At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

[djzyla1980]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

Ok.. to update on this problem I have. I rebuilt the carbs today and put the puppies back on. I also took a good look at my throttle cable and decided for the $26 it could be changed... to rule out another might be. Got it put back together and this is what I have now running on muffs in driveway.<br /><br />Idled great although there seemed to be a miss every minute or so. After about 4-5 minutes of ideling it would miss then die, start right back up and do the same. Pulled the plug wires one at time to see if there was any change and there was Absolutly no difference with performance no matter what plug wire I pulled. <br /><br />Idle seemed much smoother since rebuild but with a miss.<br /><br />Pulled plugs and took a look and all plugs were the same. looked a bit wet to me though. Loading up maybe? <br /><br />Shoved her in a trash can and started her up. Would not idle worth a damn unless I was sitting back at the "right off the start saftey switch" area and still that wonderful miss. Move the throttle 1/8" and I'm past the starting point. While in the can I decided I would bring the throttle up a bit and see if the miss stayed and it did but was more definate. Like a plug was fouling...then would kick in for 20-30 sec and then foul again. The more I brought the idle up the longer the plugs fired before the short period of miss period of miss. It is definatly not fluctuations in the fuel. It's got to be the ignition. <br />Swapted plugs-no change<br />Pulled Wires one at time-no Change<br />Clean/regapped plugs-no change<br />Spark test showed OK believe it or not..(got's me confused as well)<br /><br />Is it worth me to look at the gap of the Sensor coil under the distributor or does is act like it's something else?? Am I loading up and thats why theres this miss and how do you solve this one?<br /><br />Another thing is why am I playing at the line of the start saftey switch? I think I should be able to idle well below this point. I can get my cables and linkage to move in that direction... Just WILL not start.<br /><br />Any help or ideas would be appreciated

 

[djzyla1980]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

Sorry for another long reply but any help would be appreciated

 

[vranasaurus]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

When you say a miss does it rev up to idle then bogg down then back up and then it does it some times as you increase throttle?<br /><br />My 1989 90 did the same thing. It doesn't do it any more. Things I did had had done since are:<br /><br />Replaced fuel pump<br />Replaced fuel line(Valves in bulb were bad)<br />Had shop do a Link and Sync<br /><br />"Another thing is why am I playing at the line of the start saftey switch? I think I should be able to idle well below this point. I can get my cables and linkage to move in that direction... Just WILL not start."<br /><br />Please Explain<br /><br />Now it idles like a champ(still missing on top end RPM's but that is another story)

 

[vranasaurus]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

Sorry about the double post

 

[djzyla1980]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

When I said I was playing with the line of the start saftey switch I meant this:<br /><br />My lowest throttle movement I could go (meaning pull back on the lever) and get it to run was right at the edge of the switch. (switch in linkage there to keep you from starting with excess throttle) If I moved the throttle ever so slightly 1/8" I was past the starting point and in that excess throttle. <br /><br />It was a miss... not surging in the motor (theres more to this story...lol but when isn't there)<br />I could tell it was a miss because During Idle it sounded like one cylinder was cutting in and out. Would rev up... smoke more then die back down... hearing the motor it was not a smooth operation as in a fuel issue. I was unable to dictate which plug or cylinder for that fact it was. Seemed like it was moving around so that led me to tonight:<br /><br />Tonight I threw a wrench at it(literally I think it was the 1 1/4") and then I started to take it apart. Removed flywheel and everything under it... Took a look at the sensor under the distributor. (it's a sensor not point) and regapped it. It was a little off but I didn't think that much. Couldn't find much else wrong so I put it back together. This is when I noticed something else. I got all the way to the put the key and flywheel back on and noticed there was much play in the flywheel. Took it off and noticed my key was fine but loose. Found a peice of steel laying around a bit thicker and took it to the wheel. Fit snuggly in the slot. Put flywheel back on and movement was about 99% less. Started her up and the once miss is now a less noticable surge. <br />Fuel pump,hoses and tanks are new. I even took the quick connect off the motor housing and ran it direct. <br /><br />I'm thinking that the slot on the flywheel has worn.. allowing play within. By tourqing the flywheel I don't shear keys but I think it is enough to give me a miss. I no longer have this miss when I open it up a bit. And by doing this either the gapping or the key has allowed me to bring the throttle cable back alot more then before. I'm so far happy with the results I currently have but the only way to really tell is to take it to the lake.<br /><br />If someone wants to step in and give there opinion on the Issues please do. I want to know if the small amount of play I have left could indeed be causing my problems or should I look somewhere else. (like the classifieds)<br /><br />Once again sorry about the long reply, theres alot goin on.

 

[tr918]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

Make sure that your "made on the spur of the moment flywheel key" is not stronger than the flywheel or crankshaft slots. Remember it should shear. A sloppy flywheel key can mess with the timming. Good luck.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

There was a bulletin out long ago that said you can eliminate the throttle safty start switch. Just remove it and ground the wire. You still have the neutral safty switch.<br /><br />What did you set the sensor gap to?<br /><br />There was a change in the sensor ring. One with wide gaps and one with narrow. Make sure you have the updated one.

 

[djzyla1980]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

Sensor gap was set to .28 Which is what the manual states, as well as it is stamped on the sensor itself. How would I know if I have the updated sensor?<br /><br />I'll have to disconect that switch.... It's kinda a pain anyways.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

I cant remember which was the updated sensor. A dealer should have the bulletins. Or if they happen to have one in stock it should be the updated one. Maybe Joe or somebody here can remember.

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

I couldn't find the bulletin right off hand but if memory serves me right, it wasn't the sensor that was updated, it was the metal rotor. If I find the bulletin, I'll update this reply.<br /><br />The original metal rotor had a gal of roughly 3/8". The new improved metal rotor had a gap of roughly 1/2".<br /><br />I've had engines run perfectly with either rotor, but have also had some engines that required the wider gap model.

 

[ledgefinder]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

I thought the updated sensor & ring were a matched pair - that is, use the old ring with the old sensor, & the new ring with the new sensor. That's according to the Rapair literature. <br /><br />Dave, DHadley & JoeReeves are the most experienced people on the board, so take anything I have to say with a grain of salt.<br /><br />It's very important to torque the flywheel all the way to 105 ft-lbs, and the mating surfaces of the taper have to be dry (not oily). The key only holds the flywheel in position while you're torquing. Once the nut is torqued, it's the taper that handles the rotational forces, not the key. If the nut isn't tight enough, a V4 can shear that key just playing around at idle (as it sounds like you may have found out...).

 

[ledgefinder]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

BTW, in your rebuild did you take out the 4 main jets (2 in the bottom of each float bowl) and make sure they're clean?

 

[djzyla1980]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

Yup... took the jets out, soaked them and blew um out seperate.. then took the bowls outta soak, blew them off, put jets back in and sprayed um down with carb cleaner and blew um again. They be clean...I know that for a fact!!<br /><br />Yes.. I've played the sheared flywheel key game.. My only question about that is If my key is not holding my flywheel snug when I tighten her down and it moves a bit either way, My timming will be off... either too advanced or to retarded. And when I hook a light up to it and time it to my marks on flywheel, since theres play, my marks would be off as well....right??

 

[djzyla1980]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

Oh this never ending tale continues.<br />I decided yesterday that since I liked the effects of decarbing (the smoke...lol) I would go ahead and decarb again for sh!ts and Giggles. I did not mix it with the gas instead I sprayed it into the barrels. When I spray the decarb in #4 it seemed to bog way down and go to die. But when I sprayed it in the other 3 the motor reved higher. Any thoughts?

 

[djzyla1980]

Re: At Wits end with this one...think it's shop time...For the 70' 115

Heres what I did:<br />Rebuilt carbs<br />set lync and sync again...<br />Swapped prop with same size<br />Swapped Rotor<br />Swapped Distributor<br />Swapped coil<br />Decarbbed again...<br />Changed plug wires...<br /><br />Decided to take my chances and head for the lake..<br />so I loadded me and the wife/kids up for another dissapointing day of the kids sitting there and me working on the motor<br /><br />Dropped it in and it fired right up... <br />got it just past the no wake zone and started raising the throttle and with every move of the throttle it responded. With a pretty fast hole shot it was up on plane and running smoothly. No matter what I tried I could not get her misfire,die,bog down or anything else. Just purred like a kitten. I decided that I would drop back and see where a good speed to keep me on plane but not full throttle. Dropping back to 1/4 throttle is were I found was a pretty decent cruising speed. I would push her to WOT and she went... and went fast. (thinking that I am now over powered which I assumed from the get go)Was out there just under 3 hours with about 95% that time cruising around.<br />Wife said it's time to buy a tube <br /><br />It was actually quite nice. Never pulled the cover off once. Thanks for all the help. It has been greatly appreciated. AS far as RPM's?<br />Would be nice but tach took a Sh!t today so I'll have to fix that... Oh Well...<br /><br />Thank you much...