Re: Yamaha F225 (4 Stroke) vs. Yamaha Z250 (2 stroke) HPDI
All,<br />Thanks for the replies. These forums are invaluable when you are talking about making a 12000 to 15000 dollar mistake.<br /><br />Just for comparison purposes here are some more responses from other sites. I'll keep adding to this reply as more info comes in. Yamamma's are pretty popular engines, so maybe this info will be used in a future search:<br /><br />scorecard:<br />4stroke = 13 votes<br />2stroke = 5 votes<br /><br />1)BOTH ARE GOOD ENGINES but i think your freind would want the performance of the 250 hpdi as the f225 ferforms closer to the 2oo hpdi.they will be about the same as far as fuel usage granted you have the oil usage on the hpdi but it's not that bad considering the xtra get up & go under full load you would get from the 250.also don't forget you have the the oil change on the four stroke.good luck on your frends new boat<br /><br />2)I would opt for the 250 Hpdi. Here are my reason's 1-The oil & gas consumption & noise would not be a factor. 2- The maintenance on the 4 stroke will be more. 3- The Hpdi will be a better performer ( out of the hole better 7 better in a following sea ). I have run twin 115 - 4's & was very happy w/them for the exception of get up & go. I've been on boat's w/the 225 -4 & boat's w/200 Hpdi's & the Hpdi's are better.<br />Also as the above post stated U have to change the motor oil every 100 hour's. There's alot more maintenance w/the 4's. If U don't use the boat alot there's no saving's buying a 4.I just orderd a new boat & went w/the 200 Hpdi's & I use my boat almost every day the season. Just my 0.02.<br /><br />3)It's a good bet that the 4-stroke will give you much better fuel economy than the 2-stroke. The difference in oil comsuption will be less also, as the 4-stroke does not burn oil. Just needs a regular change. Since preformance is not a top priority and the cost is about the same, it is a no brainer!! Mr Forktail will be along later with more info.<br /><br />4) for average rec use I would get the 250HPDI... If he used the boat 300-400 hours a year... I might go to the 4-stroke.<br />**I think he'll do 300 + hrs**<br /><br />5) that's a heavy boat. You're going to need the 250hp. A 225 may be slightyly underpowered. At times, you'll wish you had more. Fuel consumption should be very close between the 2. <br /><br />6) Just a comment about performance of the 4 stroke. I have a friend who has a 27 ft. Eastern, Chesapeake Model, very similar but larger than a Parker 25 ft. Sport Cabin, equipped with a Honda 225 four stroke and he tops out at 43 miles per hour via GPS. I own a Yamaha F100 on a 23 ft. Carolina skiff and I top out at 42 MPH. According to tests, the Yamaha and Honda 225 HP four strokes are very close in performance.<br /><br />7)I own the Parker 2300 DV CC w/F225 Yamaha. The boat came equipped with the 4-stroke and I love it! As I stated in other posts, I have been a long time Yamaha owner(2-strokes), but now, would never own a 2-stroke again, unless the boat I wanted came with a 2- stroke. I would buy either motor, but given the choice would take the 4-stroke any day! I often wonder how many boater's on this forum have ever owned both 2 and 4 stroke motors as I have as the "performance" issues are in my opinion are a non-issue! The biggest difference in "off the line" performance that I have seen, on similar equipped boats, has been .4 seconds! .4 seconds may mean something to a top fuel dragster, but, to you and me out fishing, get real! My father-in-law owns a Hydrasport with the 250 Yamaha and I must say, is an extremely quiet and smooth motor,but,when he fishes in my boat, says he would take the 4-stroke over the 250 if he had the choice.As in any "drag" race, there is driver error and reaction time involved. I would welcome any other Parker, similar to mine, equipped with a 2-stroke of the same H.P., to do a comparison.I almost guarantee the numbers would be so close that they would not even be arguable.<br />As I do agree, your friend would be happy with either motor, GET THE 4-STROKE!Even if the performance numbers and fuel mileage were identical, the quietness, smoothness and not having oil smoke or reservoir to deal with is worth it. When you start talking about price being an issue, then nobody would own a Yamaha as they are the highest priced motor on the market, at least in this area.So bottom line could be "you get what you pay for" and in my mind, the Yamaha 4-stroke is as good as it gets!<br />Might I add to the "off the line" performance comments. From what I understand, the Parker 2300 DV CC w/F225 Yamahs is on plane in 4 seconds. If the same boat with a 2-stroke is .4 seconds faster and if plane speed is around 20 m.p.h., then.4 seconds is less than 11 feet! This works out to less than half a boat length from 0 to plane! Where in the world would this difference ever matter, other than a drag race? Wow, I never realized I was losing so badly by owning the 4-stroke! <br /><br />8)Guys the new hpdi are a big improvement over the old 2 cycle motors. To me its a no brainer, buy the 250. Many folks ive talked to who have 23 Regulators w/225 4 strokes are very disappointed in the performance. How much does the Parker weigh? Also gauge acceptable performance in the 4000 - 4500 RPM range not at higher RPM 's<br /><br />9)The 250 hpdi is a totally different motor than the old OX66 saltwater series with regard to smoking, noise level and rough running a slow speeds. <br /><br />10)I have talked with several people who own the F225's or 250 HPDIs. The 225 owners seem to be happier. It sounds like they are still working the bugs out of the 250's. Nothing big. Typic first model year things like excessive oil burn, etc. But I heard more than one of them say that someone convinced them to buy the HPDI's and now they wish they had gone with the 4-stroke.<br />I heard this same stuff again while wandering around the Contender Dock at the Naples SKA tournament this past weekend. The reason I responded to this post is that I heard from more than one person that a dealer had pushed them towards the HPDI's and now they wished they had the 4-strokes<br /><br />11)The HPDI's do infact smoke, maybe not to the degree of older 2-stroke designs but they still do. Also consider the expenses of oil ($10-15 gal) with gas prices expected to be pushing $2.50+ a gallon at the marina, ring free, and fouled plugs at low rpms....Is that extra 2-5 mph worth the above aggrevation?<br /><br />12)I have a 23SCDV with an F225 on a bracket.<br />If you nail the throttle I can guarantee that, unless prepared, all occupants of the boat will be injured and/or fall out.<br />Granted, I don't do much racing, but power is fine. I carry a lot of gear.<br />I have another boat with a 2-stroke. I won't even consider going back.<br />Aside from a belt squeak that went away after a few hours of use, the motor has operated flawlessy. (~250 hrs if memory serves) <br /><br />13)MY 2 cents the 4 stroke- I have a 200 honda and love it- the quietness and no smell. Never againa 2 stroke (Yes the HPDI's smell less than the old 2 strokes but they smell when yr trolling down wind.)<br />Think the notes are right on- <br />clearly 4 stroke not as quick per HP and more sensitive to propping over prop and you kill them , check the Yamaha performance bulletins I think your boat may be listed didnt recheck.<br />small gas savings- with 4 stroke, more if you troll a lot not much if any at cruise HPDI basically same at cruise<br />My guess is 4 stroke will have a better resale- but crystal ball may be broken on that point.<br /><br />14)I just went through this same exercise while re-powering my boat and the people on this board were great. I decided on the 4strokes for many reason but the quite operation and economy were the keys. I also did not realize that the Johnson's were made by Suzuki and got a better deal on the Suzi's.<br /><br />15)The Z250 is Yamaha's new 2003 HPDI 3.3L big block. I don't have any history on this outboard, or know anyone who runs one. You may want to wait and see how this outboard pans out over time, although IMO (and JD Power), the Yamaha's all have a good reputation. The F225 has been out for a few years and it's been extremely good.<br />Besides the 25 hp difference (hardly noticeable) here are some differences between the two...<br />F225 = 583 lbs<br />Z250 = 543 lbs<br />F225 Alternator output = 45 amps<br />Z250 Alternator output = 50 amps<br />F225 max rpm = 6000<br />Z250 max rpm = 5500<br />F225 gear ratio = 2.00<br />Z250 gear ratio = 1.81<br />F225 warranty = 3 years<br />Z250 warranty = 2 years<br /><br />The Z250 is oil injecected and direct fuel injected. The F250 has an oil sump and it's also fuel injected. Prop performance would be similar since the increased rpm of the F225 is made up with a higher gear ratio. <br />Because of proven success and reliability, and the better warranty, I'd go with the F225.
