72 Evinrude 50 hp need help starting my first boat

[1stboatguy]

Hi guys I have searched so many forums and can't seem to find what I need to get my motor running so I am posting for help. It is my first boat motor but I do know a decent amount about engines and what it takes to make them run.

It is a 72 Evinrude 50 hp 50273c and has evinrude push button shift controls
The main issue is that it won't start.
Has spark, compression, and fuel.
There is no attempt for the brand new starter to spin when the key is turned. the solenoid does have power to the top and when I turn the key the two middle terminals are getting power but it does not send power to the starter. Some sort of kill switch engaged?

I have noticed that while attempting to turn it over by using jumper cables directly to the starter that is turning the prop and appears to be in gear. I am wondering if this particular model needs to be in neutral to start? It did seem very close to starting a few times while starting it this way but to no avail.
How do I get it in neutral if it does need to be there to start?
I have tested the push button wires with a test light and they do change according to the different buttons selected but the prop does not spin freely when neutral button is pressed.

I have read about the electric shift/hydro electric shift and definitely goes a little over my head and I am not even sure if I have this or not.
I hope this is something simple that I am missing and I appreciate any advice or ideas to move forward!
Thanks

 

[racerone]

It is electric shift.---When motor is NOT turning it will be in forward gear.----With button for nuetral pushed down it shifts to nuetral after one turn of the flywheel.

 

[jbuote]

Yeah, it is Hydro-Electric shift. (Edit: Electric then.. racerone knows his stuff, so, )
​It'll spin the prop while cranking a bit.. Needs a few revolutions for the shifting to happen...

Yes, you should be in Neutral to start it. Just push the Neutral button, and as it starts it should shift into neutral and stop spinning the prop.

​As for starting, there should be a safety switch at the engine that won't let the engine start if throttle is too far forward.
One of the wires coming off the starter solenoid goes through the switch to ground.,
​If it's not adjusted right, or is bad, it won't try to turn the starter..

​I'm not an expert here by any means, I just have a 1971 Johnson 50 hp, and it's Hydro-electric, so I have some experience with it.. lol

​You said you have spark, compression, and fuel..

​Any idea when the last time was this engine ran?

​How did you test spark?
What were compression numbers?
​Did you test spark and compression yourself or someone do it for you?
Did you clean the carbs?

​Even if I can't help 100%, answering those questions above will help out the experienced folks here when they look at this too.. LOL..

​For what it's worth..

 

[1stboatguy]

Thank you guys for the fast responses! I am going to work on it today, I kind of thought it was the electric or hydro electric shift and was wondering if that is what is giving me problems since I have no experience with it.
It was ran last summer and I have not cleaned the carbs.
I figured I could at least determine if it is being prevented from starting by something with the hydro shift.
Tested the spark by grounding the plug while turning over the engine in the dark.
I am not sure of the actual compression numbers but the guy I bought it from had compression confirmed. I guess I could double check
So far when cranking I don't think the flyweel has shifted it into neutral due to all the churning of water in the barrel.

 

[David Young]

The 'seller' will always tell the 'buyer', everything 'checks out great'.

 

[jbuote]

Ahh... Ok...

​Well, based on that, I'd personally consider it a completely unknown engine..
​I'd check compression and spark FIRST before anything else...

​Grounding plug and looking for spark isn't going to do it. Need to use an open air adjustable spark tester... (should be cheap at auto parts store).
​Set tester gap at 7/16".. Spark should jump that gap with nice blue spark and crisp "SNAP!"....
​If not, then some ignition troubleshooting would be needed too..

​Compression should be relatively even between cylinders... 10% variation I think it was... Also, should be over (well over actually), 100 psi..
​Post what you get for compression on each cylinder...
I like to use my muffs when cranking the engine for compression test (Edit: I see you're using a barrel.. Good! lol), to keep the impellor lubed, but I'd also advise replacing your impellor once you get it running..
​Never trust an impellor YOU didn't install.. lol..

​Spark and compression can tell a LOT about the basic state of health of the engine...
​Might want to do those 2 before spending money on it, just to be safe.. lol

 

[racerone]

Not sure why folks are afraid of " electric shift "-----But a lack of knowledge is common on them.-----They are very good , reliable and in my opinion very simple.---Cause less troble that mechanical shift systems.----How often do we see shift rods / cables misadjusted and folks posting about " my motor jumps in and out of gear " on these sites !!

 

[1stboatguy]

Racerone you are right it is my lack of knowledge that scares me!
Ok so I ran to the auto store to get the adjustable spark tester and compression tester.
spark is amazing and compression was 140 and just over 130 so I think I am good there.

I also grabbed some brand new plugs even though the old ones look to be in fine shape. But didn't have time to try starting it with them.

Jbuote you mentioned ...
​"As for starting, there should be a safety switch at the engine that won't let the engine start if throttle is too far forward.
One of the wires coming off the starter solenoid goes through the switch to ground.,
​If it's not adjusted right, or is bad, it won't try to turn the starter.."

What is the best way to determine if it is adjusted right or bad?
Also yes I will order an impeller tonight and change it as soon as its running and before I get it out on the water.

Again, thank you guys for your help and I will continue to update as I go along! Sure would like to get it out on the water before its too cold!

 

[racerone]

Turn key to " on "----Use boosters to crank the motor and it should start.-----If not them inspect flywheel key ( timing control ) as it may be sheared.

 

[jbuote]

Well, the way I checked my safety switch, was to use my Multi Meter, set to Ohms to check continuity..
​One meter probe on the solenoid where the switch connects to it (Red box in pic below), the other to the ground lug.. (Blue box in pic below)

(this is how mine has it.. Might be same on yours.. I don't know.. lol)

​Then, with throttle in Neutral (on mine), or where you would normally have it for Idle, you should have continuity.. (0, or close to it ohms..)
My meter beeps, so I got a beep and knew it was ok..

​If not, then I'd play with the throttle.. Move it forward and back again while watching the meter. If (at some throttle setting) I got a beep, or resistance dropped to 0 (or darn close) then I'd say it's probably not adjusted..
​If you always have high resistance (O.L) or no beep etc..
​Then maybe bad grounds or switch is bad...,

​Again, I'm NOT an expert here.. LOL
​I just have a similar engine.

racerone IS one of the experts here, so like he said..

​Should start if you jump it (like you did before..)
​If not, and especially if you get "Backfires": or "Popping" then absolutely check the flywheel key..,

​My simple check for that, is to disconnect battery, remove spark plugs, put a pencil in the top plug hole (#1 cylinder) till it contacts the top of the piston, and rotate the flywheel by hand until the pencil stops coming out.
This will have piston at the top of it's stroke.. (close anyway.. lol)

​Then the TDC or 0? mark on the flywheel should be at or very close to the timing pointer on the block..
​If not, suspect sheared key..

​Hope that describing the things I did on mine helps out somewhat.

 

[1stboatguy]

Alright tomorrow I will attempt to check the continuity of the safety switch. Could not find my ohmeter to save my life.
I also checked the flywheel key with the pencil method mentioned above and it checked out to be fine too.
I guess from here I will work on cleaning the carbs as the best place to start next?

 

[jbuote]

Well, what I described as my simple check for the flywheel key was a way to check for signs of a sheared key without taking it apart..
​The ONLY way I know of to 100% be sure the key is not sheared, is to pull the flywheel and visually inspect the key...

​That said, if the "Pencil Trick" checked out ok, then I'd probably not pull the flywheel to check key just yet.. Sound like it's Probably fine... BUT....
​Please note, the pencil trick can indicate a sheared key, but in NO way guarantees a GOOD key...
Make sense?

​I suppose one way to test if the safety switch is an issue or not, would be to jumper the post on solenoid the switch connects to, to ground..
This would effectively bypass the switch.. (I would NOT leave it that way, but a bypass for testing should be ok..)
​If you can start with the key with it bypassed, the switch or it's adjustment is bad..

​If it still won't start with the key, then the safety switch isn't the issue..

​That make sense too?

​Just another thought I had.. lol

 

[jbuote]

OHH.. And if you do use the bypass method to test, then it is up to YOU to be sure the shift switch is in neutral, and the throttle is at Idle, or starting position..

 

[1stboatguy]

Great stuff to know! The pencil check did help to at least move forward somewhere. I should probably just pull it and check it as well.
This morning I ran out and took the wire off of the safety switch and grounded it to the motor. Triple checked that the neutral button was pressed down and the throttle in start position. It did turn the starter! Thanks for that little test because I still can't find my multi meter...

If you could humor me...
My question would be- If the safety switch keeps it from starting in gear, is it working properly and the motor IS in fact in gear and shouldn't be?
Or is the switch just truly bad (or adjusted incorrectly) and keeping things from happening the way they should?
Going to read up on adjusting the safety switch and see if I can do that before ordering one.
Thanks again

 

[jbuote]

The safety switch at the engine prevents the engine from starting with the throttle too advanced.. (Not in idle or start.)
​Has nothing to do with in gear or not (On our engines anyway...)

​There should be a different switch in the control box that prevents starting in gear..

​Since you grounded the safety switch on the engine, and it spun the starter with the key, I'd say the control side of things is working fine.. lol

​So now, why is the throttle advance switch not working?
​
Test continuity of switch (Hope you can find your meter.. lol) If you put one lead on the switch itself where you took the wire off, then other on good ground, you should have continuity when you press the switch.. IF not, switch is bad. If you do have continuity, then switch is good..

I got as far as testing my switch, and it was good and adjusted properly. My issue was something else, so I'm not too sure how to adjust it..

​I've got the factory service manual for mine and could look it up, but won't be able to get to that until at least 8-9pm Eastern tonight.
​Been away all weekend.. LOL

 

[1stboatguy]

OK I got a multi meter and tested for continuity on the throttle advance switch and there was zero continuity in an circumstance.
So I took off the switch and opened it up and found it to be super dirty on all the contact points. I used some fine sandpaper and cleaned up the inner parts of the switch (be careful not to drop one of the two springs) and got it working. I was able to test the continuity of the switch without installing it so I knew it was working and making ground when the switch is pressed down.
Put it all back together and now I can crank the engine with the key!
Thank you so much your efforts to get me this far! It really is the little things sometimes.

Worked on getting it started and I could get it to fire for a brief second or two by pouring a tiny bit of gas in the spark plug hole.
I did this a few times but it wouldn't stay running when it would almost try to start.

Now on to the next step I suppose.
I am thinking cleaning the carburetors. Not sure if I need a rebuild kit to clean them or if I can just clean them and put it back together and at least have it running.

 

[Tech Tony]

Hi, if you go through the carbs, also check the fuel pump. If it's original, the diaphragm may be getting dried out.

 

[Decker83]

When I did my carbs, I used NAPA brand dip solution and let them soak overnight. Only way imho to get them completely clean. I would advise to get the new kits also with floats.

 

[jbuote]

AWESOME!! Nice Job!!

I agree with Decker83...
​Soak the carbs overnight.. Then blow out passages with compressed air..

Also agree with Tech Tony.. Check fuel pump...

​Almost everything was backwards on mine when I got it.. Fuel line from tank went to "Out" of fuel pump.. "In" of fuel pump was connected to carbs..
(Umm... Ok... LOL...)

​Like you said.. The little things.. haha!!
​Definitely go through the fuel system now to be sure you're getting fuel from tank, through primer bulb, through pump, and to carb bowls..
​Make sure fuel pump works.. (Disconnect fuel line from carb, point into container and crank engine (pull lanyard kill switch so it wont' start)..
​Does fuel come out from pump?

​Then it's carb cleaning and settings...
​You "Could" try just a cleaning "Just to see if it runs", but if I were you, I'd order 2 carb kits, Play with cleaning till kits come in, then use kits to fully rebuild.
​(Including new floats)..

​New floats may not be necessary, but it's relatively cheap money to get the kit with floats Vs. no floats, so I got the kits with floats so I knew everything was new..
​Then, be sure to pull the welch plugs (Real name? not sure, but those silver caps) and clean out in there too.
​Some great vids online about cleaning carbs..

​If your carb kit comes with float needles with neoprene tips (probably will) Don't forget the clip that connects the needle to the float hinge.. lol

​I'd like to go back to something racerone suggested... The flywheel key...
Could be worth doing the "Pencil Test" one more time to see if it still checks out..
​Now that it's fired even for a few, if the key is sheared and the flywheel slipped, you'll have a different result on that "Trick" test..

Lastly....
What are you doing as your starting procedure?

​What I do:

Squeeze primer bulb till firm.. (approx. 3-5 squeezes usually)..
Turn on muffs for water.. (You have a barrel)
Shifter in Neutral.
​Throttle to "Start".. (I have a start lever on mine.. I don't have the pushbutton shifting, but you have some start throttle setting right?)
​Activate choke..
Turn to start..
​Release choke the instant it tries to start...

​Usually comes to life right then.. lol

​Man.. .It's awesome you've made great progress!!

​Hope this description helps a bit as well!
​It may not be what you need to do exactly, but if it helps.. LOL

 

[jbuote]

Oh yeah..
​One more "Little thing".. lol
​While I'm sure you have, make sure the fuel tank vent is open..
If not, fuel won't come out of the tank.. lol

​You probably have that covered, but just in case...