What is the problem with Bayliner?

slarson · May 6, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

Well, have all of you nothing better to do than bash boats that most of you have never owned? Doesn't that smell funny to any of you? Get a life already! I started out with a Hallett (Anyone want to bash them? You people on the East coast probably don't know what they are. Take your best shots.), then went to 4 different Bayliners, from a 19' cuddy to my current 35' Avanti. I liked all of them, and still like the one I have. Believe it or not, they all stayed together. On each occasion of a new purchase, I got in and rode in other boats (Sea Ray, Wellcraft, Glastron, etc.) and liked the Bayliner better each time. I'm not new to boating (30 years), so please don't confuse me with a "new boater". I do know that I have a new lack of respect for advice given on this forum. Sad. Boating magazine usually does a pretty good job of representing things objectively. Do any of you remember when the America's Cup was in California and they used 2855's as their chase boats? Probably not. Oh, well. Take your best shots. I won't be back. I was only here at this site to get an unrelated question answered, but I know better now.

oldboat1 · May 6, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

Well slarson, I hope you reconsider and come on back. I equate these Bayliner discussions to discussions comparing wood boats to fiberglass. The fiberglass folks sometimes seem to have the idea that anything made of that other product couldn't be expected to float. The anti-Bayliner folks seem to feel the same way about Bayliners. It's not a local thing either. When we lived in Seattle, there was a lot of boater hostility directed at Bayliner, and that was a local industry....

62_Kiwi · May 6, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

When you think about it - aren't brands a strange thing ? The different designs come and go, the people and companies building products come and go, the factories, the procedures, the technologies, the quality control, the shareholders, just about everything else can change - but the brand (often) remains the same. Our minds latch on to the brand and associate any good or bad experiences, so we become a supporter, indifferent or a detractor. It can get emotional, like supporting a football team. Logic can get a bit left behind if we don't review our opinions from time to time, to check that we're keeping up with the changes that are happening behind the brand. Just my 2 cents...

Jersey Jim · May 7, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

Are you ever right - 62_Kiwi. Take for example the Boston Whaler line of boats. They're on their fourth corporate owner since the original B/W company. People were buying Whalers made by the folks who made "nordic track ski exercisers" (CML company), then the Reebok sneaker corporation; thirdly the Meridian group; and now Brunswick. The name Boston Whaler still has a loyal following and I doubt if the owners of these boats realize that it's only a name. (No knock meant against BW - it was the first example that came to mind.)

62_Kiwi · May 7, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

Jersey Jim - welcome to the best boating board on the planet and thanks for your comments. I didn't know the history of B/W but it sounds like a good example of the case in point. Despite having brand loyalties myself, I did experience the other side of the coin in business a few years ago when trying to launch a new product with an unknown brand. It doesn't matter that you might have a better product - people just feel safer with a known brand and it's hard work to counter that. So I well understand why some companies will buy other companies just to get at their well-known brands to attach to their own products.

JS2 · May 7, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

So BW has had 4 different owners. What has that got to do with their quality? The owners are just the people who push the paper. I love how Bayliner owners say they sea-trialed several other brands of boats and liked how the Bayliner rode best. What counts is how a particular boat holds up after 5+ years of service. This is where Bayliner boats just don't make the cut.

Makofanatic · May 8, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

I have come to a conclusion, There is no problem with Bayliner

doyle101 · May 9, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

You people are really Funny.. I have had Bayliners since 84' and must agree that back in the 80's they were mass produced more frequently and the quality was not there. BUT.... The new 2002 Models are amazing and have gotten Excellent reviews, here is one : http://boatpoint.ninemsn.com.au/Reviews/BoatTestMain.asp?ID=117909 I currently own the Bayliner 185 Capri 2002 Model, and couldent be more happy with it, I compared it to Blue Water and Rinell, and both were more then 7,000 more for the same thing, and some had smaller engines. As for bayliner the big misconception is that they are CHEAP and bottom of the line for price.. Well, the reason they are less expensive is because they are mass produced, and they have very little options, as well as only 1 Color choice to reduce costs. The new Liners come with Lifetime Hull warrantys, as well as 3 year engine and part warranty's which are excellent. Also included in the new designs are the APS anti Suction hulls for increased performance, as well as some great features.. As the guy says in the article, the Bayliners are the best bang for your buck, Why pay 7,000 more for less options? I have no idea.. Thats up to you... As for manufacturing, Brunswick manufactures them all, including Maxium and Crestline and some other higher end brands, and bayliner has come up over the years.. Posting picures of rotted Decks or stringers or what not is not impressive, truth be told, if you treat your boat like CRAP, then it will become CRAP.. Ive seen some POS 80's Liners, but I have also SEEN some other POS Boats as well.. I wouldent avoid these new Liners, Id avoid the old ones, with the warranty's how could you go wrong? Take care of the boat and it will last.. Thrash it and it will be Thrashed, Simple as that. -Doyle

Scottj25 · May 9, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

My first boat was a 1984 1600 Bayliners never had aproblem with it, it even had that bad 85hp Force O/B so everyone said. I moved up to a Bayliner 1950CL and the WIFE loves it (this is a must as most of you know) the kids have a blast in it. Bayliner has had problem in the past but I remember reading some where that 7 out of 10 boats sold are Bayliners. So if there so bad how come they have sold so many how come? Could it be that for the most part we the customer are getting a good bang for our dollar? sure they have a problem boat evey now and then but what manufactur has not? Check the USCG recall list and you'll see that for all the boats that are sold Bayliner has damm few problems. I love my boat and when its time to move up it'll be another Bayliner.

suzukidave · May 9, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

88 posts and counting plus another thread and some people still say there's no issue with Bayliners. Methinks they do protest too much.

I know I'm not going to succeed in shutting this silly debate down, but I'll try and steer a middle course: 1. Bayliners are very good value for boaters who accept their limitations. More on the limitations later. Also they are very good boats for people who use them occasionally, maintain them scrupulously, and so never run into those limitations. 2. Bayliner stack up very well against lots of midrange boats which really do not have a great quality advantage or much else to offer for the extra money. This is especially true of boats built mainly for cruising at speed. Bayliners do speed very well for a low $. 3. Now the limitations. Bayliners do not do longlasting quality. Their hulls are too light and they do not hold up to the pounding you get in open water. Components are cheap so they don't last in a marine environment. Sorry but I've seen new and old Bayliners and it's better now but still true. They wouldn't be offering a lifetime warranty on their hull if they didn't have a well earned reputation (I wish those people trying to collect on these warrantys in ten years good luck by the way -- check your fine print exceptions). 4 A real serious limitation is their ability to hold up to regular use in anything but favourable boating conditions, which is a function of their lightweight design and speed at all costs hull shape. They are not for you if you are a serious or daily boater on waters that see weather (and nor are a host of other boats higher up the scale). A bayliner will fall apart if you try to use it like that. 5. Now the kicker. Nobody in their right mind would buy a bayliner for serious open water duty. People who buy Bayliners plan on never being out in a storm. People who want a back up plan in case it happens anyway do not buy a bayliner or a lot of other more expensive boats. They pay a serious premium for a boat that will hold up. Some posters on this thread would say they worry too much. Not me. The water around where I boat is in the low 60's in August. So is everybody in this debate happy now?? (I didn't think so)

88spl · May 9, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

I have a Bayliner Capri 1987 (Boat Of The Year). I paid $1000.00 for it in 1995. The floor was beyond patching up, the motor was new 1993 88hp Evinrude. I put a new floor in it, carpet, and had the motor checked out. Replaced the seats and had the cushions re-upolsted. In all I have put about $2000.00 into it. I love it. Several people have commeted on how good it looks, but if they only knew what it looked like befor I fixed it up. I personaly would not buy a new Bayliner. I think for those of us that are tightwads, and are looking for a good deal, find a used Bayliner, and fix it up!!!!!

Homerr · May 9, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

I agree. It's time to let this post go away! We've beat this subject up enough. (By the way.. I love my 2001 215LX Bayliner) H.

Spidybot · May 10, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

Conclusion: Those in favour of Bayliner: Buy one. Those in favour of something else: Do not buy a Bayliner. Choose which ever boat meets your needs and expectations. Be happy if you have no problems with it and learn your lesson when you do. Regardless of the brand or make. I won't tell what I have

mark simon · May 12, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

I'm new to this forum and I just stumbled onto this topic. I have owned three bayliners. My first was a 27', next a 32' and my last one a 38'. I can honestly say, that I have had little or no problems with any of them. I just sold the 38' which I purchased new in 84. In the years I owned it, other than normal routine repairs, I spent maybe eight thousand dollars over a period of 18 years. The person I sold the boat to just spent ten grand on it, but I attribute that to the fact that I left it in an uncovered berth for several years, which caused some rotting on the deck. Bayliner made a lot of changes in the way they built a boat, after the company was taken over in I believe 1982, by Orin edson (not sure of the spelling). I met him at a party and was very impressed by his ideas of how a boat should be built.

SS MAYFLOAT · May 19, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

Great Balls of Fiberglass! I doesn't matter who the manufacture is, if there is no quality control in the process of the manufacture of each and every boat, those that lack the QA (Quality Assurance)is bound to have a poorly constructed boat. The problems are within the plant workers. If the worker is not dedicated to the job and look at their job as a paycheck, the quality of thier work is going to be poor. But if all the workers are dedicated to their product, the product is going to be of good quality and built with pride. Example as follows and I wish I had taken pictures of what I found. I had to remove my 100 gallon fuel tank due to about 30 years of debri in the tank. This tank is about 8' long so it hides about an 8' foot section of the hull. Upon exposing the tank everthing looked great. But once the tank was removed exposing the 1/2 inch plywood underneath the tank, it was evident that someone was in a hurry to either go home or to lunch. The 7 ribs that lay under the plywood and to the hull was hardly covered with glass, but where the ribs were exposed to a line of sight, they were covered nicely, about 3/8" thick of glass. This to me is proof that it is not the manufactures fault, but the worker doing a shotty job not caring that peoples lives that will use the product. I feel with todays standards on drug/alcohol testing, America will have better products. If your the type that drives a Lexus, your not going to buy a low end product, because you want to show your money and how you spend it. It is the game of "Showing Off your Income". I personnally don't give a flying crap on how much money you have or spend. And if you are the one that has a large income "DON"T BUY BAYLINER and then if you do, "Don't B*tch about them" All this negative publicity is publicity and is just feeding the Bayliner Company with advertising. Good or Bad, it is putting the Bayliner name in peoples minds. In the military we used to have At-a-Boys. You did something good, you got an At-a-boy. You could have as many at-a-boys there could be, but one ah-shi?, wipes your slate clean. Then nobody remembers what all the good things you have done, but they will remember that one AH-SHI? for ever! I tend to remember all the fun on the water over one or two break downs. It can happen to anything that is mechanical. Look at all the crap on the space shuttle, Things break on it too! and it is designed and built by the best brains in our country.

Capn Mike · May 22, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

Aww, jeez. I wasn't going to add anything to this post except that as I was going down to my boat this past Saturday, I see a 2001 Trophy leaving the dock under auxliary power. The guy who did the 6 month check-up forgot to hook up the shifter correctly. Then as I'm coming into my berth, a 28' Bayliner right behind me suddenly starts smoking and barely makes it into the slip. Seems as though a cooling hose broke. One could look at both incidents and say, "Bayliners suck," but obviously neither incident is the fault of the manufacturer. I'm guessing Chevy engines (used on 90% of outdrives) have busted cooling hoses before, and that sloppy mechanics abound regardless of make. But see how rumours start?

Makofanatic · Jul 12, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

that sounds like mercs problem and neither chevys or bayliners

waterguy · Jul 12, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

Wow....all these replys are great!!! I find it interesting that Makofanatic started his thread by saying he wasn't making a sales pitch but was just asking why so many people didn't like Bayliners. Then when we told him, he got passive aggresive and starting telling us how many he sells. He's mistaking Quality for Quantity. Just because you sell a lot of anything doesn't make it good. The fact is, we all look at each others boats when we put them in the water, and just like cars, some are expensive and some are not. Those people that drive KIAs don't really think that those of us who have Cadillacs are thinking that the KIA is better because they paid less for it do they? Then why would a person in a Bayliner think that we feel they got a better deal in their less expensive boat. Come on, we all think the same thing when we see a Bayliner. "There is a cheap boat. Get real, Bayliners are great boats to get staretd with, but they are entry level boats at best and we all know it. Go to the "JD Powers" website and see for yourself. They evaluated the 2001s, and they rated them at the bottom. I don't care if you sell a million of them,that won't change the quality of them. If they are getting better, then they will have an up hill climb to get their customer base back. Only time will tell. You asked, now don't be angry because we told you.

mid life crisis · Jul 12, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

who IS this guy?

lepper · Jul 12, 2002

Re: What is the problem with Bayliner?

Um.... I looked at bayliners for about .2 sec.. and said no..... But then again, I didn't want a glass boat at all.. My first boat was a glas boat and didn't like it. always had to be so careful with it... So I got an alumaweld.... I like the stronger material..... But other then that if I was going to get a new glass boat I would have problbay looked at them. dave

What is the problem with Bayliner?

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