5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

[cary00silve]

I just bought a 1955 5hp gale outboard and took it out today for a test run. At first it was running poorly and not revving out which I attributed to a fouled plug and possibly rich mixture. I leaned out the mixture and it ran great for about 2 minutes and then it shut off. I primed the carb by turning the control knob full left. The motor then started up, ran for 2 minutes and quit again. It kept doing this, which makes me believe the carb is running the float bowl dry and is running out of gas. I pulled the fuel line off and opened the tank valve and fuel flows fine. The fuel is definitely getting to the bottom of the float bowl. I have no clue what to check next because I am new to these carburetors. If you have any ideas I would greatly appreciate them. The motor is a 5hp buccaneer model 5D11B.

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

I just checked my older books to see what carburetor that engine had. I remember it well as being tempermental. However, either the fuel delivery is slow, the float sticks shut, or/and the carburetor needs cleaning.

Assuming that the high speed needle valve is in the correct position, having not been disturbed for a number of years, be sure to count the turns it takes to seat it so that you can install it to that setting (whatever turns) for a starting point when you reassemble it.

 

[F_R]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

The carburetor on those motors is so simple there isn't much to go wrong with them. Dirt or gum. There is only one fuel flow passage from the float bowl up through the main jet. If it's open, nothing wrong there. Bad float (sinking) in which case it would overflow and flood. Bad float pin seat in the bottom of the float chamber, in which case it would also overflow and flood. If none of the above, it probably isn't the carb.

BUT where you should be focusing your attention is the magneto. Those old OMC motors are all notorious for cracked coils. If they haven't already been replaced, they need to be. Unless and until you resolve that problem, you are wasting your time looking at the carb. Guaranteed

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

Cary..... Be sure to let us know what you find.

 

[tmcalavy]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

Good advice so far. Your Buc has a really simple carb, most prone to failure as the cork float deteriorates with age. Pull and clean the carb, its very simple...just make sure you have a well-lighted, clean work area to do it. Make sure the float is good and the needle seats fully when it is all the way up...no gas should be flowing then. If the float is saturated and won't float, you can take it out and let it dry for a few days then coat it with shellac or fuel-proof dope (both available at hobby stores). That carb has a high-speed (front knob) and slow speed adjustment. After you clean the carb and get it back together, seat both needles by gently turning clockwise until they stop. Back the high-speed needle out (turn counterclockwise) about 3/4 to 1 full turn. Back the slow speed out about 1 to 1.5 turns. The flywheel is easy to pull using a harmonic balancer puller from an auto parts store. Might want to clean and regap the points while you're in there. If the coils are shot/cracked, you can do a complete tune-up (not counting plug wires) for about $50...that's about what I paid a year or so ago. The kit gets you two coils, 2 points and 2 condensors. Any Evinrude/Johnson dealer should be able to get the kit if it isn't in stock. After you get it running well again, tune it on your boat by running it up to speed (Fast) and adjusting the high-speed needle right or left to find the sweet spot where it runs good at FAST, SLOW and IDLE. Also make sure the LU is full of grease/oil. Check out http://www.aomci.org to find the Florida chapters if you really like the old iron.

 

[F_R]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

Actually, the slow speed adjustment is not a needle at all. It is merely a screw on the side that holds the throttle valve part way open. Adjust it for best idle, after everything else is working. So simple.

 

[cary00silve]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

well, I completely disassembled and soaked the carb. The float wasn't saturated, and the carb didn't really seem to be all that dirty. It is still doing the same stuff. It doesn't want to idle no matter how I adjust the slow speed screw, and at wot it will only run for a couple of minutes and then shut down. I guess I will go ahead and pull the flywheel and check out the ignition system. What should I gap the points to? Also, what should I look for as far as bad ignition coils?

 

[cary00silve]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

I just finished pulling off the flywheel, and man do the coils look bad. They are all cracked to hell, and it looks like they are covered in some sort of amber shellac (maybe to hold them together). Anyway, is there a way to test them other than just putting an ignition tester on the spark plug wire?

 

[tmcalavy]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

Cracked = Toast. Time to replace them. I think the point gap setting is .018 or .020. I'll check tonight and post back. Does it get real hot just before it shuts down? If the water pump/impeller isn't working well it will overheat, and if the coils are obviously toast they will fail under load/heat. Immerse the carb in carb cleaner and blow out the orifices with air. Not wanting to respond to the slow speeding setting/screw could be a dirty idle circuit in the carb. How about the reed behind the carb, where it bolts to the powerhead...is it in good shape and clean? Does it have good compression on both cylinders?

 

[cary00silve]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

I cleaned the carb today, and everything looked good. The reeds look brand new. The compression on both cylinders is just under 50 psi. The impeller seems to be pumping water because there is a steady stream coming out the exhaust. I will go ahead and order some coils and report back.

 

[F_R]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

Did I call that one or not? Those old coils are always cracked. If they are cracked, they are junk. As I said previously, until you take care of that problem, forget about that carb.

Point gap is .020. Clean them up shiny bright first. Or just put in new ones and condensers while you are at it. The new coils should be installed so that the laminations are flush with the machined edge where they mount on the armature plate. That will set the proper air gap to the flywheel magnets. Make sure the primary wire leads are tucked back so they don't rub on the flywheel or cam. Don't have them looped upward for the same reason.

To install the flywheel, make sure the shaft and flywheel tapers are clean and dry, and use a torque wrench to tighten the nut to 40-45 ft/lbs unless you want a wrecked flywheel or crankshaft or both.

You are going to be amazed at how well it runs with the new coils.

 

[tmcalavy]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

Ditto that. Ensign's right on...they are stout little runners once you get them tuned.

 

[cary00silve]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

well, I got the new coils and installed them. I tried to start the motor, but it doesn't even try to fire up. I put an ignition tester on the wires, and the top coil isn't getting fire. I guess I have to tear it back down and find the problem. Also, the throttle on the tiller handle is slipping, and when I twist the tiller handle, it just spins. Is there a way to adjust this, or are the gears trash?

 

[F_R]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

I believe the throttle shaft gears are stamped, not cast on that model, right? If so, you may be able to shim them closer together. Back in their day, I always used to just replace them with the newer cast gears and end of problem. That particular motor had a real goofy steering bracket, and replacement gear/shafts might be very difficult to find (only made one year, and only for Gale).

 

[cary00silve]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

Yes, they are stamped. How do I go about shimming them?

 

[F_R]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

Put however thick washers behind them. You can get a variety of nylon or fiber washers at a good hardware store. Don't attempt to take the gear off the shaft, remove the whole shaft and gear as an assembly.

 

[cary00silve]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

Do I remove the gear and shaft assembly from the tiller side or the motor side? I'm sorry about all of the questions, but all of this outboard stuff is new to me.
Thanks...

 

[cary00silve]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

I got the handle removed. The rubber washer had disintegrated. I'm going to get some nylon washers in the morning. Now all I have to do is figure out why the top cylinder isn't getting spark...

 

[cary00silve]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

Alright, I fixed the ignition problem and both cylinders are getting a strong spark. The motor idles great and doesn't want to die any more, but it still does the same thing at WOT. If I run at WOT after about 2 minutes the motor shuts off. I can then prime the carb and it starts right back up and runs WOT for 2 minutes. What the heck could be causing this. The fuel line is clear and flows perfectly, and the carb was cleaned and gum free. I am not sure if the motor is overheating, because there is a steady flow of water out the rear of the motor. I am just completely out of ideas and turn to you for answers....d

 

[tmcalavy]

Re: 5hp Buccaneer Carb Problems

you are making progress, don't give up now. if it gets so hot that you can't touch the water jackets while it's running, the pump/impeller isn't doing it's job. it (pump) should move enough water that the water jackets are warm, not hot, when running. RU testing it in a tank/barrel or on the boat? it won't cool right (too much oxygenated water) and it can't breathe right if it is run too long in a tank (getting exhaust gases instead of air). does it sneeze before it quits? That would mean it's running lean. keep posting...you'll get it solved. sorry for the acronyms...I'm typing one-handed due to shoulder surgery.