Stripping Paint Question

[jsfinn]

Hello,<br /><br />I started work today on my 1954 Chris Craft Express Cruiser. Photos can been seen here - http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/joshs...://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/joshsfinn/my_photos <br /><br />All the wood in the boat is strong so I don't need to pull that much apart to get it restored.<br /><br />Today I pulled off that top cabin part which was added on by the previous owner so that I can put back to the way that it's supposed to look.<br /><br />The boat is made out of plywood mostely and some mahogany. <br /><br />The next step is to strip all of the peeling paint off. Not all of the paint is peeling though. The paint on the bottom and under the floor boards (which is red) is not peeling but is sort of chalky when you run your hand across it. And the paint inside the berth is not peeling either. From what I've read on here and other places on the Internet, if it's not peeling - leave it alone and just paint over it after cleaning it with mineral spirits and steel wool. <br /><br />Also, after I strip the paint, should I coat it in something like CPES? The parts that are painted won't take CPES, so is it better to strip all the paint and CPES everything or will I be ok without doing that? <br /><br />Also, does the brand of stripper matter or are they all pretty much the same? I guess they make a spray on kind and a paste/paint on kind - which is better?<br /><br />Thanks for your advice!<br /><br />-Josh

 

[BillP]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

That is a cool boat. I wish I had one. When I was growing up our neighbor had one just like that with twin 35hp Evinrudes. ChrisCraft also had other kit boats approx that size. <br /><br />A couple of comments:<br />Don't use STEEL wool. It imbeds tiny pieces of steel in the wood and will cause rust spot bleed throughs. Use coarse BRONZE wool if going that route and it won't bleed. Coarse won't clog up as easy either...I've used it many times on wood boats. Use wool with paint stripper for the areas you can't scrape with a straight edge.<br /><br />Yes, you can use epoxy over bare wood but you can also do it the way it was done originally...giving an accurate appearance for the era. They used oil based enamels. Thinned heavily the first 2-3 coats to fill the wood grain and followed up with 2-3 lightly thinned final coats. This is an easy paint system and forgiving in prep and weather.<br /><br />There is a great difference in paint strippers so you just have to ask around and experiment. I've always used the brush on type for boat work. The better stuff will take more layers off at one time. It will take gallons to strip a 17' boat if it has thick paint. I've found 15-20 layers on several 30 yr old wood boats!

 

[jsfinn]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Hi Bill - Thanks for the tips! I'm really lucky with this boat - there is only 2 coats! This boat was stored in a barn for a long time which I think really helped preserve it.<br /><br />I just got off the phone with the Mariners Museum - they are going to send me copies of the plans and sales brochures. The guy there said the same thing - "Wow! You can put twin outboards on that!". I've got the orrignial 1956 30HP Johnson..It might be hard finding another one!

 

[jsfinn]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Any insight into leaving the paint that's not peeling? Better to leave it or better to strip it?

 

[BillP]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

2 coats mean that is probably the original paint or it has been stripped before! Back then lots people used "Porch and Deck" enamel for boats. <br /><br />With only 2 coats stripper will likely take enough off for you just to feather any remaining paint. This is enamel paint and will sand easily if you decide to go that route. Start with 40 grit for removal and then 60 & 80 for final...then paint. If you are experienced with high speed disc sanders start with 36 grit. I can sand a 35' wood sailboat hull down to bare wood in 6-8 hrs this way.<br /><br />What was the guy at the museum talking about...paint or motors? I'm sure he doesn't want you to use poly type paints on that boat. The short of it in wood boats is polyurethane doesn't breath and can trap moisture under the surface. Pinholes or scratches in the paint let water in and that leads to rot. Enamels breath and let moisture out. Whatever you do keep the boat dry and well vented to keep rot away. The ONLY reason that boat lives today is because it never stayed wet long.<br /><br />Find another 30 omc and it will be period correct with twins. That is an extremely rare boat. Bring it down to the annual antique boat meet in Mount Dora Florida when you finish it. All the Chris Craft guys will give kudos.<br /><br />Sure wish I had that boat!

 

[jsfinn]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

BillP - thanks again. I've never done anything like this - but I know I can with a little help! <br /><br />The guy at the museum was talking about the motors. I was a little shocked when he said that because the guy who gave me the boat gave me a brochure for what I thought was my boat but turns out is a slightly different model. The brochure I got with the boat is for a 16-FT. Outboard Express Cruiser. The last line says "Takes outboard motors fro m10 to 40 h.p., for flashing speeds to 27 m.p.h.!" After talking to the guy at the museum, it turns out that this is a Outboard Express Sport Cruiser which can hold 2 40 HP outboards. That's why I was so surprised - I thought I was going to be the slow guy in the bay! <br /><br />Bill, I just want to make sure I'm understanding properly because I want to put this boat back to the way it's supposed to look. If I'm following, you're saying don't use epoxy at all, just thin out oil based enamal for a couple of coats and then paint it with slightly thinned oil enamal.<br /><br />How much do I have to worry about the paint currently on the boat being lead based? I'll wear a mask but is it ok to dry sand it? <br /><br />Sorry to ask so many questions - I just want to make sure that I do it right the first time!

 

[18rabbit]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Nice vessel. As BillP said, not all strippers are created equal. I have discovered application, time to breakdown the paint, and temperature all have an affect on how well a stripper will work. I have stripping paint from wood down to two methods:<br /><br />(1)use Jasco paint and epoxy remover (gold & red can) but only in direct sun where it is warmest. With the painted surface warmed by the sun, this stuff really works miracles. Only the work area should be in the sun, do not leave the can of Jasco in the sun. Buy a gal, pour into a small glass jar, use cheap, 1-½ inch, throw away brushes. Apply light first coat, wait 5-min for the paint surface to start to crack/blister; DO NOT SCRAPE…instead, apply a thick second coat, wait 10 to 15-min, scrape off paint, immediately apply third coat, wait 10 to 15-min, scrape. If it doesn’t scrape off easily, wait 15 to 20-mins before scraping. Work in small areas. You can multi-task two or three small areas but don’t be tempted into a single large area. If you decide to use a stiff nylon brush in crevices or inside-corners with the Jasco, wear safety glasses!!! If there is no sun and/or the surface not warmed, forget the Jasco. Jasco, gloves, and safety glasses wherever paint is sold.<br /><br />(2) use a heat gun. This may not be your best bet if you have small areas of paint to remove. Fan the heat gun across the painted surface to blister but not to the point of scorching the paint…the paint scrapes right off. You will learn how to heat ahead of the area you are scraping. It doesn’t take a lot of heat so start with too little heat and work with it until you figure the right amount of heat you need to remove with paint without scorching it. A heat gun is the quickest, cleanest way to strip a large surface. If you were going to strip that whole boat, it will also be cheaper. Heat guns are sold in the paint dept of Home Depot etc. Look for something in the 12 to 14-amp range. Note: the duplex (receptacle/plug) in the walls of your home are rated for 15-amps continuous…circuit breaker 20-amps. An extension cord with AWG 14 (or AGW 12) conductors is preferred, required if the boat is more than about 20-ft from the duplex. You will need that heavy-duty extension cord for the heat gun to perform properly beyond about 15 or 20-ft. There are some quality, heavy duty extension cords at Costco.

 

[jsfinn]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Fantastic 18rabbit! Thank you very much!<br /><br />I picked up a heat gun the other day but after reading up on stripping paint, I read to not use a heat gun on lead paint becasue the fumes are harmful and the best method is to wet sand/wet strip the paint.<br /><br />Am I being too cautious here? Do I need to be as worried about lead paint as I am being?<br /><br />I'll of course wear a respirator no matter which method I use - along with gloves, but maybe I'm making mountains out of mole hills.

 

[Outrage 19]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Man where’d you find that? I see it's got Maryland numbers on it. It’s gona be a looker when your done.

 

[jsfinn]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Hey Outrage - I got really lucky with it - A guy in Mount Airy offerd it on this forum to the first person to come and haul it.<br /><br />Where in Southern MD are you? We had a great time striper fishing in Deale a few months back. I'm near Fairfax.

 

[Outrage 19]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

I'm in St Mary's county. I've been fishing out of Deale (Happy Harbor) for years. I use to work in Fairfax. Good luck with the new project I hope to see it when it's finished.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Assume any paint applied before 1974 was lead based paint and appropriate precautions should be used. I’m not entirely comfortable with the Jasco fumes. I wouldn’t put my face into the fumes of any of this stuff. I work outside, not in a garage, the bay is right there and provides a breeze so I don’t get concerned about it. Fwiw, when an old house around here burns the fire department isn’t running around with breathing protection, unless getting right into the thick of things. Who knows how many coats of lead paint are burning on these houses, built in the 1920’s. And the lead solder used in our water pipes …<br /><br />The places you are likely to encounter really elevated levels or air-borne lead is (1) gas station, and (2) gun range...lead form a cartridge’s primer chemistry. People that live next door to gas stations have elevated lead in their system but they are breathing the fumes all-day every day/night. Modern indoor gun ranges have positive air pressure behind the shooter to move the air-borne lead down range, away from the shooter(s). Do the same if you use that heat gun, breeze to you back or use a small fan on low-blow mode.<br /><br />I would definitely wear a breathing filter (and eye protection) when sanding lead paint, wet or dry. I have an entire porch to sand but keep putting off…not that it matters when I think about all those asbestos break pads I’ve changed out in the 60’s and 70’s, using compressed air to blow out the asbestos dust…

 

[jsfinn]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Outrage,<br /><br />We went out on the Lynn Marie from the Happy Harbor and my Uncle stores his boat there also. Nice little place! <br /><br />18rabbit,<br /><br />Thanks - I guess it's better to take precautions. <br /><br />I'll put some pictures up next week of a stripped boat!

 

[Outrage 19]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

We go out on Loosen Up with Capt. Frank Carver, Always a good time.

 

[jsfinn]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

That's funny - we tried to go out on Loosen Up except it was booked for the weekend we wanted to Capt. Frank sent us to his cousin Stu who runs the Lynn Marie.

 

[Outrage 19]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Just an FYI I think Frank is the 3rd or 4th generation of charter captin in that family. His father, Frank Sr., retired and now works as his mate. A lot of fishing expearence there.

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Just read the following tip in Boating Magazine's book Quick and Easy Boat Maintenance:<br /><br />"To make your paint stripper lift more paint from a wooden hull, brush it heavily on the wood, and then cover with sheets of plastic wrap. This prevents the active solvent in the stripper from evaporating easily into the surrounding atmosphere. By slowing the solvent's evaporation rate, more solvent stays against the surface of the coating, allowing the stripper to cut the paint film better. Hours later, or even the next morning, peel off the plastic a section at a time and remove the softened paint film."

 

[jsfinn]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Outrage, Stu Jr., was our captain. Stu Sr. was the mate.<br /><br />That must be a salty family reunion!

 

[jsfinn]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

Ralph,<br /><br />Thanks for the tip. I think I'm going to start with a heat gun and if that doesn't work well, I'll head over to Lowes for some stripper.<br /><br />I wonder if leaving stripper on for an extended period of time effects the wood?

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: Stripping Paint Question

I think you have a greater chance of hurting the wood with a heat gun than a chemical stripper. The heat gun can burn the wood. Chemical strippers use solvents that make the paint dissolve. They don't react with wood. The only problem with leaving them too long might be that they re-bond as the solvents evaporate hence the plastic wrap to slow the evaporation. If you think about it, paint and stains have these (or similar) solvents in them and as they evaporate, the paint bonds (dries) to the surface. When you put the solvents back on, the paint de-bonds while the solvents are present. That is the way I remember it. I read a good article about this some time back on a paint related website and I'll try to find the link and post it here.