Water on all three cylinders on port side?

danielvdh

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May 24, 2017
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Hey all, I'm new to this forum, although not altogether new to it's contents... I have a 1995 Mercruiser 4.3lx 4bbl v6 I/O. I've had it out three times this year, only to come home and find milky oil on the dipstick.

I pulled all the spark plugs and did a compression test. On the starboard side I had roughly 150 psi to all cylinders. The spark plugs looked as they should. On the port side I found water on all three plugs, with compression as follows, front to back: 175 (water sprayed out when I released the pressure), 120ish, 145ish. All three cylinders had some amount of water in them, with the most in cylinder 1.

I tore it down and replaced the head gasket, both intake gaskets and manifold gaskets. After changing the oil twice, I still have slightly milky oil, this has cleared up a bit with the engine running about 1000 rpm in the driveway on muffs. However when I turn off the engine and quickly drain the cooling system, then remove the spark plugs, they are wet and the cylinders have water in them. I suspect the milky oil originated from water leaking past the rings, as when I drain the system and pump the water out of the cylinders I don't notice an increase in the milkiness of the oil. Compression now is 1: 150,3: 150,5: 120(rapidly leaking to 0). inside the exhaust ports of the manifold I see a layer of milky oil/fuel dimpled with water droplets.

When I changed the head gasket I couldn't really see any signs of water leaking into the cylinders. The intake gaskets both had some breakdown near the cooling ducts, but given their lack of proximity to the intake I doubt this is where water was entering the cylinders. I've been working on this for two days, and I have exhausted every forum and post I can find that even resembles some of these symptoms. I cannot fathom how so much water can be found in the cylinders immediately after the engine was running (albeit a tad rough). Could a cracked head be spraying water into three cylinders at once? and what could have triggered the sudden change in compression to cylinder 5? As things are, the engine is hard starting, but runs quite well warm, I'm tempted to go ahead and use the boat regardless of these issues, and carefully ensuring the cooling system is drained and cylinders dry after each use.... Thanks for your help!
 

Scott Danforth

Grumpy Vintage Moderator still playing with boats
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Or in addition to Bruce's suggestion.... cracked head.
 

danielvdh

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May 24, 2017
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Bruce the manifold is in fairly new condition relative to the rest of the engine, therefore broken in and determined not to be a manufacturer defect, nor a result of corrosion. Riser gasket is brand new today.

@ Scott what's the likelihood of a cracked head putting water in all three? I would expect then 1 or two correct?
 

danielvdh

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May 24, 2017
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It had been a saltwater boat before I purchased it, now freshwater. I'm not certain of the age of the manifold, It does obviously have some rust inside the cooling channels, but almost no corrosion or visible damage from that. I'd like to go ahead and try to do a leak/pressure test as I believe Don pointed out on a sticky.
 

bruceb58

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It had been a saltwater boat before I purchased it, now freshwater. I'm not certain of the age of the manifold, It does obviously have some rust inside the cooling channels, but almost no corrosion or visible damage from that. I'd like to go ahead and try to do a leak/pressure test as I believe Don pointed out on a sticky.
You can not tell by looking onto an exhaust manifold if it is good or not. Pressure test it to be sure. You can also do an acetone test.

Are you located in a place that gets freezing temps? If so and the manifold wasn't drained before winter, you could have cracks that is letting the water in.
 

danielvdh

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May 24, 2017
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You can not tell by looking onto an exhaust manifold if it is good or not. Pressure test it to be sure. You can also do an acetone test.

Are you located in a place that gets freezing temps? If so and the manifold wasn't drained before winter, you could have cracks that is letting the water in.

Thanks for your help bruce, I have the acetone in the manifold right now, the levels are holding. What are the odds that the riser is cracked or leaking? should I also reinstall the riser and add more acetone?

We do get some freezing in the wintertime, however the boat was last winterized by a marina before it sat for a few years, after which it was purchased by myself. (it was the family boat of the owners of the marina, and maintained by the professionals in their service dept. Their family outgrew the ski boat and moved on, and so the boat sat)
 

danielvdh

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May 24, 2017
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Update: I've reattached the riser manifold and added more acetone till a little came out of the water outflow by the elbow. So far levels have been holding for about 30 minutes
 

bruceb58

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It could have been your riser/manifold connection before. How did it look when you took them apart. Can you take a picture of that surfaces of both the manifold and the riser at some point. You do need to always put a new riser gasket on when you put these together, Also, need to make sure the surfaces are flat.
 

danielvdh

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May 24, 2017
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It could have been your riser/manifold connection before. How did it look when you took them apart. Can you take a picture of that surfaces of both the manifold and the riser at some point. You do need to always put a new riser gasket on when you put these together, Also, need to make sure the surfaces are flat.

The surfaces looked like any other mating surface really, I removed the old gasket material with a razor scraper and wiped it with brake cleaner before applying the new gasket with a bit of perfect seal. This time I simply reattached the riser (of course the gasket peeled apart at the stainless steel layer) and added the extra acetone as mentioned previously. I left that acetone in for well over an hour with absolutely no change in the level..

I did not check if the surfaces were flat, though there's not much surface to warp nor any cause for it to do so. At this point I'm feeling as though the manifold and riser can be ruled out, but I'm still stumped by the three cylinders more or less ruling out the head. as far as I can tell, given the history of the boat there's no cause for the head to have cracked (nor did I see any signs of a crack when I had it off). Of course visual inspection as we know can be very decieving. I'm also 99.9% certain that the boat hasn't overheated, at least not in the 3 times I've had it out this year. I've only put maybe 5 hours on the boat myself, and perhaps 20 minutes of that at WOT, mostly just puttered around at say 15-20 km/h..

On a side note, as I mentioned in my original post, I had the boat running on the muffs and the milky oil had cleared up considerably. This morning I went out and checked the oil and it had more or less returned to it's previous shade, with clean oil streaked on the dipstick as well.
 

bruceb58

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There have been cases noted in this forum where certain after market manifolds and risers did not have flat surfaces and needed to be machined flat. I assume when you mount the risers you tighten the bolts evenly with a torque wrench to specs right?
 

QBhoy

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Surely the riser gasket ?
If aftermarket riser to exhaust mating or even old oem to new oem...there have been problems with mating the surfaces. I'm afraid it's sometimes a tiresome off and on job with gradual and uniform bolt tightening to get it right !
Two gaskets might even help...although I may get crucified for saying this šŸ™ˆ
 

QBhoy

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Just noticed Bruce has said the above too. Pretty sure this is the problem though...
 

danielvdh

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May 24, 2017
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I get what you're saying, the symptoms seem to fit perfectly as far as I can understand.. is it possible the gasket would pass the acetone test and still fail under the slight water pressure it would experience right at the end of the cooling system? I must confess I have not torqued those bolts, just been giving them about 4 passes with my 3/8 drive ratchet.. maybe tomorrow I will consider buying another gasket and checking the mating surfaces and torquing it to specs... I hope to goodness you all are right about this. They are mercruiser manifolds, although I have read they have a history of occasionally failing even brand new..
 

wahlejim

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One other thing to double check, hose clamps after the riser. Make sure those are all tight.
 
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