Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

[PW2]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

The study part is not just for the fuel cell technology--it is how to make it available and affordable.<br /><br />It is going to take a significant energy infrastructure increase to make this available, and more than likely it is going to take significant investment in new nuclear plants, with modern technology.<br /><br />There is no way this is going to be privately funded, as the payback is at least 15 to 20 years out, and no business will invest in that long term a program. On top of that, there is no higher national security program than being non dependent on foreign energy sources, and we do not leave items of national security to the whims of the free market.<br /><br />Oh, and M&R, I agree with those things that make sense. That most of them originate from the Dems, and virtually none of them from the Repubs, just seems to be coincidence. Consistent coincidence.

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

Originally posted by PW2:<br /> and more than likely it is going to take significant investment in new nuclear plants, with modern technology.

PW2, I think ya better check with your man, JFK. Somehow, I don't think that many in his camp are gonna go for this.<br /><br />And Rolmops, your one cent a gallon gas tax, dedicated to alternate energy research is a good idea. How about we take one of the pennies that we already pay, that is undoubtedly being spent for non-automtive purposes, and dedicate that to the research.<br /><br />You're right about runnin on cabbage, I could care less except if that cabbage costs four to five times what we presently pay for gasoline. Kinda reminds me of the Chicken Little sky's falling in, R12 refridgerant/ozone hole scam. Our new politically correct and less efficient refridgerant goes from a dollar a pound to five dollars a pound.

 

[12Footer]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

Originally posted by PW2:<br /> I agree with those things that make sense. That most of them originate from the Dems, and virtually none of them from the Repubs, just seems to be coincidence. Consistent coincidence.

Then you simply have been asleep for the past 4 years, that's all there is to it.<br />I have friends being moved-out of the Everglades under "Eminent domain" laws, to make room for Everglades restoration, the largest-scale , most hidiosly expensive restoration project ever conducted to date.<br />And what of my plans to get a larger motor for my project boat?? What would be the point? A trolling motor would suffice, due to draconian idle zones in the effort to protect the manatee ( a non-native sea mammal that can't get out of the way of boats).<br />Nobody can tell me that the last four years has been anything but a boon to conserving and protecting the ecosystem. It's just the leadership of most whacko groups that usually see to promoting such conservancies are predominantly liberal Bush haters. It really is a shame we cannot come together in the interest of the greater good. So be it. But BS don't fly too well without BS wings attached and a BS propulsion system. Y'all have the propulsion system (media), and the wings (Sierra Club rank-n-file), but you lack the rest ( the body and cargo). But don't fret, mny liberal friend. We will handle your light werk for the next four years also.

 

[PW2]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

I have never checked with the Kerry camp about any of this, and never will.<br /><br />The reality is that alternate energy sources require alternate energy. You simply cannot get by without it. While Hydrogen is the most plentiful atom on earth, you cannot mine it, nor are there large reserves of H molecules suitable for energy production. To produce H2 I doubt if we want to build new coal fired plants, Oil fired plants pretty much defeat the purpose of it, as do natural gas fired plants.<br /><br />While wind and solar are fine, I doubt if they will or could provide the scale we need. Hydro electric is not an option, as we are already extracting virtually as much as we can from our rivers now, and they create their own environmental problems.<br /><br />Perhaps there is some other energy source that we could tap that would not include nuclear, nor would it produce CO2 (as anything that burns does) I don't know. Perhaps we could harness somehow the energy of the tides?!?<br /><br />I have an idea. Let's finance a study of what is and isn't feasible. Let's take a chance and put real scientists to work and get politics and idealogy out of something so important. And go from there.

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

Hey PW2, ya got absolutlely no arguement here. You want the best chance to ramp up nuclear power, though, ya better not vote for Kerry. <br /><br />If Kerry could get the idea past all of the radical environmental whackos in his party, which I doubt, the terrorists would start blowin the plants up. Cause if Kerry gets elected, they'll be comin back over here to do their mischief. You can bank on that.

 

[12Footer]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

PW2, that pretty-much sums it up. But funding studies yields far less when it is applied than does private funding. I call the example of the "X-prize" into the front, to emphasize the importance of making each step away from the use of fossil fuels a profitable one. It's not a matter of IF such research will be profitable, but WHEN it will be profitable. Regular gas is now $1.93 per gallon locally (minus .08 state tax rollback for the month of August). I predict that when the costs of fueling my beasty becomes so absurdly expensive as to stop my production, Haliburton or Shell oil will rush to finish whatever sucessfull research they hold to date, into a marketable solution. After all, if you and I win, they win. If we fail, everyone, including our presscious children fail.<br /> Wanting to protect our resources is noble, even if the ".orgs" that exist ARE predominantly controled by crackpots. But to throw the baby out with the bathwater (to ban one source without a viable replacement) is cival suicide.

 

[Parrott_head]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

I'm curious,<br /><br />With all the wind generated electrical potential we have in the S.W. why don't we use that as a source of hydrogen production. Use the electrical current produced by the wind turbines to split water into it two elements, Hydrogen and Oxygen. <br /><br />Already a big market for bottled O2.<br /><br />Of course this gets into how do you transport Hydrogen across the nation.<br /><br />Just curious.

 

[mike1234tampa]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

Oil in Alaska, Oil in Texas, lots of uneployed people needing jobs, pump our own oil, it may take awile to get up, but it would be worth it<br /><br />30 million, what a @$%$

 

[BinLurkin]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

That's what my wife said last night. All seriousness aside, the answer is nuclear, can you say that? Or did I mean nuc you ler?

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

Originally posted by BinLurkin:<br /> That's what my wife said last night. All seriousness aside, the answer is nuclear, can you say that? Or did I mean nuc you ler?

Regardless of how you say it BinLurkin, it ain't gonna happen with all the eco-freaks your party caters to.

 

[kenimpzoom]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

Guys, nuclear energy is the only answer. Where will the engery come from to create hydrogen? Hydrogen must be made and that requires power. What is wrong with nuclear power? Chernoble is the only problem and it was because of a cheapo design. 3 mile island was the result of pure stupidity.<br /><br />Also, why do we need alternative energy sources? Where are the gas and oil shortages? Where are the problems with the current technology? Emmsions from cars and trucks is very low now. Greenhouse gases can be eliminated by growing more trees. The media wants you all to think we need alternative energy when we have plenty of oil to last many years. There are gillions of hydrocarbon deposits that are known, we just dont have an economical solution to get it out of the ground. In time we will come up with a solution.<br /><br /><br />Ken

 

[BinLurkin]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

Yes, Boomer, it's gonna' happen whether they want it or not. There is no alternative. We can run the nuck-you-ler plants all day for our power & then run them the same speed all night to produce the hydrogen that we will need for the vehicles. That's the only way that is going to work at this point. France is already doing it. Yep, I just switched parties last month. I'm tired of tearing this country down to put a paltry .25 cents in my own pocket. You would sell this country down the drain to put .50 cents back in your pocket wouldn't you, Boomer? Me, if I need more money, I'll just work a little harder for the good of this nation. Not ask for a Government handout like you Republicans do.

 

[BinLurkin]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

 

[JasonJ]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

Ken, there is enough dino juice to last, from what I last read, between 10 and 30 years. The experts all freely admit that they have no solid idea how much longer it will actually last. It could last well past our lifetime as far as anyone knows, but it is just prudent for us to either maximize the resource to make it last longer or wean ourselves off of it. We should be looking for the solutions now before we need to, because it will be truly unpleasent when it does run out. The eco-nazis would want you to belive it will run out tomorrow, but we all know that isn't true. There are better ways to create and use energy, but right now fossil fuel is easy, the infrastructure is there, and it is cheap.

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

Originally posted by BinLurkin:<br />

Your kinda hard to get through to, BinLurkin. As I said above, it ain't gonna happen as long as 'your new party' has any clout at all.<br /><br />If we're lucky the Dems will not only lose the White House but a signifigant number of Senate and House seats, as well. Then we will make some progress on nuclear power.

 

[BinLurkin]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

What, are you nuts, Boomer? I just agreed with you & your arguing with yourself to me? Hence the problem. And Jason, who said there ain't enough? The A-Rabs are pumping up to full capacity at this time. You think there is a diminishing demand for the oil they are putting out? China & all the 3rd world countries are comming on line now & demanding oil. You better wake up & start supporting nuck-you-ler energy real fast. Just ask Boomer, & me too for that matter. You see Boomer, we're a lot alike. Americans, we used to call us.

 

[streadway]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

John Kerry is proposing, if he gets elected, that he would fund a $30 billion dollar study into finding alternative fuel supplies, to lessen our dependancy on foriegn oil!<br /><br />$30 BILLION !<br /><br />30 billion thats a lots less than the seven trillion than were faceing now.

 

[BinLurkin]

Re: Kerry's Proposed $30 BILLION Study

Well, that's a waste, ain't it?