'53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does! EDIT: IT'S ALIVE

[mark in new jersey]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

You could put it in the water and keep it running all day if you wanted to keep squirting fuel into the intake.

Great! Except, one nice backfire & I lose my eyebrows!

, did you convert it back to the double line pressure tank?

I got a crazy-clean cruise-a-day tank & some new hose for free.....and all the "fuel pump stuff & plumbing" just felt so crowded on this little engine, so I'm going back to "stock": 2 hose all around.

That said, right now I'm doing my tests "motorcycle style".....gravity feed from a small (10 ounce) elevated fuel container.

Time to revisit the carb...for sure! But not tonight. I have to go teach guitar lessons!

More fun to follow, I'm sure!

 

[kodibass]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

raise the tank/hose higher than the powerhead (gravity feed) the fuel to the motor then see if it will stay running, if it does then lower the tank/hose and see if it dies, if it does retrace everthing from tank vent to carb in.

 

[Chinewalker]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Just out of curiosity - do the choke and throttle butterflies move freely? Has the idle circuit been checked and cleaned? (That's accessible under the small disc plug on top of the carb). Does the throttle advancing move the mag plate and open up the carb? Carb is synched to the mag plate?

 

[mark in new jersey]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

yes to all.....

 

[64osby]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

A quick question, is the primer bulb installed correctly? They usually have an arrow on them.

I once installed my hose backward and the motor wouldn't get fuel.:facepalm: Flipped it around and off I went.:redface:

 

[mark in new jersey]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

I really don't want to seem like an ingrate to all of you fine folks who are trying to help me, but some of you are asking questions that indicate you've not actually read what's been written in this thread.

There isn't, at present, a bulb in the equation.

Fuel is being delivered by the gravity (i.e. "motorcycle") method from a 10oz tank positioned above the engine.

So as to eliminate unnecessary variables, the "tank", "hose", "bulb", "fuel pump", "lines", et. al. have been removed, so as to eliminate them as sources of the problem(s).

 

[OptsyEagle]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

In the long line of stupid questions. Are you sure the fuel is flowing from your 10oz tank? Without a primer bulb, I would think one would need to start a syphoning action to get the fuel to start flowing. After that, gravity/syphoning would continue the process.

 

[webrx]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

two things,

First, running that motor out of water will result in replacing the impeller - even a few seconds running dry can ruin one (dont ask me how I know this).

Second, based on your description - pulled and pulled and no start, then hours later one pull and she starts - fuel is not getting into the carb is my guess, as it sits long enough it finally does and the engine will kick. Proven by your test - put fuel in it and it runs.

causes -
not enough weight or height in your 10 oz tank to overcome the needle in the carb (needle sticking just a little)
when you rebuilt the carb you did not get all the little idle circuit holes cleaned out (I use a piece of a wire brush - brass not steel - no rust)

other ideas -
since you say you have the throttle synched (makes contact between the two lines on the stator) set to this point when you try to start the motor - for my older rude this was a good place to start them - don't trust the labels on the throttle handle.

set low speed screw at 1.5, try it, if that does not work, try 1.25, then 1, then .75 some of these (I had an 18 that did this) want to be at .75 to 1 to run, they may cough and even start at higher but to run, it needed to be a little leaner - don't ask me why - my buddies 18 will not stay running above 1 - maybe I missed cleaning out a port, but I don't think so cuz she runs and idles great at this setting.

last - spray a little penetrating oil (spray pre-mix in before trying to start if your skiddish and dont think the PO will lube it enough) into the carb port and let it set a bit, overnight (I have done this in the plug hole also to help free up rings on motors that have set a while) if reeds are sticking this may help to loosen them up a bit.

just some thoughts on what I would try next if it were mine - not sure this is in keeping with any "certified repair processes", but that is what I would try next..

Dave

 

[mark in new jersey]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

re: impeller......I agree. I was "not concerned" about the overheating of the engine, but failed to consider the water's lubricating effect on the impeller itself. You're right, and I won't be doing that again.

I ordered [another] carb kit last night & will be re-rebuilding it again.

Searching around the 'net last night I found a lot about rebuilding carbs, including pictures of my carb, as fixed by others.

One of the things I noticed is the "needle spring"; once attached to the needle & float, the needle is forced open as the float falls. Neither the instructions which accompany the kit nor my original Evinrude parts lists show this spring, so I didn't install it. (The Sierra kit comes with more stuff than any one carb requires, so having 'extra stuff' after my re-build didn't alarm me).

Moreover, the original needle & seat were metal, and closed with a male-female conical fit. The new ones do no such thing: the seat is just a flat-faced hole, and the needle has a rubber tip. I notice that it does stick in the seat occasionally, and the float falling away, sans spring, isn't enough to let the needle simple "fall down".

I think this is a big piece of my problem.

Of course, did I save the "extra" parts? No....so, like I said, I ordered a new rebuild kit last night.

I also want to re-re-clean everything, clean out the low-speed welch port again, put in all-new fresh wearables...the whole thing.

I think I'm chasing the demons out the door!

 

[Chinewalker]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

The needle spring, and subsequent redesign of the needle itself to accommodate it, happened well after your motor was built. Not sure when, exactly, they made the change, but it was no earlier than the 1980s. I think they added it due to the ethanol addition to the fuel degrading the "improved" rubber tips and creating the sticking situation. It was a simple, and effective fix. No reason not to add it on to yours, as even with the old metal-on-metal needle & seat, they would occasionally stick due to varnishing, gunk, etc.

Checking the "simple" things often lead to the "DOH!!!" moment when we catch the "obvious" thing we've been seeing, but not actually seeing. Been there, and done that - more times than I'd like to admit...

 

[64osby]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

In the long line of stupid questions. Are you sure the fuel is flowing from your 10oz tank? Without a primer bulb, I would think one would need to start a syphoning action to get the fuel to start flowing. After that, gravity/syphoning would continue the process.

Mark - IMO as stated above you would want the primer bulb in the equation. Something needs to feed the motor at inception, to eliminate air and fill the bowl. After that gravity will take over.

Added info, primer bulb would not be required if your 10oz tank outlet was on the bottom.

I assumed it was being used as part of your feed to the motor. My mistake.

Good luck with the re-rebuild.

 

[mark in new jersey]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

(said in my best Dr. Frankenstein voice...)

IT'S ALIVE

As stated in a previous post, I got a great deal on a pressurized tank, some new hose & fittings. So, for now at least, that's my "direction"....removal of the pump & re-configured the engine for 2-hose.

I rebuilt & re-installed the carb, set the needles properly (H = 3/4, L = 1-1/2), mixed up some 16:1 fuel, hooked it all up, pumped up the tank, choked the carb, and yanked the rope.

Started on the first pull!

IT'S ALIVE!!

(just felt like saying that again).

That said, there's still something to be worked out: it only runs for about a minute before it sputters out & dies. Long story short, I traced the problem to fuel starvation: if I pump the pressure tank as it starts to cough-cough-cough, it will roar back to life.

Either A.) the engine is failing to pressurize the tank, or B.) the tank is not holding pressure, and I'm 99% sure it's "B".

(because when I received the tank, the gasket was gone; the previous owner had attempted a gasket with duct tape. After cleaning off the tape goo, I constructed a new gasket from.....

ahem.....



don't judge me too harshly.....







corrugated cardboard.



I suspect that's my problem, right there. Wouldn't you agree?

That said, is there a reason why the engine would operate yet not "make pressure"? *Could* it be the engine?



The other thing: the manual says 16:1 is the right mix for these engines, but MAN!....what a ghastly blue cloud! Choking, disgusting, oily smoke! Can I back down the mix to something a bit less oily?

And, lastly: thank you, one & all. This restoration project is little more than a labor-of-love, and while I've learned a lot along the way, I could not have done a lot of this without the help of you guys here! So, again: thank you, one & all....

 

[HighTrim]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

It wont be anywhere near as smoky when on a boat on the water, that is just the way they are when barrel testing. Synthetic oils help alot.

Very very rare that the motor is not producing pressure. More likely that the tank is not holding pressure. You can get a rebuild kit for them and have it done in no time.

 

[mark in new jersey]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

A rebuild kit from "them"? Who's "them"?

Other than the tank gasket, is there something else to rebuild? Where else could / would it be leaking from?

 

[kfa4303]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Hi Mark. I don't much about the pressure tanks, but I think there are a couple gaskets, o-rings and other bits that are needed. Here are some pics and links.

http://www.boatsportandtackle.com/servlet/the-249/GAS-TANK-REPAIR-KIT/Detail

 

[1946Zephyr]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

As I see it, it can really only be two things. Either the carb inlet valve is leaking and you are flooding the motor or your reed valves are malfunctioning. The leak in the carb inlet valve is easy to test when the carb is off the motor. Just allow the float to close the inlet valve and blow into the fuel "in" nipple and see if it restricts your blow. You can lift the float and then see if it allows air and shuts again, this way. The other way would be to simply give it time for any flooded gas to dissappate, clean up what you can and then re-hook up the gravity feeded fuel line and just watch it to see if it starts to flow out the carb throat. As we have stated, it should stop when the inlet valve closes, so if it doesn't, that is your problem...or at least a problem.

If it does shut off the flow you could try spraying some pre-mix into the carb throat again. Now if it still doesn't fire, I would start to look at a reed problem. There is only two problems, with the bad reed theory and those are firstly, that it is unlikely that both cylinder reeds would fail at the same time, but it happens, but secondly, if you put a teaspoon of pre-mix in each cylinder, it should fire, even with bad reeds. I think you did this, but you could try it again when you are more sure the flooded gas is gone.

I see the first two pics here and just think of you stalking a big nasty bug with your spray bottle and sneaking aroung the corner to shoot it. LMAO!!!

Nice lookin oldie.

 

[jbjennings]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does! EDIT: IT'S ALIVE

I haven't read all 4pages of this thing...
If the vacuum pulse was from the intake manifold nipple, you need to take off the intake and redo the check valves like they were originally (remove the port that's plugged off, and replace the check valve flapper) so that the motor will pressurize your tank. If the vacuum pulse were from the bypass covers, ignore...
It should be an easy check to remove the pressure line from the intake and crank the motor and see if it's putting out pressure.
I would buy a pressure tank rebuild kit from laingsoutboards.com and once you install it you won't have that to worry about anymore. about $30 and about 3 business days for shipping.
JBJ

 

[HighTrim]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

A rebuild kit from "them"? Who's "them"?

Other than the tank gasket, is there something else to rebuild? Where else could / would it be leaking from?

What you dont have secret mind reading skills?

Lol, sorry about that. Laingsoutboards is 1 place, also numerous vendors on ebay. I make my own kits so havent ordered 1 in a while.

The diaphragm is usually the likely spot that it leaks compared to the gasket.

Please be aware, there are 2 different kits depending on the tank you have. Either for the metal primer button or the newer black plastic button, so be sure to order the right one. The diaphragms are different.

 

[mark in new jersey]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Thanks for the info.....I will replace all of the wearables in the tank.

One thing, though: if the diaphragm were leaking, would the primer function? I would think "no". Indeed, though, it functions just fine...

Moot point, really....I'll replace it anyway.


What about the mix? 16:1 seems awfully oily. I realize this is a small container, but after a total of no more than 5 minutes of total run time, the water in the bucket is a slimy, disgusting mess. I can't imagine doing that to my lake...

 

[HighTrim]

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!

Re: '53 Super Fastwin......it wants to run. It really does!