1976 Evinrude 9.9

cpdupont68

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I am working on a 1976 Evinrude 9.9. It ran fine when I put it away for winter. Now...It will run great but only if I pump the fuel bulb every couple minutes, but dies if I do not. I rebuilt the carb over the winter and again after I noticed the issue. I also rebuilt the fuel pump twice (w/OEM parts) I verify it was assembled correctly and blow test was good. The small pulse opening behind the fuel pump is clear. I installed new fuel lines and a new primer bulb. I also replaced all the hose clamps and the Evinrude fitting that connects to the engine. No Luck! Should I just get a new OEM fuel pump? I don't have access to a working one to test.
 

jimmbo

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Welcome to iboats
You say you replaced the Fuel Lines. Did that include the Hoses between the Connector on the Motor to the Pump, and from the Pump to the Carb?
The Port on the Block you referred to as "Small Pulse Opening", is clear?
Is the Gasket between it and the Pump sealing?
 

racerone

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I would never buy a new pump.----They are so simple to repair.----Checked for PRESSURE pulses from the crankcase that drive the pump?----Any small creatures build a nest under the cover over the winter?---Checked pick-up tube inside your tank?
 

Crosbyman

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the engine needs fuel..and when you are supplying it manually it runs so one assumes hoses are ok, few items to check...
  • make certain tank venting is ok
  • disconnect carb inlet fuel hose and crank the engine to confirm fuel spits out the hose to confirm the pump is or is not ok sucking fuel out of the tank to feed the carb
  • make certain pump gasket hole aligns with the pump rear pulse port and PH pulse port ....needed to run the pump.
  • those fuel pumps are tricky critters to reassemble... ok after a few but tricky
 
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cpdupont68

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Welcome to iboats
You say you replaced the Fuel Lines. Did that include the Hoses between the Connector on the Motor to the Pump, and from the Pump to the Carb?
The Port on the Block you referred to as "Small Pulse Opening", is clear?
Is the Gasket between it and the Pump sealing?
Yes, those lines are new. I used a pipe cleaner and it appears to be clear. How can I tell if it is sealing correctly? Do I need to use Peratex liquid gasket?
 

cpdupont68

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I would never buy a new pump.----They are so simple to repair.----Checked for PRESSURE pulses from the crankcase that drive the pump?----Any small creatures build a nest under the cover over the winter?---Checked pick-up tube inside your tank?
Check pressure with my hand as I pull the rope? I did not check pick-up. I have the original evinrude tank, does that thread out? Sorry... I am a newbie to this.
 

cpdupont68

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the engine needs fuel..and when you are supplying it manually it runs so one assumes hoses are ok, few items to check...
  • make certain tank venting is ok
  • disconnect carb inlet fuel hose and crank the engine to confirm fuel spits out the hose to confirm the pump is or is not ok sucking fuel out of the tank to feed the carb
  • make certain pump gasket hole aligns with the pump rear pulse port and PH pulse port ....needed to run the pump.
  • those fuel pumps are tricky critters to reassemble... ok after a few but tricky
Tank is venting well. Carb hose is spitting fuel. The pulse port look aligned from what I can see.
 

Crosbyman

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does it die idling or at wot.... remove the pump confirm that you feel a good pulse out of the pulse port .. if you do them recheck your pump reassembly

if it only dies idling recheck carb low speed circuit and & drip chamber under top welch plug if never inspected

lift fuel supply (tank) above carb level if engine does not die from gravity fed fuel then pump is defective (if pulse port found to be pulsing ok)
 
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cpdupont68

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Check pressure with my hand as I pull the rope? I did not check pick-up. I have the original evinrude tank, does that thread out? Sorry... I am a newbie to this.
Okay, so I checked the tank intake tube. The screen looks clear. I sprayed it good with some carb cleaner, made a fresh cut in the hose, new clamp and used silicone tape before I tightened it all down.
 

cpdupont68

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does it die idling or at wot.... remove the pump confirm that you feel a good pulse out of the pulse port .. if you do them recheck your pump reassembly

if it only dies idling recheck carb low speed circuit and & drip chamber under top welch plug if never inspected

lift fuel supply (tank) above carb level if engine does not die from gravity fed fuel then pump is defective (if pulse port found to be pulsing ok)
 

cpdupont68

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It will die at idle and also at increased rpm. after bowl is empty (3 min). I double checked the pump assembly because I thought I must have made a mistake the first time. Looks correct according to manual and several youtube videos. I will try your gravity trick tomorrow. Thank you so much for your help!
 

tphoyt

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Did you by chance use that nasty gray fuel
line? The inner liner can literally melt away and cause blockage. Just a thought
 

Crosbyman

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Did you by chance use that nasty gray fuel
line? The inner liner can literally melt away and cause blockage. Just a thought
tricky thing here the engine works fine and the fuel hose is brand new so it seems doubtful a gray line would have self destroyed itself so fast. the carb is not being replenished by the fuel pump .

one test would be to actually measue the volume of fuel pumped towards the carb inlet WHILE the engine runs its 3 minutes worth of fuel (initially filled in the carb with the hand pump).

Surely a few onces of fuel should be produced out of the disconnected carb inlet hose. IF such a quantity of fuel comes out but fails to fill the carb bowl the inlet needle/float must have a problem that only the hand pump can overcome.

Sticky rubber tipped needle maybe ??? missing pull down clip ??? inverted float ?? )

1783080588909.png
 
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Crosbyman

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based on AI ... say (1.5g/hr x 128 ounces / 60 minutes) x 3 running minutes shoud produce the 9.6 ounces of fuel at low pressure

AI said....
A mechanical fuel pump on a 1976 9.9 HP outboard (whether it's an Johnson or Evinrude two-stroke) doesn't produce much pressure, but it does produce more flow than the engine actually consumes.

Typical values are:

  • Pressure: about 2 to 4 psi (3 psi is very common).
  • Flow: approximately 1 to 2 gallons per hour (3.8 to 7.6 L/h) at idle cranking speeds, increasing with engine RPM.
One caution: if you disconnect the fuel line from the carburetor, the engine will eventually stop because the bowl empties. On a 9.9 HP at idle, that's usually only a minute or two, not necessarily a full three minutes. That's normal. You can still calculate the pump's output by measuring the fuel collected during the actual run time.

Based on everything described over the last few days, I'd rank the likely causes as:

  1. Weak or sticking inlet needle/seat or float problem (most likely).
  2. Weak fuel pump (to be confirmed by your flow test).
  3. Restriction between the pump and carburetor (collapsed hose, blocked fitting, debris).
Your flow test is a good next step because it will tell you whether the pump is actually delivering the volume it should under real operating conditions. If it is, there's little reason to suspect the pump, and attention should shift to the carburetor inlet system.
 
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racerone

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These pumps are used on 3 HP (1968 ) to 25 HP.----Pump plenty of fuel.----But it can be assembled with OUTLET and dome spring in different position.----Also marked with UP .----Make sure it is correct for your motor.----Pump may have been swapped out and they all look the same.
 

cpdupont68

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tricky thing here the engine works fine and the fuel hose is brand new so it seems doubtful a gray line would have self destroyed itself so fast. the carb is not being replenished by the fuel pump .

one test would be to actually measue the volume of fuel pumped towards the carb inlet WHILE the engine runs its 3 minutes worth of fuel (initially filled in the carb with the hand pump).

Surely a few onces of fuel should be produced out of the disconnected carb inlet hose. IF such a quantity of fuel comes out but fails to fill the carb bowl the inlet needle/float must have a problem that only the hand pump can overcome.

Sticky rubber tipped needle maybe ??? missing pull down clip ??? inverted float ?? )

View attachment 417489
 

cpdupont68

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Makes sense that it might be carb related due to the fact it was running fine until I rebuilt the carb over the winter because it was a new motor to me and I had no idea when it was last done. I rebuilt using an OEM kit replacing the old cork float. The first thing I did when I encountered the issue this spring, was to take the carb off again and double check float movement, float level, needle seat and clip. It all seemed right to me. This is why I move on to rebuild the pump and adding new lines and bulb? However the first thing that comes to everyones mind is exactly what you are saying. I will check the pulse behind the pump and try your gravity test before digging back into the carb...ugh! Thanks!
 
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cpdupont68

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Okay... Did the gravity feed test and the engine ran like a champ for over 10 min. without pumping the bulb. I kept it running and lowered it to the ground, and she died with in 2 min at medium throttle. I tried testing the pulse but was difficult to feel much by pulling the rope. Definitely not an obvious push/pull feeling. What now??? Any ideas? Should I blast the port with some carb cleaner?
 
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cpdupont68

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Checked Compression:
Top = 92
Bottom = 99
* roughly a 7% variance which is okay... correct?
 
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