1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

I have received everything that I ordered. In addition, I had the top hole bored .010 over and the lower two holes honed as they were in good shape.

Reassembly starts tomorrow. I'll need to disassemble the old piston and rod assembly before getting started.

BTW outboardparts.com was fast and efficient for parts
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

Looking for some hand holding here, is there an easy tutorial to follow for installing the new Wiseco pistons? Any help is appreciated, thanks in advance.
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

When reassembling the wrist pin and bearings what is the easy way to hold the "rollers" in place. It mentions using grease in the service manula does it really matter what type of grease is used?

Also, when I took the rods off the old pistons I did note which rod goes on which piston but I did not note the orientation as far as what side goes up or down, does it matter one way or another?

I checked the ring clearance in the cylinder and it seems that they meet the minimum end gap. When installing the new rings on the piston I do not have a ring spreader so, what is the best way to put them on without damaging the rings? Also, the rings have "top" printed on one side I would assume that means they need to be oriented so "top" is pointed to the head of the piston, correct?
 

Frank Acampora

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

Wiseco piston rings have a 2 degree taper on the top so top really is top or up toward the piston crown. If you have strong thumbnails, spread the ring gap with them and slide the rings over the piston. Not too easy but it works for me.

As for the piston, snap rings need to go in with the gap either up or down, to avoid the rings flexing and possibly loosening as the piston stops at TDC and BDC. Take one snap ring and put it in the wrist pin hole at 90 degrees. Push it in then tilt it into the groove with a screwdriver. After installing the rod and wrist pin, set one end of the other snap ring into the groove in proper orientation. While holding down with your thumb, use a small screwdriver in the notch and roll the ring into the hole. Then push down to seat in the groove. Not too easy until you get the knack of it, but do-able.

It is not too critical which side of the rod faces up, however there is a flat groove and a notched groove I suppose one is to drain excess oil from the bearings. However, the flat groove (drain) faces down with the piston in proper position in the bore.

Plain grease will hold the rollers and wrist pin needles. After installing in the engine, flood them with TCW-3.

Remember to properly align the rod big end caps BEFORE tightening more than hand tight. There are two polished flats on the side of the rod and a pencil point, small screwdriver, or dental pick must move over the crack smoothly without catching. You did mark the caps and rods, didn't you? The caps only go on one specific rod, and in one direction because the cracks on either side are different. After alignment, tighten the cap bolts to 190 inch pounds in two stages. You can use threadlock compound for extra security, some of the original engines had it on the threads, but I have not yet found it necessary.
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

Wiseco piston rings have a 2 degree taper on the top so top really is top or up toward the piston crown. If you have strong thumbnails, spread the ring gap with them and slide the rings over the piston. Not too easy but it works for me.Got it.

As for the piston, snap rings need to go in with the gap either up or down, to avoid the rings flexing and possibly loosening as the piston stops at TDC and BDC. Take one snap ring and put it in the wrist pin hole at 90 degrees. Push it in then tilt it into the groove with a screwdriver. After installing the rod and wrist pin, set one end of the other snap ring into the groove in proper orientation. While holding down with your thumb, use a small screwdriver in the notch and roll the ring into the hole. Then push down to seat in the groove. Not too easy until you get the knack of it, but do-able. Got it.

It is not too critical which side of the rod faces up, however there is a flat groove and a notched groove I suppose one is to drain excess oil from the bearings. However, the flat groove (drain) faces down with the piston in proper position in the bore. i looked again now I got it.

Plain grease will hold the rollers and wrist pin needles. After installing in the engine, flood them with TCW-3. What is TCW-3?

Remember to properly align the rod big end caps BEFORE tightening more than hand tight. There are two polished flats on the side of the rod and a pencil point, small screwdriver, or dental pick must move over the crack smoothly without catching. You did mark the caps and rods, didn't you? The caps only go on one specific rod, and in one direction because the cracks on either side are different. After alignment, tighten the cap bolts to 190 inch pounds in two stages. You can use threadlock compound for extra security, some of the original engines had it on the threads, but I have not yet found it necessary. I did mark the rods and caps to have them match. I follow everything you said here and understand the the rods and caps must be paired and aligned properly.


Thanks Frank for all your help!;)
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

Please confirm that this is correct the rod essentially floats on the pin assembly.
IMG_2032.JPG

IMG_2033.JPG
 

Frank Acampora

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

TCW-3: Two Cycle, Water cooled, 3rd generation. Outboard oil!

Yes, the photos are correct. The crankshaft cheeks at the crankpin locate the rod in the center of the wrist pin. Smatter of fact, if you do not put the piston in exactly straight, the rod big end will not fit between the cheeks.
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

LOL ;)Thanks again Frank!
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

What is the best sealant to use when putting the crankcase halves back together. I see some have recommended LOCKTITE 518 w/ primer or Permatex flange sealant.
Also, what is the proper way to install the "spaghetti" gasket? The service manual doesn't exactly say how it should be placed.
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

What is the best sealant to use when putting the crankcase halves back together. I see some have recommended LOCKTITE 518 w/ primer or Permatex flange sealant.
Also, what is the proper way to install the "spaghetti" gasket? The service manual doesn't exactly say how it should be placed.

BTTT...thanks!
 

Frank Acampora

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

If your engine has the groove, simply press the red gasket into it. Cut it just a smidge long so it will butt tight at the upper and lower bearings. Then use a dab of sealer right against the bearing. If the 518 is the red stuff, it is very nice. Excellent anaerobic sealer and will not harden in the presence of air but will set up in between the flanges. Any squeeze-out into the crankcases will just pass through with no harm. Apply on the flanges inside and outside the red spaghetti tubing and around all bolt holes. Cut nozzle so a relativekly thin bead is delivered. Remember, the flanges are mated surfaces and a little goes a long way.
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

If your engine has the groove, No the mating surfaces do not have a groove in either side to fit the spaghetti gasket into. It looks like just weaving it in and out of the bolt s is the way to do it.simply press the red gasket into it. Cut it just a smidge long so it will butt tight at the upper and lower bearings. Then use a dab of sealer right against the bearing. If the 518 is the red stuff, it is very nice. Excellent anaerobic sealer and will not harden in the presence of air but will set up in between the flanges. Any squeeze-out into the crankcases will just pass through with no harm. Apply on the flanges inside and outside the red spaghetti tubing and around all bolt holes. Cut nozzle so a relativekly thin bead is delivered. Remember, the flanges are mated surfaces and a little goes a long way.

Thanks again Frank! I am going to try and get this thing back together by the end of next weekend.;)
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

I keep plugging away on this thing but life keeps getting in the way.

Anyhow, I have reassembled the crank case.:eek:

When putting things back together what gaskets should be getting gasket sealant? I seem to think a lot of the gaskets did not appear to have any sealant when I took the engine apart. Should I only be applying it to the gaskets when the service manual explicitly states to apply some?

Thanks in advance.
 

Frank Acampora

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

No gaskets need sealant. If you have factory gaskets, one surface has a sealer on it that hardens when compressed. Aftermarket? I don't know. But I frequently make my own gaskets and don't use any sealer. Just makes it more difficult to get apart next time, and I open up my engines more frequently than I change underwear---OOOOH! Too much sharing. LOL
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

Thanks again Boss! You have been so much help. I truly appreciate it.;)
 

eight tracker

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

so what gives more pictures man!Were guys we need pics,hope its going back togeather ok!
tom
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

Still working on it...and family is in town.

Anyhow I am worried... this is what is developing in the lower cylinder from just the little I have rotated the crankshaft by hand:

74989355.jpg

67971759.jpg


I'm not sure why? Is it because a ring isn't set correctly? It is on both sides in about the same spot. Basically, the powerhead is reassembled and ready to be lifted back onto the boat. Should I stop and tear the thing back apart?
 

Frank Acampora

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

The engine won't even notice that and it may polish out with running. Won't affect compression at all. Probably had a very small piece of grit in the cylinder when you assembled it. Most likely gone now. I doubt you will even be able to feel it with your nail.

Think about this: That mild score is probably on the order of one ten thousands deep (.0001 to 0010) Ring gaps are acceptable up to .016, and you don't need to bore until scoring with multiple score marks is .002 or more. So calm down.

Re-reading one of your posts: If your engine does not have the groove in either flange, then you only use sealer, no red tubing, othwerwise the flanges will not seat together.
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

Frank,

Alright the cylinder wall sounds good. I'll mellow out.

When I resealed the case I did use the spaghetti gasket. The service manual even called for it. Should I tear it back apart and pull it out?
 

ezez

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Re: 1991 90HP Force problem updated motor is shot & rebuild started

When I resealed the case I did use the spaghetti gasket. The service manual even called for it. Should I tear it back apart and pull it out?

How about it do I need to crack the case back open and take it out?
 
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