77 champion restoration

[Cmac2008]

Ok got about another 1 1/2 hours in on grinding. Got the transom about 95% done and about 3 foout up on the hull. The only thing im running into is the area in red is very very thick resin im guessing. Like 1/2 inch atleast. Do i need to grind this down to glass or just smooth it up? Also my drain hole sits up about 1/2 inch from the hull, does this need to be lowerd flush with bottom?

 

[ondarvr]

Fill the drain plug hole and just glass over it when you put the new transom in, then re-drill it wherever it works best later.

​You "should" grind out the old thick resin, but it appears to have survived all the years, and if you're doing more glass work in that area it can be glassed over, not the best method, but shouldn't cause any issues if you decide to go that route.

 

[gm280]

Ok i have these two spots on my transom. I did not take a pic of the other. U can see the hole but there is also about a 3" crack that you can see on the back. Do i need to cut this out in a nice square or fill it like it is? Also will i just use pb to fix this or is there another method?

If you own a dremel tool or even a die grinds, I would grind those places out to clean solid material, and then if they are not very large, I would mix up some peanut butter with either 1/4" or 1/2" cropped fiberglass mixed in the PB and fill them in. Then go over the area with either CSM or 1708 to finish it off, but also feather in so it isn't standing out so you will have a smooth flat surface on the outside hull.

As you work with polyester and fiberglass and PB, you will see how it can work for so any areas. You can control the mixtures to get thick putty like mixtures, or thin syrupy mixtures by adjusting the ingredients. The real key to working with polyester is mix things well before using the kicker MEKP. Because once that is added, it needs to be thoroughly mixed to make sure it is mixed with all the ingredients, and the clock starts ticking.

Looks like you're doing great work thus far. :thumb:

 

[Baylinerchuck]

Ok got about another 1 1/2 hours in on grinding. Got the transom about 95% done and about 3 foout up on the hull. The only thing im running into is the area in red is very very thick resin im guessing. Like 1/2 inch atleast. Do i need to grind this down to glass or just smooth it up? Also my drain hole sits up about 1/2 inch from the hull, does this need to be lowerd flush with bottom?

If it were me, I would grind out the thick area of resin, especially if you need to do layups in that area. Resin without fibers can crack if flexed and really ads nothing but weight. Wait.....actually this was me. I had the same sloppy kind of work in the Chap I'm restoring. Resin was gooped all over the place. I ground it down to fresh glass.

 

[Baylinerchuck]

If you own a dremel tool or even a die grinds, I would grind those places out to clean solid material, and then if they are not very large, I would mix up some peanut butter with either 1/4" or 1/2" cropped fiberglass mixed in the PB and fill them in. Then go over the area with either CSM or 1708 to finish it off, but also feather in so it isn't standing out so you will have a smooth flat surface on the outside hull.

As you work with polyester and fiberglass and PB, you will see how it can work for so any areas. You can control the mixtures to get thick putty like mixtures, or thin syrupy mixtures by adjusting the ingredients. The real key to working with polyester is mix things well before using the kicker MEKP. Because once that is added, it needs to be thoroughly mixed to make sure it is mixed with all the ingredients, and the clock starts ticking.

Looks like you're doing great work thus far. :thumb:

Only thing I would say is add the MEKP before the cabosil and strands or other thickeners. The reason being is that things can get pretty hard to stir. If you are only adding between 1% to 2% catalyst to a batch of thickened resin, it could be nearly impossible to get it mixed in thoroughly. Honestly mixing in thickeners is pretty quick, especially if adding strands. The strands REALLY help the mixing process, especially if the silica clumps slightly. Some folks on here have mentioned sitting the resin bucket in an ice bath to cool it thus giving you a longer working time. I've never tried that myself and haven't done any layups in 90 degree temps either. I would rather work fast and know my hardener is mixed thoroughly.

Nice work thus far!!

 

[ondarvr]

While some DIY'rs like to catalyze and then mix in the fillers, it's almost never done that way in a glass shop, they buy it in 5 gallon pails or drums pre-mixed to the consistency and formulated for the application, it's then scooped or pumped out and catalyzed as needed. While theoretically catalyzing first and then mixing in the fillers should be better, it just isn't done, and no issues result from not doing it.

 

[ondarvr]

For the holes and gouges/cracks in the transom, do most of it from the inside. If the cracked area is uneven, try to line up the two surfaces, then grind 90+% of the crack out from the backside and re-glass it, now make the repair on the outside as small as possible, just big enough to cover the crack and blend into the surrounding surface (an inch or so to each side). This gives you glass on both sides, but keeps the cosmetic portion of it as small as possible. You probably wouldn't need to use putty to fill anything on the crack, but hole could use some putty in it.

 

[gm280]

I guess mixing in the MEKP is synonymous with which 2 cycle oil is better. :noidea:

I have done it both ways and I like mixing the catalysts (MEKP) last. And believe me, I have mixed over 20 gallons polyester without but one failure. And that failure was my very first mix. Seem it didn't want to cure. It took days for it to cure. I honestly don't know why either. Because I mixed it exactly to that very last smidget to their exact specification on the instructions. And it wasn't any PB either but a simple polyester resin MEKP mix.

But you can do it most anyway YOU like. There is no one way fits all. Some will have problems doing it one way and not the other. It is just how things work. I am certainly not claiming my way is the only way, far from it. If just works better for me. JMHO

 

[Cmac2008]

For the holes and gouges/cracks in the transom, do most of it from the inside. If the cracked area is uneven, try to line up the two surfaces, then grind 90+% of the crack out from the backside and re-glass it, now make the repair on the outside as small as possible, just big enough to cover the crack and blend into the surrounding surface (an inch or so to each side). This gives you glass on both sides, but keeps the cosmetic portion of it as small as possible. You probably wouldn't need to use putty to fill anything on the crack, but hole could use some putty in it.

Would it be possible doing it without putting glass in the outside. I was thinking to maybe clean up the hole and cut the crack wide enough to fill with resin. I could put masking tape on the outside and fill with resin from the inside and glass the back. Just a thought

 

[ondarvr]

You can sand more off from the inside until it's almost paper thin and do a smaller repair on the outside, but not with just resin. Resin is very weak and brittle, putty is a little better, but is not that strong. In those locations it's not going to be that noticeable, so a small repair on the outside isn't going to stand out. You might even be able to get away with doing nothing, but it will be a little more difficult, just see what it looks like when you finish the inside. Put some tape over the crack on the outside so resin doesn't seep through and run down the outside and mess it up.

 

[Cmac2008]

You can sand more off from the inside until it's almost paper thin and do a smaller repair on the outside, but not with just resin. Resin is very weak and brittle, putty is a little better, but is not that strong. In those locations it's not going to be that noticeable, so a small repair on the outside isn't going to stand out. You might even be able to get away with doing nothing, but it will be a little more difficult, just see what it looks like when you finish the inside. Put some tape over the crack on the outside so resin doesn't seep through and run down the outside and mess it up.

Ok thanks i meant pb not resin. Im still getting use to the glass lingo. Im getting ahead of myself i got ALOT of grinding still

 

[gm280]

I would use some type of sheet plastic like a plastic bag or a Zip Lock bag that would easily cover over the out side hole after grinding all the old glass out from the inside like "ondarvr" suggested..

Since this is on the transom area, when you install your new transom, the PB mixture you use will basically cover over that area as well. If the plastic bag is pulled very tight on the outside and taped up well, you should end up with a nice smooth exterior finish. And the plastic bag will peel off after the transom cures, without any problem. JMHO

One thing you need to understand. There are no one way to do anything repairing boats. So many different ideas will be offered, and you can select what you like best. I say that so you don't think you have to follow any of the suggestions offered or it fails. You may have an even better idea and can share with everybody here as well. That IS what these forums are all about. Learning new ways to do things. JMHO

 

[Cmac2008]

I would use some type of sheet plastic like a plastic bag or a Zip Lock bag that would easily cover over the out side hole after grinding all the old glass out from the inside like "ondarvr" suggested..

Since this is on the transom area, when you install your new transom, the PB mixture you use will basically cover over that area as well. If the plastic bag is pulled very tight on the outside and taped up well, you should end up with a nice smooth exterior finish. And the plastic bag will peel off after the transom cures, without any problem. JMHO

One thing you need to understand. There are no one way to do anything repairing boats. So many different ideas will be offered, and you can select what you like best. I say that so you don't think you have to follow any of the suggestions offered or it fails. You may have an even better idea and can share with everybody here as well. That IS what these forums are all about. Learning new ways to do things. JMHO

Agree 100% with everything you just said... see i was going to use tape but did not think about the pb sticking to it. Im just looking for the big red flags and i want to hear NO DONT DO THAT... befor i do it lol

 

[Cmac2008]

Ok guys still going strong on grinding. Gotta take a break this weekend for drill so i thought id get some more info. This is the transom area on my cap. It was glassed to my transom about 8 inches down and then capped over the top of the transom. I had to do alot of cutting to get it free. My question is how in the hell do i glass this back to the transom. How will i get glass between the transom and the cap. This will make the cap and transom one piece.

 

[gm280]

Ok guys still going strong on grinding. Gotta take a break this weekend for drill so i thought id get some more info. This is the transom area on my cap. It was glassed to my transom about 8 inches down and then capped over the top of the transom. I had to do alot of cutting to get it free. My question is how in the hell do i glass this back to the transom. How will i get glass between the transom and the cap. This will make the cap and transom one piece.

Okay, that is an interesting picture for a lot of reasons. First you need to grind off any extra fiberglass so it fits without any problems. Remember, the transom will be totally new as well and of proper thickness. So the cap will go back on and then you fiberglass everything together at the top of the transom. It then becomes one piece again. You also blend in everything via grinding, sanding, filing and whatever it takes. I think you will see better when that time comes.

Second issue with the picture, what is that tree limb doing there? :noidea: Odd to see that in a rebuild picture. JMHO

 

[Cmac2008]

Okay, that is an interesting picture for a lot of reasons. First you need to grind off any extra fiberglass so it fits without any problems. Remember, the transom will be totally new as well and of proper thickness. So the cap will go back on and then you fiberglass everything together at the top of the transom. It then becomes one piece again. You also blend in everything via grinding, sanding, filing and whatever it takes. I think you will see better when that time comes.

Second issue with the picture, what is that tree limb doing there? :noidea: Odd to see that in a rebuild picture. JMHO

OK I knew someone would call me out on the limb. There was a big storm last night and I'm working on getting the limbs cleaned up. And I will be grinding all the old glass off when I'm to that point. I guess I just don't understand how I will get glass between these two surfaces. I will have no problem getting the top fiberglass done but the sandwich piece between the transom and this vertical piece of the cap

 

[gm280]

OK I knew someone would call me out on the limb. There was a big storm last night and I'm working on getting the limbs cleaned up. And I will be grinding all the old glass off when I'm to that point. I guess I just don't understand how I will get glass between these two surfaces. I will have no problem getting the top fiberglass done but the sandwich piece between the transom and this vertical piece of the cap

Using a PB mixture with chopped fiberglass with take care of that issue when the time comes. We will guide you through all of those things. There are lots of folks on these forums that have done that exact thing with theirs and will assist as well. :thumb:

I was figured a limb must have tried to get a ride in the boat for free. Hope everyone was okay. Limbs can be time consuming to clear away some times. BTDT

 

[Cmac2008]

Using a PB mixture with chopped fiberglass with take care of that issue when the time comes. We will guide you through all of those things. There are lots of folks on these forums that have done that exact thing with theirs and will assist as well. :thumb:

I was figured a limb must have tried to get a ride in the boat for free. Hope everyone was okay. Limbs can be time consuming to clear away some times. BTDT

Thanks gm i aprecciate all the info.. i overthink stuff quite often. I can see how the pb will make all this doable now. And yes everyone is ok i just have some old oak and maples that lose alot of limbs... goibg to have to do some tree trimming soon. But 40 mph winds will trim alot for me

 

[ondarvr]

I had typed this the other day, but must have gotten distracted not hit post reply.

Plastic will allow resin to seep through the crack onto the outside surface, tape (packing tape works well) won't allow any to flow through the crack, it will leave a smooth surface with just a line the size and shape of the crack. The smoother you apply the tape, the better the outside finish will be. I wouldn't expect perfection on your first attempt, but with some attention to detail it may turn out good enough that you won't have an actual repair on the outside.

 

[Woodonglass]

I agree with ondarvr. Just tape the outside with several layers of packing tape and fill the damage with PB from the inside. then apply two CSM patches and it'll be fine.