don't have a VP service manual, so I did a little searching around and it appears that 320psi is the service limit for that engine (assuming you have "good" cranking speed) .....

btw, 320psi= 22.1 BAR

You can usually make up for it a little with turbo-supercharging once it'sall warmed up...........so that may be why you don't have a LOT of smoke.

But it IS why you have a LOT of blow-by.

I would replace, rebuild, or dump it.


Sorry about that....


Rick
 

skipjack27

Petty Officer 3rd Class
Joined
Oct 6, 2009
Messages
79
Re: Crankcase breather squirting oil

Thanks, guys. Not what I wanted to hear, but perhaps what I needed to hear.

It looks like a winter rebuild is on the cards. It's the height of summer here in the southern hemisphere, and so I'll run her around all summer and decide how much I like the boat, how long I want to keep her, and how much I think it's reasonable to spend on a rebuild.

I think the 23k I was quoted for a rebuild was little more than daylight robbery. Here's something you may find interesting: on the last slip, these mechanics told me the trim cylinders on the leg needed to be replaced (true - they were leaking oil whenever the trim was adjusted). They charged me $2151 Aussie dollars for the kit to replace the cylinders (the Aussie dollar is currently almost exactly equivalent to the US$). On the internet, I find that I could have gotten the same kit from the US for A$975, and for A$738 from Europe. So, guess where I'm going to start looking for the bits and pieces needed for a rebuild?

On discussion with one of the more sympathetic, realistic, and knowledgeable mechanics in the firm I've been using, he indicated that $23k was the outside limit, and that a good rebuild could be done by them for around $17k. I suspect that avoiding this firm altogether and going with someone smaller and hungrier - and organising the import of parts myself - that this rebuild could be done for something in the range of $10-15K. Compare that to my experience in slipping the boat a few months ago for routine maintenance and being presented with a bill for $9,400! Not to mention the approximate $10k I spent some months earlier in having this firm cure my overheating problem.

So, rebuild: where is thy sting?

Jeff
 

HT32BSX115

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
10,083
Re: Crankcase breather squirting oil

Wow,

I am confused and since I don't ever fool with VP equipment I don't really know a LOT about volvo "stuff" so I'll probably just stay confused......:rolleyes:

I found Volvo Penta trim cyl rebuild kits for about $40 on ebay. and some trim cyls for around $400 etc....(that's $800 for 2)

There must be something special about trim cyls "Down-under". You would have to haul the boat to do it and if you don't have a trailer, that would be included in the labor charge I suppose......

It appears your old ones probably weren't rebuildable....... but $2100+ for new trim cyls seems a little high in my book......

Also, you might consider finding another engine. Here's one in NZ with an asking price of $10,000 NZD I donno what the shipping, customs, VAT, Sales TAX, GOVT tax, local TAX, AUS tax, NZ tax, UN TAX, and other taxes would be......(don't you just LOVE govt?) ........but you might be able to get some sort of a deal though on a possibly good running engine. (actually it didn't sell so they relisted it for $8000 starting)

Good luck......it sounds like you're going to need it!



Rick
 

skipjack27

Petty Officer 3rd Class
Joined
Oct 6, 2009
Messages
79
Re: Crankcase breather squirting oil

Thanks for those very interesting snippets of information, Rick. I think, in one message, you've changed my whole outlook on how to approach the care and feeding of my engine. That stuff you dug up on the trim cylinders is a bit devastating. The $40 Ebay kits are actually only for the seals - not the whole kit. But it is quite likely that it was only the seals that needed replacing. That, certainly, was the presenting problem that lead to them looking at the trim cylinders (I told the mechanics that oil was appearing on the water whenever I tested the trim mechanism in the pen, and they said that would be a seal problem). From what I've read, replacing the rest of the "guts" of the trim cylinders would only be necessary if there was scoring or other damage - which there may, or may not, have been.

In any event, $2151 is a heck of a price to pay for those internal bits (see http://www.seapower.com.au/products...imming-cylind-k/trimming-cylind-k-872612.aspx).

That engine you located in NZ is interesting - perhaps suspiciously so! $NZ 8000 equals $A 6,100 (and almost the same for $US). So, it would cost me about one quarter the price to buy that engine than to have my current engine rebuilt in line with the quote I received from my mechanics. That, of course, neglects the other costs of getting it here. But as a second-hand engine, I doubt that there would be much in the way of applicable taxes, duties, etc. The main cost would be shipping.

Tempting. But after having my eyes opened - largely by you - to the alternatives in respect of parts, I would be surprised if I couldn't organise a decent rebuild of my present engine for less than half of the quoted $23k. I've already found a reputedly competent, and much cheaper, mechanic to do the work.

This is my first diesel, and I'm still coming to terms with it. With my earlier gasoline boat engines, you were left in no doubt about an engine being tired. Impossible to start - especially in cold weather, from cold; idling and low speed performance positively dangerous when trying to dock - repeated conking; consumption of (almost!) more oil than fuel; exhaust smoke belching from everywhere (not just the exhaust). And so on. Now I find I've inherited a diesel that has far worse compression problems than any gasoline engine I've owned - but is impossible to fault (apart from the crankcase breather problem). I've said this several times before, but I'll say it again: here is an engine that has cylinders around 100psi below the service limit and yet: starts instantly every time in the most freezing weather we get; idles smoothly and NEVER conks; uses essentially no oil at all (when not ejected from the breather); emits no exhaust smoke of any colour (other than the white smoke on startup characteristic of this model); and pushes the boat along very satisfactorily at high speed. If I hadn't found oil being ejected from the crankcase breather, I would never have had any cause to suspect that this wasn't a very healthy engine.

Frankly, I'm puzzled. Apparently, having only owned gasoline engines before, everything I know is wrong and I've got a steep learning curve ahead of me.

Jeff
 

redjmp

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Mar 16, 2005
Messages
536
Re: Crankcase breather squirting oil

Myself, I would be tempted into purchasing the Volvo sleeve kits for 5 or 600 per hole and rebuild it myself.
I once had a Cornbinder straight truck with a DT 466 diesel in it that I rebuilt....

Anyways after an expensive tow to the shop and being quoted 10k for a rebuild, I decided to do it myself.

Apart from the extra weight of all the bigger parts, it was actually an easy rebuild.

I did not need to pull the engine at all, but was able to just pull the oil pan which afforded access to the crank and rods.

After removing the rod bolts and the head, I was able to remove the wet sleeve cylinders complete with pistons/rods, and replace with new ones.

No machine shop needed!

Done in a day!

The biggest cost was to get my injectors and fuel pump rebuilt at a cost of almost $3000.
I got robbed there because I needed to have it done right away as I was a trucker and needed my truck right away.
If I had the luxury of time, I could have shipped it off to a shop in the "Big" city who could have done it for much less..
Total bill was less than 5K Cdn when our dollar was trading around $.65 US but it is now over par which would translate into about $3200.

Obviously, your dealer is gouging you because he can due to the booming economy...
 

HT32BSX115

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
10,083
Re: Crankcase breather squirting oil

In any event, $2151 is a heck of a price to pay for those internal bits (see http://www.seapower.com.au/products/...-k-872612.aspx).
That would be the Volvo Penta Retail price probably! Most likely the highest price around!!

There might even be parts available from Sealed Power, Hastings, or other after market piston and ring manufacturers that will almost ALWAYS be cheaper than OEM Volvo Penta parts.

It may even be possible to have your liners bored oversize and obtain new after market pistons and rings etc.... depending on how they're installed however, you may have to have them bored in the block. (it's possible to bore some liners out of the block but most machinists might want to bore them in the block to ensure a nice round cyl.) Here's more info on liner honing. http://khup.com/view/0_keyword-cylinder-liner-manufacturing-process/cylinder-liner-application.html

In any case, you will probably have to haul the boat out and pull the engine yourself if you want to save......diesels are not all that complicated..... they don't run on "magic" either. Clean fuel, compression and (injection)timing are most critical.....the rest of it is just a bunch of parts flying around inside just like a gasoline engine!!


Good luck!


Rick
 
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