Firing order?????

[slammedyota91]

Hey guys, Im still trying to get my boat going, and I still havent narrowed my overheating problem. I checked the timing gears today, and they are dead on. So I am thinking maybe my dwell is off. I want to check it, but need to know my firing order. On my plug wires the P/O put tape with 1-4 on them. 1234 water pump (front) to transom (rear) However, at TDC the rotor is pointing at cylinder 4 (according to the P/O writings) Can this engine run 180 out? could this be my timing issue? Its a 1971 Glastron V164 with a Volvo Penta AQ130C with 270 Outdrive. the block is a B20. the motor is a fresh rebuild, But stuck on this overheating issue, and falling on its face under a load. Thanks in advance.

 

[captmello]

Re: Firing order?????

1342 is the firing order. #1 piston is toward the bow of the boat.

have you downloaded the OEM manual for your engine from the adults only sticky?? All the specs are in there.

An out of tune engine can have overheating issues. Get your ignition system adjusted properly and then move on to the overheating issue. Set the Dwell first, using a dwell meter, then the timing.

Let us know how it goes.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Firing order?????

However, at TDC the rotor is pointing at cylinder 4

Is that TDC at the top of the #1 compression stroke? You do realize that it will indicate TDC for #4 as well at the top of its compression stroke.

If you had the distributor 180 out, it wouldn't even run. What dwell angle are you at? You are using a dwell meter to set the dwell right?

Have you checked your compression?

 

[slammedyota91]

Re: Firing order?????

Well, I went to set the dwell today, I guess its supposed to be at 60 +/- 3?? Anyway found out my points were old as hell, got new replacement points, set the dwell to 60 ish, and tried starting it, but now Im not getting any spark, only thing I can think of, is, I took my alt. off today, because when we went to get the points I figured I would have them test that and was gonna pick up a new bolt too. BUT Auto parts stores were all retarded and "couldnt" test my alt without a part number lol. So gay, So when replacing the points I left the alt off to get tested this week. So Im assuming it needs to be hooked up to get spark? dunno why it would have to be.. any help guys?

 

[Bt Doctur]

Re: Firing order?????

try setting the points at .018 to get it running

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Firing order?????

try setting the points at .018 to get it running

You can just crank the motor and set the dwell with the meter that way. It will be closer to the eventual dwell than doing it with a feeler gauge.

 

[slammedyota91]

Re: Firing order?????

Thats how I was setting the dwell, while cranking the motor and adjusted it accordingly. I used a dwell meter. I was cranking while my buddy sat there with the meter adjusting it.

 

[slammedyota91]

Re: Firing order?????

I dont have a feeler gauge, Ill have to get one. Why would it run setting it like that opposed to setting it to 60? I went to 30 with it, because my buddy said thats what most older 4cyl engines with points are typically set to, But still no spark?.. I dont need the alt to have spark right?

 

[slammedyota91]

Re: Firing order?????

I got my alt. tested today, and it is good, Im reinstalling it wednesday and going to hook it back up. change the fuel filter and try to start it. If my points are suppose to be set to 60, and it was at 0-1... Wouldnt that alone cause an overheating and power problem? The spark being way off? Thanks again everyone for your help!

 

[wire2]

Re: Firing order?????

I dont have a feeler gauge, Ill have to get one. Why would it run setting it like that opposed to setting it to 60? I went to 30 with it, because my buddy said thats what most older 4cyl engines with points are typically set to, But still no spark?.. I dont need the alt to have spark right?

Are you by chance confusing dwell angle (degrees) with points gap (thousandths of an inch)?

No, you don't need an alternator to get a spark. The key has to be on to give 12 v to the pos terminal of the coil, the neg comes from ground through the points. Turn the crank until the points close, then open the points with your fingernail. There should be a very faint arc between the points (the condenser is there to suppress it) and there should be a spark from the coil if you have a gap of .025 to .050 from the HV lead to ground

 

[Howard Sterndrive]

Re: Firing order?????

I went to 30 with it, because my buddy said thats what most older 4cyl engines with points are typically set to,

I think your buddy is remembering a 6 cylinder.

50-60 degrees typical for any 4 banger I recall working on.

 

[slammedyota91]

Re: Firing order?????

Well, I hooked my alt. back up, and I for sure have an electrical issue. I have 12.7v at the battery, and somehow on the B+ of the alt. I only have 9.4v. Huge draw somewhere. I think what Im going to do is re wire the ignition and charging portion. There are so many cuts and splices its ridiculous. I have the wiring schematic from the manuals in the sticky thread. So Im going to take on the tedious job of following everything to its destination, If there is a spliced wire, And it for some stupid reason is spliced into another color, Im changing that whole wire with the correct color code. I hate halfass jobs, and I like factory specs lol. Anyway Ill post a build thread from here I guess haha

 

[Howard Sterndrive]

Re: Firing order?????

I have 12.7v at the battery, and somehow on the B+ of the alt. I only have 9.4v.

pretty sure that is proper.

your boat prolly has a ballast resistor to drop the voltage supplied to the coil.

i.e. you have a 9V coil (even though it may say 12V on it)

during cranking, the ballast resistor is bypassed and the coil gets full B+ voltage supply for a nice hot spark at starting
but if it is supplied full B+ continually it will burn out

this is basically how every car ignition from the 1940's to the 1970's was wired

 

[slammedyota91]

Re: Firing order?????

Good drawing, thank you. So if I turn the ignition switch to the crank side, then I should see a full 12.7v on the b+ of the alt? And only 9.7 without the ignition switch on crank...say just on accessory?

 

[slammedyota91]

Re: Firing order?????

Now knowing I dont have a short, is comforting, However Im still going to re do the wires lol, They are just ugly with all the crimps and butt connectors everywhere, Also my battery terminals are horribly crimped on, I got some marine terminals this evening, Im going to throw them on tomorrow. Friday, Im getting the 2 wire regulator to make the wiring on my charging system much more simple. Due to the fact I cant afford a new one wire alt right now (maybe in a few weeks or so) But for now a 30 dollar regulator will do lol. BTW you guys are all awesome the info you have given me has helped in major ways

 

[Howard Sterndrive]

Re: Firing order?????

yes, here's a free d/l of your manual courtesy of Don S- check the wiring diagram to be sure. My 1960's AQ180 has a ballast resistor. I would imagine all points era VP's use them

http://www.4shared.com/get/59747156/6c065c44/AQ130_thru_170_Serv_Man.html

 

[Howard Sterndrive]

Re: Firing order?????

apparently the Swedish call a ballast resistor an "Advance Engaging Resistor"
that's a confusing thing to call it because it makes it sound like it has something to do with timing advance....which it doesn't

 

[slammedyota91]

Re: Firing order?????

yes, here's a free d/l of your manual courtesy of Don S- check the wiring diagram to be sure. My 1960's AQ180 has a ballast resistor. I would imagine all points era VP's use them

http://www.4shared.com/get/59747156/6c065c44/AQ130_thru_170_Serv_Man.html

I have the manual, HOwever a lot of my wires have been spliced into other colored wires all over. So Im just going to end up re wiring it. Gonna jump on it tomorrow. Gotta figure out what the factory colors were and get a few feet of each

 

[slammedyota91]

Re: Firing order?????

Ha, So I started into the wiring today, and was checking out the dizzy and the points, well they were completely backward. SO I have begun re wiring it. I dont know why they spliced everywhere and added wires, all the factory wires are there, no need for more or replacements lol. Anyway, Quick question, Do I need a ballast resistor? or is it okay to not have one? I dont have one.. Someone removed it..

 

[captmello]

Re: Firing order?????

unless you have an internally resisted coil, you do need a ballast resistor.