Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

Joined
Sep 26, 2010
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256
Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

There is another example. 12.4 is not fully charged, and keeping it on a charger so the battery wouldn't drain is what masked the problem.



Sorry to hear about your injury, but how am I or anyone else supposed to know that ?????? Since this is a forum, and there is only what is typed in a message, we have to assume you are saying what you believe to be true.

I just don't think it would be right to ask everyone if they have a tramatic brain injury before we get into their mechanical problem ????? I could just see how that would go.

earlier in the post I mentioned that so people would underssand that I have trouble explaining it
 
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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

There is another example. 12.4 is not fully charged, and keeping it on a charger so the battery wouldn't drain is what masked the problem.

Well from my training in the military a battery at 12.4 volts is acceptable and more then enough to crank an engine. then again sometimes the military does do things half arse backwards haha
 

Aloysius

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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

"certified" mechanic doesn't impress me..sorry. kinda like learning to make love from a book. some things are learned from experience AND understanding how stuff works. And time.

Diagnostics simply escape some people.
 
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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

I cant seem to find any documents online saying disconnecting the neg terminal is bad hmmm I trust you guys just want to know more about it. Why its bad? if you wouldnt mind explaining to me
 

Alpheus

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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

You shouldn't disconnect the battery while the engine is running. You are doing what is called a 'load dump'. The voltage from the alternator can spike up towards 100 volts or so for a split second. Basically the electrons need somewhere to go and if you take away the battery, the voltage (pressure) just builds up until something pops. Usually the electronic ignition system or the alternator itself.

I know it used to be an old shade tree mechanic way of testing an alternator but that was before the days of the electronic this or that...
 
Joined
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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

You shouldn't disconnect the battery while the engine is running. You are doing what is called a 'load dump'. The voltage from the alternator can spike up towards 100 volts or so for a split second. Basically the electrons need somewhere to go and if you take away the battery, the voltage (pressure) just builds up until something pops. Usually the electronic ignition system or the alternator itself.

I know it used to be an old shade tree mechanic way of testing an alternator but that was before the days of the electronic this or that...


Hmmmm well thats good to know. I have heard of the method of testing an altenator like that but never tried it myself but glad to know that now thanks!!!
 

Don S

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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

That test was for the generators, not alternators.
 

NHGuy

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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

Hey USS, I just read your thread & I for one am glad you have a resolution. I too don't like disconnecting the negative cable. It's easy to see what your alt is doing on a boat, there's a gauge for volts and you can put a meter on there to get amps. No reason to disconnect things that are designed to stay connected. It just chances back feeds and wrong "loops" in the boat charging system. The mechanic who disconnected your battery was testing it old school. He could have just looked at the volt meter and seen the drop in voltage when the motor was run. So when you boat runs now do you show 14.3 or so volts? That's what you want.

Thank you for your service to our country.
 
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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

thankyou everyone for the help with my issue I will try to take the old alternator to an auto parts store to test the old alt to let you know what was wrong
 

Aloysius

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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

Generators..had to polarize them to make them charge.

Only old farts know about generators..........

Voltage spikes are instantly lethal to anything digital. The auto industry goes to great lengths to avoid any kind of spike or pulse in their circuitry, even static electricity.
 

Aloysius

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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

Forgot to mention...an alternator normally provides "alternating DC" current. The diode bank provides this conversion from AC to DC. A defective diode bank allows "AC ripple"..an alternating current (AC) in the output of the alternator. This confuses some voltage readings, and doesn't provide any useful output. with a defective diode bank, the alternator will usually whine and get hot.
 

Joshua Nichols

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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

Generators..had to polarize them to make them charge.

Only old farts know about generators..........

Voltage spikes are instantly lethal to anything digital. The auto industry goes to great lengths to avoid any kind of spike or pulse in their circuitry, even static electricity.

Dang I am getting old.. Use to call it flashing the generator.. Was a tractor mechanic.. Lots of them still going..

Anyhow I have followed this tread for a while.. Something is fishy.. replacing the alt repaired the problem???.
 
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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

Yes, I am not fully understanding why a bad alternator was causing my engine to not run in the correct 8 degrees time too lol. I can see how a bad alternator would kill the ignition if the battery was dead but my battery had pleanty of charge the entire time. go figure lol
 

Jeepster04

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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

The battery may of had plenty of charge but did you ever check the voltage while the engine was running? If the voltage was too low the firing of the electronic ignition was probably way off.. Thus causing it to run on weird timing.

You explained everything better than some people can.
 
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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

The battery may of had plenty of charge but did you ever check the voltage while the engine was running? If the voltage was too low the firing of the electronic ignition was probably way off.. Thus causing it to run on weird timing.

You explained everything better than some people can.


Thank you that makes alot of sence to me :)
 
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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

ok still not right but not sure if its cause the alternator is not there, had to take it out got a rebuilt one and it crapped out. so alternator is not there anymore. yet again lol and it might just be that it is causing not quite enough power to get to the coil (its night and hard to diagnose lol)
but I got it so It will run at 8 degrees btdc is that the right timing for a thunderbolt IV ignition? and when I try to rev it up it wants to crap out on me and pop back through the carb it seems to idle ok missing here and there but still idling, it will not start at 8 degrees but it will start at about 10 degrees, (more then what it did with the old alternator on) and idle better and rev better but still a pop here and there through the carb. My thoughts are I dont have the alternator on and it might be the reason, but I also was wondering if it could be a bad coil? and maybe the optic trigger inside the dist? any thoughts? Let me go over one more time what I have done so far


New dist cap
New rotor
new plug wires
new plugs gaped to .040
coil is about 2 months old
checked mechanical timing and its perfect dist has no play so that rules out loose timing chain
I have gone over plug wires to corisponding cylinders on dist cap
rebuilt carb
new fuel pump
fuel tank vent not clogged
fuel check valve replaced
fuel lines all are good shape
fuel tank has been drained and cleaned fresh fuel put in
cant remember what else
 

NHGuy

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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

Dude, wait til the alt is on the boat and the battery is full charge, preferably overnight on a three step charger. Then pump the gas a couple of times to prime the carb and allow the choke to set. Now crank her for a start. Keep a hand on the gas til she settles, just run her at 1200 or 1500 rpm til warm.
Oh and do this with the drive down and either on muffs or in water.
Sorry to go basic, just makin sure.
Don't chance screwing up your boat by running it any more without the alternator, if any wires touch the wrong thing, you get trouble. Until after the alternator is in the boat you MUST leave the battery disconnected. Just take off the negative terminal.
Hang in there it's almost fixed. I think!
 

ChrisCraftJohnny

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

Soldier,

First off let me say a HUGE THANK YOU for serving our country! There are still some Americans who know how lucky they are to have brave men like yourself defending our country. Never forget the Vets!

I just want to chime in on your problem. I have the same engine with a Thunderbolt IV. Mine is a 1988. I thought for sure with your's being a 1995 it would have Thunderbolt V. But if you say it's IV, I believe you.

On your timing:

If you have a pointer (on block) and a V-groove/line (on balancer) then that is your 8 deg. In other words, that mark is not Zero. You want to time your engine so that when your timing light flashes, the mark on the balancer meets up with the pointer.

Don't try to set the timing to some imaginary 8 Deg. before the V-goove/line. The V-groove/line IS 8 Deg before top dead center. When setting ignition timing, Zero is useless. Zero is only used for mechanical timing of the Crank/Cam. They have to be set so Zero coincides with their operation.

You must have Advance in ignition timing. Do you know why? The expansion rate of the ignited air/fuel mixture is a constant. Engine RPM however is not. Even at idle the spark has to go off at 8 deg (or so) before top dead center in order for the expansion of the ignited air/fuel mixture to kernal into it's most powerful force. As engine RPM increases, the spark must fire sooner and sooner in the stroke to compensate for the piston moving faster and faster in the bore.

If you are getting any kind of popping and missing, you have something wrong. Get the ALT back on there and then do the following procedure. One thing before you do this. If you bought a SIERRA dizzy cap. Return it and get a real Merc Quicksilver unit. The SIERRA IS JUNK. It will throw the timing off because it's made poorly. Trust me!

1.Start the engine.
2. Forget timing lights and everything technical for right now
3. Loosen the distributor hold down clamp.
4. Turn the distributor counter clockwise until the idle settles down and the engine runs OK.
5. Let it run until it reaches operating temp.
6. Set the idle to the correct speed. On my 4.3, it's 650-700 RPM. DONT USE THE TACH AT THE HELM! Use a correct engine analizer from SEARS or where ever.
7. Once you have the engine running in the correct speed range, take out your timing light and point it at the balancer and the timing pointer.
8. You should be close to the correct timing. Now, from what perspective you look at the pointer can make a bit of a difference. I try to look down and from the right (port) side so that my eyes are in-line with the plane of the pointer.
9. Turn the Dist. base until the timing marks align. Hold here.
10. Check your engine RPM.......it changed didn't it? Reset the engine idle speed back to specs.
11. Check the timing again. Move the Dist. until it's back on the mark.
12. Follow steps 10-11 until you are within specs on both the idle and timing. Lock the dizzy down and check again. It can move.

One more thing. Merc. wants you to set timing so that the balancer mark is to the advance side of the pointer. (just a hair) This is negligible. On the mark to a hair before is fine. You will notice that the mark dances a bit with the flash anyway. This should just be a tiny amount, don't worry about it.

Now open her up to 2000 rpm for a few seconds. If you have no back firing/popping/missing, you have the engine timed correctly. You can also observe the advance when doing this. The timing mark will walk towards the Starboard side of the balancer.

I hope this helps. Thank you for your sevice to our country! Any more questions feel free to ask me.

Johnny.
 
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Re: Cant get mercruiser 4.3 in time!!!!!!!

Thankyou chriscraftjohnny I went to a alternator shop. they are going to repair my original mercruiser alternator they said the voltage regulater was bad, and order a new one for me so I always have a back up and they were much cheeper then the marina. soon as I get it, should be by friday I will print and follow your instructions. I think Im gonna put the boat in the water when i time it. That way I can adjust it like you said and then check it under load. down side I dont have a engine tach to hook up, just then helm tach. I might try to borrow one if my buddy has one.

I thought I had a thunderbolt V ignition too, untill I tried finding the knock sensor by the starter. It wasn't there, and there wasn't the purple white wire for putting the ignition system in I guess what you would call timing mode. So I looked up in my service manual and compaired the two wiring diagrams to conferm what one I had and thunderbolt IV it is. Thankyou everyone for the help I know I was being impatent (dont think I spelled that right lol) but I really want to get the boat on the water!!
 
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