A strange "OIL" thing...

[trog100]

not just a boat thing this.. thow boats do use "OIL".. i found it interesting and worth some thought..<br /><br />it seems that americans are told (recommended) to change their engine oils twice as often as europeans are..<br /><br />every 3000 miles is a common american interval.. where i live five or six thousand is the commonly accepted interval..<br /><br />before someone says the obvious.. well the more often the better.. it seems from an enviromental point of view this is bad news.. not everyone gets rid of the stuff in the correct manner..<br /><br />millions of tons of the stuff is (possibly) being dumped into the american environment unnecessarally every year.. and thats apart from the financial cost of changing it when u dont have to..<br /><br />wonderfull stuff for any conspiracy theorists out there.. if u start thinking about this one aint it.. he he he<br /><br />it is true.. in the UK 3000 miles between changes is unheard of.. we do more short trips on average so if anything our change intervals should be shorter than american ones not longer..<br /><br />i just found this one interesting.. it wasnt something i knew about until i just read it while researching the pros and cons of useing synthetic oil..<br /><br />trog100

 

[Boomyal]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

I've always thought it to be Manufacturer/Servicer hype.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

While the benefits of synthetic oil are pretty well known by auto enthusiasts, the problem arises with auto manufacturers and what their warranty statements are. Most manufacturers recommend oil changes at 7500 mile intervals. The problem is that they also indicate "severe service" requires changes at half that or around 3500 miles. In the upper half of the US, weather alone constitutes severe service so there ya go. If the dealer sees a trailer hitch on your vehicle, that too signals severe service. Since I use synthetic oil in my vehicles, once out of warranty, oil change intervals are extended to 5000 miles.

 

[WillyBWright]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

It might have more to do with your Petrol. I've heard ours is quite a bit better than overseas. The main reason for changing oil is for the combustion contaminants that it collects. It might not be unreasonable for other variations of gasoline to produce more or less contamination.<br /><br />But then again, it was probably decided by somebody in the Marketing division, not based on Reality.

 

[steve n carol]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

hey trog, thought you were still on vacation, Checkek out another one of your web sites, cant remember the name of it, but the colors are hard to forget.eams they were chartruse and black, kinda of a poporie of mixed freakish information. oh well, About the oil changing here.<br />Seems we have a vast supply of spendable income. About as vast as our own oil reserves. HA!<br /><br />In America, I am at the bottom of the food chain, if you know what I mean. I truly feel there more conspiricies here than one really knows about. Ever hear the quote "are we really free?". from a bumper sticker, maybe from the 60's. or "big brother is watching". these kind of things. <br />I have a property in the country w/a well on it. Dumped oil has a direct consequence on our ground water. Polution is a BIG problem here with more than just oil. Polution is probably the cause of many current dieseases here and abroad. It's sad because our children and their children are going to inheiret these problems. For interesting reading, checkout the radiation leak that happened in Hanover Washington, (state), this occured in the 40's - 50's. it wasn't as much a leak as the disposal method was to dump the junk into the river. The people downstream really suffered and still do. The East coast has even more problems. No wonder America isn't mentioned in the book of Revelation, (last days), maybe we are going to take ourselves out! <br />Back to the oil...is it possibile that in europe, on account of the $$$'s, they just run it more? <br />What wedding gift are you getting for Chucky and his Babe?

 

[flashback]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

Trog, I think willie B may have hit on something, even here in the states, different locales have different requirements on additives put in the gas for emmissions.. If you believe everything that Chevron, etc, tell you. there is a big difference between the gas in L.A. and the gas in "little town" Georgia... IF YOU BELIEVE

 

[rabidfish]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

You have an "odometer" on your boat?

 

[tommays]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

my 2003 gm truck has and oil life system with a probe in the oil<br /><br />i have no idea what its checking but but do no that when its 10 deg outside for a long time it wants the oil done at 2500 miles or less<br /><br />in the summer or on a long trip it will last over 5000 miles which is longer than i prefer to let it go<br /><br />it the states your old oil is as easy as going anywere that sells it they have to take back the old oil for free<br /><br />tommays

 

[cmyers_uk]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

I have given this some thought also, My vehicle has a 10,000 mile service schedule and doesnt burn oil in between and seems fine. My last car ran 374000 mile (taxi) with no problem at 10000 change and ran on non-synthetic. Two things do spring to mind. The average saloon in the UK is 1.8 - 2litre modern design engine around 100 - 150bhp not 4.3 upwards 300hp beast 1950's technology which may make a difference. Our cars are generally smaller and lighter so engine isnt loaded as much. There is definately a difference in fuel which is why fuel stabalizer is unheard of in the uk but hey at the price they charge us it should be made of gold. Lastly as mentioned previously also our climate is neither very hot or very cold and the distances we travel are generally short in comparison. Lastly changing the oil is the least of the environmental problems when your only getting between 10-20mpg, but I think thats more a point for dockside chat.

 

[trog100]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

"You have an "odometer" on your boat?".. he he he<br /><br />nope.. but i have done rough kinda calculations in my head that tell me that one hour at say 3500 rpm in my boat probably works out something like one hour at eighty mph in my car..<br /><br />5000 miles would be something over 60-ish odd hours tween changes.. or about 40-ish hours at 3000 miles.. impossible to work out other than very roughly..<br /><br />the thing that throws the spanner in the works thow is the suggestion that from an enviroment point of view the good old adage that goes "u cant change your oil too often" is simply not true..<br /><br />it also makes a good case for useing synthetics cos they dont need changing so often.. thow without knowing exactly how synthetics are made its hard to know for sure on this one..<br /><br />just food for thought..<br /><br />trog100

 

[trog100]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

just to add there is a website doing long term tests on how long synthetic oils last.. they are comparing one brand with another.. every thousand miles a sample is taken and sent of to a lab.. so its possible to tell exactly how long oils do last..<br /><br />a UK truck driver friend of mine was telling me the synthetic oil in his volvo truck is sent off to the lab every 100.000 miles to see if it needs changeing.. mosly it dosnt.. he he.. does kinda make u think..<br /><br />trog100

 

[Boomyal]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

Originally posted by trog100:<br />.....it also makes a good case for useing synthetics cos they dont need changing so often.. thow without knowing exactly how synthetics are made its hard to know for sure on this one.

Under reasonably normal conditions, the single biggest reason to change oil is due to the formation of acids. Acids are formed when moisture combines with the sulpher elements in natural oil, forming sulphuric acid. The shorter the trips (not allowing the oil to burn out the normal condensation that occurs) the quicker the acid is formed. <br /><br />True synthetics, not being made from natural petroleum, have no sulpher in them. Hence no acid is formed.

 

[trog100]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

boomyal.. i know for sure they dont need changing so often.. <br /><br />i was thinking more how they were made and what they contain from the enviroment point of view.. are they made from the freshly sacrificed blood of six virgins for example.. he he<br /><br />what is synthetic oil made from..???<br /><br />trog100

 

[Boomyal]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

Trog, a true synthetic is nothing more than oil. The molecules are are actually formulated in a process that makes them of uniform size (unlike most dino oils) and without all of the non lubricative junk that simply cannot be 'cracked' out of dino oil stock. Then all of the necessary additives and dispersants are added to the formulation to make it suitable for internal combustion engine lubrication. In otherwords, it the same but different. (purer)

 

[rabidfish]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

So... trog changes his oil at 60 hours, plus or minus. And states that we(here in the US) change it too often...<br /><br />My customers change their oil at 100 hours or the end of every season. From what I know about other dealers in my area, that's what they do also.<br />(By the way, this is also the manufacturer's recommended interval also)<br /><br />Just so you'll know... At a 100 hour interval, synthetic is just a tad more expensive.

 

[trog100]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

"so... trog changes his oil at 60 hours, plus or minus. And states that we(here in the US) change it too often..."<br /><br />come on rabbidfish i said no such thing.. i just made a rough attempt to equate hours with miles.. and pointed out a "diiference" between american and european "beliefs"..<br /><br />time u learned to read dude.. i simply pointed out that americans (dyno talk here not synthetic) regularly say they do it every 3000 miles europeans say they do it every 5000 miles.. both think they are doing it right.. at no time did i say who was right..<br /><br />the 100 boat hours u mention dont fit my hour to mile calculations either.. it seems too long.. i wonder how it was arrive at..???<br /><br />let me guess.. some clever dude worked out that the average car speed over a long time period would be 30 mph.. one 100 hours at 30 mph arrives at the magic american 3000 mile change period..<br /><br />trouble is its not accurate is it.. my car at 3500 rpm like my boat at cruise speed would be doing nearly 100 mph.. errr 100 hours of that would equal 10000 miles in my car... assuming the 3000 mile change period to be vaguely correct three oil changes should be done in that 100 hour period not one..<br /><br />something is wrong somewhere aint it.. throw in the truck having its oil lab checked every 100000 miles just to make sure its okay and its quite clear to me that in truth nobody really knows just how often we should change the damn stuff.. he he he..<br /><br />everyone just goes bah and follows the lead sheep just like u and your customer do.. the manufacturers sell u the stuff the more u use the more money they make.. so u cant really trust them.. the oil comapanies sell the stuff so u cant really trust them either.. <br /><br />we just dont know.. i am beginning to get a good inking thow that it lasts a lot longer than most of us believe it does..<br /><br />and however long dyno lasts.. synthetic probably lasts at least twice as long.. <br /><br />trog100

 

[LubeDude]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

Originally posted by trog100:<br /> every 3000 miles is a common american interval..

Why, cause it has been beaten into our heads for so many years by the oil companies that we believe it, Now the auto manufactures are going just the oposite in saying 7,500-10,000 miles is fine. Also, the oils in the UK have been proven to be more robust in there additive packages. You will see in the oil threads here and everywhere else, that most people are seriously missinformed as to oil and lubrication.

 

[Lou C]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

Some years back Consumers Reports did a big report on oils, and frequency of oil changes. They compared engine wear in a taxi fleet for engines that had the oil changed at 3000 mile intervals and 6000 mile intervals. No big difference in wear. But these engines were run around the clock, with few cold starts. So it is hard to extrapolate to your own use. I have always changed 4 times a year or about every 3000 miles. Never had a wear problem I could attribute to oil, and have run several cars over 100K miles. If I drove more miles per year, and wanted to to 6000 miles/change then I would use synthetic. Since I have done all my oil changes for the last 30+ years, and other maintenance such as valve adjustments, I can say thay with 3000 mile changes, you will not see sludge under the valve cover for sure. Not sure if I went longer if that would be true as well. With the boat I do once a season, but I do less than 100 hrs a year, probably 50-60.

 

[JStutz]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

I work for the local telephone company and we drive are vehicles hard. The compant donsen't believe much in maintence. My last Ford van had 120,000 miles on it and a total of 5 oil changes. Of coarse I would have to add oil now and then but not to often. Never had any engine related problems. I still change my personal oil every 3,000 miles, not sure why.<br /><br />Jeff

 

[s1jor]

Re: A strange "OIL" thing...

over here in the uk the regular service intervals for new cars is up to 18000 miles