1965 Starcraft Holiday Motor Upgrades

[Skibonzai]

Purchased a 65 Holiday from an estate. The boat was always garaged since new if not out on the water. It's in amazing condition for its age. I seem to be having some difficulty in finding information on upgrading the 4 cyl i/o motor. Since the season is almost here I dont want to go overboard with replacing the motor even though most recommend doing that since the original is difficult to find parts for. Regardless, I'd like to update it with an electronic ignition and if possible, an EFI unit. My experience from my hot rod days taught me that these 2 systems are the most probable to make the boat much more reliable. Hany anyone converted to an electronic and EFI? Have any info regarding that conversion? TIA

 

[jbcurt00]

What 4cyl? OMC or Mercruiser

 

[matt167]

You can't fix an aftermarket EFI or even electronic ignition conversion on the water when it quits. You can however keep a spare set of points and condensor, even spare cap and rotor to get a motor going again

 

[Skibonzai]

What 4cyl? OMC or Mercruiser

Merc

 

[achris]

Could be a Renault engine, or an early GM. Either way you'll not be getting parts for it.

Electronic ignition is a great idea. I did that to my old 165 and it worked really well (built the ignition myself, including hand winding the transformer and etching the circuit board), but aftermarket EFI, not so much. You'll pay as much for the system as the whole boat is worth (actually, probably about 3 times what the boat is worth), IF you could find a system....

You're also going to have corrosion and reliability issues with the drive and transom assemblies..

I know you said you didn't want to replace the engine (and drive and transom assemblies) but that it going to be the quickest, cheapest and most reliable option..

 

[achris]

You can't fix an aftermarket EFI or even electronic ignition conversion on the water when it quits. You can however keep a spare set of points and condensor, even spare cap and rotor to get a motor going again

With modern electronics, electronic ignition and EFI are far more reliable that any points and carb could ever be.

 

[matt167]

With modern electronics, electronic ignition and EFI are far more reliable that any points and carb could ever be.

I've had more than a few CDI ignition boxes fail where I had to bypass it to get home, and petronix will fail if you leave the key on too long.. I mean an extra brand new pertronix kit in a glove box or whatever, it wouldn't be a bad system as it does operate more accurately then points, but points cost $20 for a good set to keep a spare. I had a '51 Chevy with pertronix and it was still 6v. I could start it in negative temps

Aftermarket EFI is good, except the time you have a tuning hicchup and a drive ability issue because of it

 

[achris]

.. and petronix will fail if you leave the key on too long..

Only the Petronix I. Get a Petronix II and that problem doesn't exist.

I've had an MPI engine in my boat for the past 15 years. All I have replaced in that time is the regular oil, oil filter, fuel filter, one set of spark plugs (yes, one set in 15 years), one pair of elbows and an IAC valve. I have friends whose boats I also maintain, and similar stories from their MPIs. The friends with carbs (no Merc V-engine has had points since 1982) have had to have the carb stripped and cleaned every 5 to 7 years (My injectors are 15 years old and still as good as the day bought), and plugs every other year...

If you've had CDI boxes fail, I suggest that it was in the infancy of CDI on boats, and modern units are far more reliable. And given you were able to 'bypass' and get the engine running, suggests they were aftermarket, or home-made... and not at all indicitive of modern elelctronic systems. If modern electrconics is so bad, why aren't people like NASA and the USAF since running thermionic valves? No, the reason is because modern electronics are, by far, more reliable than a mechanical system could ever be.

Chris.

 

[matt167]

Only the Petronix I. Get a Petronix II and that problem doesn't exist.

I've had an MPI engine in my boat for the past 15 years. All I have replaced in that time is the regular oil, oil filter, fuel filter, one set of spark plugs (yes, one set in 15 years), one pair of elbows and an IAC valve. I have friends whose boats I also maintain, and similar stories from their MPIs. The friends with carbs (no Merc V-engine has had points since 1982) have had to have the carb stripped and cleaned every 5 to 7 years (My injectors are 15 years old and still as good as the day bought), and plugs every other year...

If you've had CDI boxes fail, I suggest that it was in the infancy of CDI on boats, and modern units are far more reliable. And given you were able to 'bypass' and get the engine running, suggests they were aftermarket, or home-made... and not at all indicitive of modern elelctronic systems. If modern electrconics is so bad, why aren't people like NASA and the USAF since running thermionic valves? No, the reason is because modern electronics are, by far, more reliable than a mechanical system could ever be.

Chris.

I'm talking about all aftermarket components, which I think the OP is suggesting. The ignition boxes were on vehicles with wheels. 2 MSD's which failed in months, and a Summit box that failed in 2 weeks time.
People seem to have similar experience when they run the same type of boxes on the Chrysler outboards
If he goes adding in aftermarket EFI, and aftermarket ignition, chances are he might not have a great time. Of course an OEM marine MPI system is going to work great

 

[achris]

I'm talking about all aftermarket components, which I think the OP is suggesting. The ignition boxes were on vehicles with wheels. 2 MSD's which failed in months, and a Summit box that failed in 2 weeks time.

The latest Petronix seem to be quite reliable. They did have some issues with the earlier stuff (mostly caused by people leaving the key ON without the engine running) And yes, car systems were a little 'flaky' early on, but that's fixed now.

...Chrysler outboards

'Nough said.

...If he goes adding in aftermarket EFI, ..

On a 1965 4 cylinder? Good luck finding a marine system for that!

 

[matt167]

The latest Petronix seem to be quite reliable. They did have some issues with the earlier stuff (mostly caused by people leaving the key ON without the engine running) And yes, car systems were a little 'flaky' early on, but that's fixed now.

'Nough said.


On a 1965 4 cylinder? Good luck finding a marine system for that!

Holley has a couple of their systems rated with USCG compliance.

 

[achris]

Holley has a couple of their systems rated with USCG compliance.

And they're for modern V-engines, not old 4 bangers.

 

[matt167]

And they're for modern V-engines, not old 4 bangers.

Self tuning 2 and 4bbl replacements that are universal.. problem is the oxygen sensor will never last long enough to get a good tune in... This is the kind of thing I was suggesting the op not do.. you can find videos on youtube of people trying to work them out.and the hotrodder blood suggests it's a good idea. But it's not

 

[Watermann]

Purchased a 65 Holiday from an estate. The boat was always garaged since new if not out on the water. It's in amazing condition for its age. I seem to be having some difficulty in finding information on upgrading the 4 cyl i/o motor. Since the season is almost here I dont want to go overboard with replacing the motor even though most recommend doing that since the original is difficult to find parts for. Regardless, I'd like to update it with an electronic ignition and if possible, an EFI unit. My experience from my hot rod days taught me that these 2 systems are the most probable to make the boat much more reliable. Hany anyone converted to an electronic and EFI? Have any info regarding that conversion? TIA

Welcome aboard, would be great to see pics of this garage find Holly.

My suggestion would be to find a donor boat from the Alpha One series with a 3.0L and stay with the 4 cyl due to weight. The Hollys are very light in the bow and adding something like a V6 would be a weight issue to deal with. The only modifications needed would be the keyhole and 2 bolts for the transom assembly need moved.