Closed cooling worth the money?

[Tominator88]

Hello all I am installing a reman 350 vortec in my 241 Grady offshore and am considering closed cooling. the kit that would fit my setup is 2180 that’s a lot of money do you think it’s even a consideration or is it just an obvious no brainer I’ve considered used but their are so many kits available it’s hard to tell if I’ll get the right one

 

[Scott Danforth]

It's a no brainer as you put it. Yes it's worth it

 

[Scott06]

If in salt water yes especially if you get a full system to do manifolds too. If yo are in fresh like me not worth it

 

[Chris1956]

Gee, what does the repower cost? Remanufactured I/O engines are pretty cheap. I/O engines should last 20 years if raw water cooled in salt water. The manifolds and risers rot out after 10 years or so.

Usually FWC systems on V engines cool the risers with raw water. If you are considering that kind of system, you will still need to replace your risers every 10 years. So, in my mind, the trade off is cost of the FWC system, vs buying manifolds every 10 years, assuming the risers are raw water cooled and will need to be replaced every 10 years. Also, what is life span of heat exchanger? That would also be part of the trade off cost.

 

[Lou C]

For sure in salt water, it will extend engine life by a significant amount because the cyl heads will not be likely to rust through after 10-15 years of use. Usually the blocks don't at least I've never heard of anyone having a block rot through here but I have heard of a few cyl heads rotting through behind the valve seats. When I took mine apart the cooling passages of the cyl heads were getting eroded and no telling how thin the cast iron was behind the valve seats.
Freshwater, well if I have the choice of winterizing by doing it the way I always have (a pain, take out rear seats to get out the dang block drains) or, simply hooking up a pressurized winterizing tank and running the motor, & fogging it, I'd say it's worth every penny.
If you can use a full system, a pair of Barr manifolds which I consider good aftermarket is about $600. I have to replace the whole system usually every 7 years, so less time to winterize it every year, only having to replace the elbows (about $430 the pair), longer engine life and better resale would make me do it personally.
My engine in my 21 years of salt water use is on it's 4th exhaust system! The OEM batwings, 2 replacement batwings, and the OMC/Volvo 2 piece conversion.
BTW, GM designed these engines to run with a pressurized cooling system with antifreeze. They will last longer that way. Even in fresh water you can get sand, silt and crud in the bottom of the block passages which can clog the block drains.

 

[dingbat]

IMHO, FWC isn't worth the money.

Saltwater, keep in a slip with limited us and never flushed, maybe under extenuating circumstances.

Saltwater trailer boat, limited use, flushed after use, you'll never recover the hardware cost, let alone the labor involved in the maintenance and upkeep

Would rather changed manifolds every 10 - 15 years than worry/deal with maintaining and winterizing a cooling system. Much prefer trimming up and down a couple of times at the end of the season and call it good for the winter

 

[tpenfield]

FWC kits have gone up in price over the past 10 years, but still worth the money. I've owned 3 I/O boats in salt water . . . the first one was raw water cooled and died a painful death at 20 years. The other 2 with FWC will probably live forever.

Make sure what ever kit you add is a Full closed cooling system. Replacing exhaust manifolds every 7 years is no bargain either.

 

[Lou C]

FWC kits have increased in price but so have new long blocks (very substantial like close to double) and reman units.
If I keep this boat long enough to repower it, I am going to look into a full system. Don't know if my Cobra impeller provides enough flow for a full system though. I know the OMC/Volvo style manifolds I have can't be set up for full closed (they need to have an inlet on the bottom and outlet on the top) but I might look into trial fitting a pair of Merc style dry joint manifolds. If I can borrow a pair to see if they would work with my OMC/Volvo down pipe. I think the angles are the same, or close....
Just being able to easily winterize without pulling the seats out, no more sticky thermostats due to sand, etc, no more clogged block drains, only having to change the elbows instead of the whole exhaust, to me it's worth it.

 

[Lou C]

IMHO, FWC isn't worth the money.

Saltwater, keep in a slip with limited us and never flushed, maybe under extenuating circumstances.

Saltwater trailer boat, limited use, flushed after use, you'll never recover the hardware cost, let alone the labor involved in the maintenance and upkeep

Would rather changed manifolds every 10 - 15 years than worry/deal with maintaining and winterizing a cooling system. Much prefer trimming up and down a couple of times at the end of the season and call it good for the winter

here your exhaust will not last 10-15 years, by approx 8-10 years your elbows will have rotted through and let salt water into a cyl. And if it sits more than a few days, it's done.
Under the best circumstances the elbows last approx 8 years, maybe a year or 2 longer. However they can last less than that. The manifolds might last longer however, if they are wet joint style even if not rotted through anywhere, the sealing surface maybe so compromised (pitted) the gasket between the elbow and manifold won't seal and will let salt water into a cyl.
First pic, these are the dry joints, which don't allow water from the cooling passage into the exhaust gas passage but they still rot out. Unless the owner removed the rubber exhaust hose, they would have thought they were still OK.
Second pic is my OMC batwings after 5.5 years in salt, not rotted thru yet but one exhaust passage is clogged, and the cast iron wall thickness was getting thin....

 

[dingbat]

here your exhaust will not last 10-15 years, by approx 8-10 years your elbows will have rotted through and let salt water into a cyl. And if it sits more than a few days, it's done.
Under the best circumstances the elbows last approx 8 years, maybe a year or 2 longer. However they can last less than that. The manifolds might last longer however, if they are wet joint style even if not rotted through anywhere, the sealing surface maybe so compromised (pitted) the gasket between the elbow and manifold won't seal and will let salt water into a cyl.
First pic, these are the dry joints, which don't allow water from the cooling passage into the exhaust gas passage but they still rot out. Unless the owner removed the rubber exhaust hose, they would have thought they were still OK.
Second pic is my OMC batwings after 5.5 years in salt, not rotted thru yet but one exhaust passage is clogged, and the cast iron wall thickness was getting thin...

Guess the OE risers on my first and last I/O bucked the odds going on 10 years when I sold it.

Putting 150-200 hours a year and flushing after each outing (trailer boat) probably helped.

After running outboards for the past 25 years, want nothing to do with an I/O. Far too much work to maintain.

 

[Pmt133]

The freshwater kit helps extend the season too. Usually just have to drain the exchanger if you're into that kind of stuff... not that it's hard to pull the plugs normally but one point is easier... Not as easy as an outboard... but still better.

 

[Lou C]

On an inline 4 it wouldn't be hard to reach but the block drains on a V6 or V8 are a real pain. Thought of a few ways of extending them with a length of hose that could be rodded out.
If I replace this boat for sure it will be 4 stroke outboard for low maintenance.
I see ob boats left in the water all year and every year they start up and run! Here's a pic from the other day, very cold out in Eaton's Neck Long Island.

 

[Tominator88]

Thanks for all the input their is an excellent boat salvage yard in Quincy Ma mass marine parts I think I’ll look around their first not sure if the value is their to spend 2200 but it’s close and sounds like life could be easier with it and I could avoid a breakdown or a bad spring opening my boat to find it with with a cracked block thanks again